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Which of the following points do you disagree with?

Posted on 4/6/26 at 8:42 am
Posted by deuceiswild
South La
Member since Nov 2007
4774 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 8:42 am

• Iran has/had a strong desire to obtain a nuclear weapon, and to use it, if acquired.

• Iran’s nuclear enrichment capability was destroyed last year, at least for the near future.

• The material Iran had already enriched may not have been destroyed, or it's buried.

• Iran will never stop trying to acquire nuclear weapons under the pre-war regime. Or under a like-minded regime.

• Iran had been rapidly building up its conventional weapons arsenal to protect their ability to enrich uranium and create nuclear weapons

• Iran, at some point soon, would have had a large enough arsenal of conventional weapons to prevent anyone from stopping them from rebuilding their nuclear enrichment capabilities.

• Israel was going to bomb Iran with or without us.

• If we didn’t participate, our bases in the ME would have been hit, and therefore, we’d still be heavily involved.

• Iran does not need the ability to strike the US mainland with any weapon to cause great harm to the US.


I believe them all. Personally, the one about Israels desire to bomb Iran with or without the U.S. involvement give me some pause. But I am willing to believe it because it makes sense to me. I am not certain if there's more we could have done to prevent that, if it's true. And even if we could have prevented them from doing it, would it have mattered in the end? This war was seemingly going to happen one way or another. The only question is when?

If you agree with all of these, then there's no other option but to support the military action we are taking. That said, playing armchair QB when it's all said and done is also fair. And I suspect that just about all of us will be proven right on many things, and wrong on others.
Posted by Centinel
Idaho
Member since Sep 2016
45482 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 8:44 am to
quote:

Israel


You can just stop here for the majority of the people you're addressing.
Posted by idlewatcher
Planet Arium
Member since Jan 2012
96184 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 8:45 am to
Iran can never be trusted. They had their opportunity with the IAEA inspector gadgets yet failed to live up to their end of the bargain.

They know it.
We know it.
The world knows it.

Iran cannot be trusted.
Posted by thelawnwranglers
Member since Sep 2007
42258 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 8:45 am to
quote:

Iran, at some point soon, would have had a large enough arsenal of conventional weapons to prevent anyone from stopping them from rebuilding their nuclear enrichment capabilities.


Don't know enough to say yes or no - but not sure this has changed much for them either way
This post was edited on 4/6/26 at 8:49 am
Posted by Powerman
Member since Jan 2004
172991 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 8:45 am to
Looks like your bat signal to immediately white knight for another country went off quick this time

You're such a hero

Might as well change your avatar to Ben Shapiro at this point
Posted by Centinel
Idaho
Member since Sep 2016
45482 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 8:47 am to
Like I said OP, you can just stop at Israel.

See: the very first reply to me. They can't help themselves.
This post was edited on 4/6/26 at 8:49 am
Posted by Powerman
Member since Jan 2004
172991 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 8:49 am to
quote:


See: the very first reply to me.

Because you're a joke of a person that worships Israel before your own country and can immediately get fricked.
Posted by RohanGonzales
Pronoun: Whatever
Member since Apr 2024
9988 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 8:50 am to
quote:


Looks like your bat signal to immediately white knight for another country went off quick this time


You white knighted for IRAN within the last 15 minutes in another thread. You even gave them strategy tips like they were capable of reasonable thought.
Posted by aubie101
Russia
Member since Nov 2010
3842 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 8:50 am to
I reject all of it.... They were no direct threat to us... Maybe Israel, but I DO NOT CARE. Israel can do what they want. They are a horrible ally.
Posted by Powerman
Member since Jan 2004
172991 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 8:52 am to
quote:

You white knighted for IRAN

Feel free to provide evidence of such a ridiculous claim
Posted by thermal9221
Youngsville
Member since Feb 2005
15009 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 8:52 am to
quote:

and to use it, if acquired


You believe this?
Are you retarded?
Posted by Powerman
Member since Jan 2004
172991 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 8:54 am to
quote:

I reject all of it.... They were no direct threat to us...

Agreed

But they were a threat to some of our economic interests and that can't be completely ignored

The problem is...we initiated the war and forced the issue on them being a threat to our economic interests. It's their method of warfare. They wouldn't be doing these things in a time of peace.
Posted by Powerman
Member since Jan 2004
172991 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 8:55 am to
quote:



You believe this?
Are you retarded?

The entire backing of this operation relies on people to be retarded and believe this
Posted by deuceiswild
South La
Member since Nov 2007
4774 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 8:55 am to
quote:

Don't know enough to say yes or no - but not sure this has changed much for them either way


Fair. None of us "know" for sure. I am willing to believe it because I haven't heard anyone credible denying this point. And I think it stands to reason that the bigger arsenal they have, the more difficult it would be to take action against them.

IMO, a debate is better with at least a few things that everyone, or most people, can agree on. A basic premise. Then the debate begins where ideas start to diverge.
Posted by tide06
Member since Oct 2011
22653 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 8:57 am to
quote:

Iran has/had a strong desire to obtain a nuclear weapon, and to use it, if acquired.

I believe they want one and will continue to attempt to acquire one absent regime change, I don’t believe they’ll actually use one absent a future war with Israel.
quote:

Iran’s nuclear enrichment capability was destroyed last year, at least for the near future. • The material Iran had already enriched may not have been destroyed, or it's buried.

I don’t have enough information to say what is or isn’t true with this.
quote:

Iran had been rapidly building up its conventional weapons arsenal to protect their ability to enrich uranium and create nuclear weapons

Not meaningfully with regard to the US military
quote:

Israel was going to bomb Iran with or without us.

Probably… why is that our problem?
quote:

we didn’t participate, our bases in the ME would have been hit, and therefore, we’d still be heavily involved.

*IF* after putting our assets on full alert that took place I would then decide how best to proceed to advance AMERICAN interests in the area
quote:

Iran does not need the ability to strike the US mainland with any weapon to cause great harm to the US.

Disagree with regard to domestