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Started By
Message
My thoughts on the Offense and Defense
Posted on 9/24/14 at 7:03 pm
Posted on 9/24/14 at 7:03 pm
Let's start with offense. I'm tired of all the bashing of CLM and CCC. They're two of the most talented coaches in their respected fields in all of college football. CLM has one of the highest win percentages in the SEC. He's obviously doing something right.
Let's look at the years where LSU has been the most successful.
2007: LSU was number 9 in the country and number 1 in the SEC in total offensive yards with 3154 yards passing and 2998 rushing yards for a total of 6152. Pretty electric right? What did that do for the defense? Allowed for.. number 9 in the country and second in the SEC with 3690 total yards.
2011: We take a step back with an electric offense but become more efficient until later in the second half of the season. We only ranked 57th with 4971 total yards but the defense was ranked 5th in the nation with only 3661 yards given up. Electric defense. But we ranked number 1 in the turnover margin. Our offense played within the confines of themselves and the defense created opportunities for the offense.
Start difference. But you can see how both sides of the ball benefit from having a dominant side of the football. Either the offense is dominant and allows for the defense to strive or the defense is dominant and sets up the offensive production.
2013: Last year we a had a top 15 ranked defense. There were several blown assignments that resulted in the loss of games (UGA) or a bad showing (OM - ZM 3 INT). You cancel that out then we're 11-1 going into the SEC championship game. Offensively we ranked 33rd with a 3000 yard passer, two 1000 yard receivers, and a runningback over 1000 yards. First time in the SEC. BUT ALL of the production has left. Including the the majority of the defense since the 2011 season.
Enough with statistics. This year we see that offensively we have regressed back to the 2008, 2009, 2010 offense. Most of this has to do with quarterback production. I'm not advocating any particular quarterback (GO KRAGTHORPE... ) Anyway. One of the major things to look back at those past successful offensive years is the balance that was able to be achieved. Those weren't all just run heavy teams or pass heavy teams. There was a balance that allowed both to succeed.
This year we see the lack of a passing game. We cannot complete slant routes. We cannot complete flat routes. Most of our numbers come from busted defensive plays. It doesn't matter if you run a spread offense or a pro-style I formation. If you can't complete a simple pass then the running game has all the pressure. Something to think about.. After the dominance our offense showed last year, the regression our offense has showed this year doesn't result from CLM calling the plays but the lack of confidence that CLM and CCC have in our quarterbacks. They know better than we do their capabilities, AND if they are unwilling to throw the ball when necessary, it isn't because they want to, it's because they simply cannot do it. That became evident when I watched AJ fail to complete simple passes to wide open receivers against Moo St.
Onto defense. Our corners are the best in the entire country. Hands down. But they simply cannot be asked to cover for eternity because the front 7 cannot put enough pressure on the QB. I attribute this not to lack of recruiting but lack of experience and bodies. We've been gouged on the front seven over the last 5 years. Look at the NFL draft. We're doing the best we can. Now the MLB spot is the most key position of the entire defense. I feel like this is the same dilemma that we are seeing in the offense. The lack of production coming from the front 7 will hurt any defense.
An offense cannot strive without a competent defense. A defense cannot strive without a competent offense.
And most importantly, does anyone remember hearing CCC yell at the QBs and Wrs in the video saying that we would run a 1950s offense if we can't complete a simple slant route? It's pretty telling. This team can still succeed. It requires players to step up and fulfill the potential to which they were recruited at.
/rant
Let's look at the years where LSU has been the most successful.
2007: LSU was number 9 in the country and number 1 in the SEC in total offensive yards with 3154 yards passing and 2998 rushing yards for a total of 6152. Pretty electric right? What did that do for the defense? Allowed for.. number 9 in the country and second in the SEC with 3690 total yards.
2011: We take a step back with an electric offense but become more efficient until later in the second half of the season. We only ranked 57th with 4971 total yards but the defense was ranked 5th in the nation with only 3661 yards given up. Electric defense. But we ranked number 1 in the turnover margin. Our offense played within the confines of themselves and the defense created opportunities for the offense.
Start difference. But you can see how both sides of the ball benefit from having a dominant side of the football. Either the offense is dominant and allows for the defense to strive or the defense is dominant and sets up the offensive production.
2013: Last year we a had a top 15 ranked defense. There were several blown assignments that resulted in the loss of games (UGA) or a bad showing (OM - ZM 3 INT). You cancel that out then we're 11-1 going into the SEC championship game. Offensively we ranked 33rd with a 3000 yard passer, two 1000 yard receivers, and a runningback over 1000 yards. First time in the SEC. BUT ALL of the production has left. Including the the majority of the defense since the 2011 season.
Enough with statistics. This year we see that offensively we have regressed back to the 2008, 2009, 2010 offense. Most of this has to do with quarterback production. I'm not advocating any particular quarterback (GO KRAGTHORPE... ) Anyway. One of the major things to look back at those past successful offensive years is the balance that was able to be achieved. Those weren't all just run heavy teams or pass heavy teams. There was a balance that allowed both to succeed.
This year we see the lack of a passing game. We cannot complete slant routes. We cannot complete flat routes. Most of our numbers come from busted defensive plays. It doesn't matter if you run a spread offense or a pro-style I formation. If you can't complete a simple pass then the running game has all the pressure. Something to think about.. After the dominance our offense showed last year, the regression our offense has showed this year doesn't result from CLM calling the plays but the lack of confidence that CLM and CCC have in our quarterbacks. They know better than we do their capabilities, AND if they are unwilling to throw the ball when necessary, it isn't because they want to, it's because they simply cannot do it. That became evident when I watched AJ fail to complete simple passes to wide open receivers against Moo St.
Onto defense. Our corners are the best in the entire country. Hands down. But they simply cannot be asked to cover for eternity because the front 7 cannot put enough pressure on the QB. I attribute this not to lack of recruiting but lack of experience and bodies. We've been gouged on the front seven over the last 5 years. Look at the NFL draft. We're doing the best we can. Now the MLB spot is the most key position of the entire defense. I feel like this is the same dilemma that we are seeing in the offense. The lack of production coming from the front 7 will hurt any defense.
An offense cannot strive without a competent defense. A defense cannot strive without a competent offense.
And most importantly, does anyone remember hearing CCC yell at the QBs and Wrs in the video saying that we would run a 1950s offense if we can't complete a simple slant route? It's pretty telling. This team can still succeed. It requires players to step up and fulfill the potential to which they were recruited at.
/rant
This post was edited on 9/25/14 at 1:52 pm
Posted on 9/24/14 at 8:26 pm to USARMYDasher
I didn't read all that poo, but it really boils down to, can we block on O and can we get off blocks on D and make the tackle! Our O line is not very talented and neither is the D line and Welker at LB is not very talented! It's that easy! I don't give a shizter who is at QB or what fricken plays they call on O if you can't block it doesn't matter! We will be 6-6 or 7-5 at the end of the season unless O-line and D-line play improves most ricky-tic!
Posted on 9/24/14 at 9:19 pm to demtigers73
Fairly certain it doesn't matter if you have an All-SEC line if you're not balanced on offense. And thanks for referring to my diagnosis as poo. Better than some things I've heard
Posted on 9/24/14 at 9:22 pm to USARMYDasher
quote:
I'm tired of all the bashing of CLM
Legitimate criticism of his failure this past week is now considered "bashing"?
you people are off the deep end.
quote:
This year we see the lack of a passing game. We cannot complete slant routes. We cannot complete flat routes. Most of our numbers come from busted defensive plays. It doesn't matter if you run a spread offense or a pro-style I formation. If you can't complete a simple pass then the running game has all the pressure. Something to think about.. After the dominance our offense showed last year, the regression our offense has showed this year doesn't result from CLM calling the plays but the lack of confidence that CLM and CCC have in our quarterbacks. They know better than we do their capabilities, AND if they are unwilling to throw the ball when necessary, it isn't because they want to, it's because they simply cannot do it. That became evident when I watched AJ fail to complete simple passes to wide open receivers against Moo St.
WHose fault do you think this is?
1) Either Les Miles cant coach them to execute properly.
2) Les Miles recruits kids that are unable to execute.
Those are the options.
Posted on 9/24/14 at 9:27 pm to CptBengal
quote:
you people
You people? You people?!
I'm kidding. I'll give CLM that he's had serious issues recruiting QBs in the past. But that was prior CCC. This is a new era. You cannot blame the entire loss on CLM. When any other team loses they don't blame just the coach. They blame the reason for the loss. I blame this loss on the quarterback. I accept that CLM recruited AJ, but it doesn't make it his sole problem. AJ was a highly recruited QB. He has underdeveloped at the time. If CCC is here in about 3-4 years, you're more than welcome to argue recruiting offensively with me.
Posted on 9/24/14 at 9:28 pm to USARMYDasher
Line sucks. Should stop trying to overpower teams and use some finesse (spread the fricking defense)
Defense can't bail a terrible offense out this year.
I am going to give the defense a pass since they have traditionally been good. If our coaches continue running into 8 man boxes (blaming execution) it is going to be a long year.
Defense can't bail a terrible offense out this year.
I am going to give the defense a pass since they have traditionally been good. If our coaches continue running into 8 man boxes (blaming execution) it is going to be a long year.
Posted on 9/24/14 at 9:30 pm to Topwater Trout
How can you spread the defense if a quarterback can't make a simple slant pattern?
Posted on 9/24/14 at 9:36 pm to USARMYDasher
Seriously? 3 and 4 wr sets spread defenses out. Did you watch the last 20 minutes of the Wisconsin game? Care to tell me what formation we actually ran on Wisconsin with?
ETA- slant patterns do not spread out defenses
ETA- slant patterns do not spread out defenses
This post was edited on 9/24/14 at 9:41 pm
Posted on 9/24/14 at 9:38 pm to USARMYDasher
You know what im tired of? Im tired of people defending a coach that makes well over 4mill a year to do a job and be successful at it. I understand no one could win them all but Miles never changes anything. How many good offenses has he had at LSU? We see the smae plays every single season over and over again. Five oc in ten years
Posted on 9/24/14 at 9:43 pm to Topwater Trout
quote:
ETA- slant patterns do not spread out defenses
I also watched out quarterback throw passes at wide open receivers' feet. So it doesn't matter if you have five receivers or one if you cannot throw a simple pass. I used the slant as a example because it's the simplest of passes. If you want to get into Curl, Mesh, Flat, Out, and Cut patterns we can. Oh wait. We can't complete those patterns either.
Posted on 9/24/14 at 9:45 pm to thanksjhester
quote:
Im tired of people defending a coach that makes well over 4mill a year to do a job and be successful at it.
But but but... He's like the most successful coach in the SEC and the country.
Posted on 9/24/14 at 10:11 pm to USARMYDasher
We will not pass but we will run so we should spread the formations and make the defense defend the formation ...and still run.
State did that to us all night
State did that to us all night
Posted on 9/25/14 at 1:04 am to demtigers73
quote:
I didn't read all that poo, but it really boils down to, can we block on O and can we get off blocks on D and make the tackle! Our O line is not very talented and neither is the D line and Welker at LB is not very talented! It's that easy! I don't give a shizter who is at QB or what fricken plays they call on O if you can't block it doesn't matter! We will be 6-6 or 7-5 at the end of the season unless O-line and D-line play improves most ricky-tic!
We implemented a new blocking scheme, with new and young WRs and QBs. We then rotate RBs behind that craptastical OL without any rhyme or reason. It's one of the main reasons why we need to go spread with one or two RBs getting nearly all the carries. Rely on quick passes, and run with four WRs on the field. We can all do read and speed option with Harris and Fournette.
We don't have the defense for a slow pace offense or a three and out offense.
Posted on 9/25/14 at 1:08 am to USARMYDasher
quote:
also watched out quarterback throw passes at wide open receivers' feet. So it doesn't matter if you have five receivers or one if you cannot throw a simple pass. I used the slant as a example because it's the simplest of passes. If you want to get into Curl, Mesh, Flat, Out, and Cut patterns we can. Oh wait. We can't complete those patterns either.
So far, we've seen that one can't. How about giving the other a shot?
Posted on 9/25/14 at 2:11 am to thanksjhester
quote:That's the Modus Operandi of all the professional Sunshine Pumpers. That's what they do.
You know what im tired of? Im tired of people defending a coach that makes well over 4mill a year to do a job and be successful at it. I understand no one could win them all but Miles never changes anything.
They're as resistant as Ebola and Cock Roaches.
They were active back in the day too before the internet was a reality. We distinctly remember them calling all the radio sports talk shows and defending to the death both Mike Archer AND Curley Hallman. (Yes, they defended Hudson, just like they're doing with Miles now)
Doesn't matter who the coach is or how bad things get either. The goofy little nuts have their repetitive litany of excuses for failure down pat. Their schtick has grown old and worn out.
Posted on 9/25/14 at 3:32 am to USARMYDasher
Why in the hell did we not pass on first down during the first seven offensive series? Part of the game plan on offense should consist of breaking tendencies which the LSU offense rarely attempts.
Posted on 9/25/14 at 5:59 am to Datbayoubengal
quote:
So far, we've seen that one can't. How about giving the other a shot?
I'm completely open to this suggestion. So far.. I don't think anyone else is grasping this concept that the quarterback we currently possess as a starter is unable to make these spread throws that everyone keeps clamming for.
Posted on 9/25/14 at 6:21 am to dreamer
quote:
Why in the hell did we not pass on first down during the first seven offensive series? Part of the game plan on offense should consist of breaking tendencies which the LSU offense rarely attempts.
Which is partly why our quarterbacks, including Mett his first year, have a hard time finding a rhythm. AJ has made some impressive throws this season, he just doesn't get the opportunity all that often when the defense isn't expecting it.
Posted on 9/25/14 at 8:27 am to Topwater Trout
quote:
Seriously? 3 and 4 wr sets spread defenses out. Did you watch the last 20 minutes of the Wisconsin game? Care to tell me what formation we actually ran on Wisconsin with?
Typical fan ignorance. It doesn't matter if you run two TEs and one WR or 5 WRs, the defense still has the option to overload the box. Wisconsin made a coaching mistake when we went three wide. They unloaded the box and paid the price when LSU ran on them. But that is a choice Wisconsin made; we didn't spread them, they spread themselves. They didn't have to, and they shouldn't have.
Mississippi State chose to load the box when we went three wide. They dared us to beat them with the pass. Our coaches intelligently took what was offered. We ran some great plays that were wide open, but the QB missed.
In short, the scheme was good Saturday night, but the execution was poor. It has to be tough on those coaches to hear idiot fans saying that our schemes are stupid.
Posted on 9/25/14 at 11:54 am to USARMYDasher
quote:
I'm completely open to this suggestion. So far.. I don't think anyone else is grasping this concept that the quarterback we currently possess as a starter is unable to make these spread throws that everyone keeps clamming for.
I'm ok with easing him in the next couple of games. I think he starts against Kentucky after him and Jennings play through the next 3 games.
Right now, we have a Jeff Driskel at QB, and Driskel sucks. Skipping passes, throwing passes too high, not seeing open receivers. I'm not saying that Jennings can't get better, but this is the problem he had dating back to the Iowa game.
Right now I just hope they both improve.
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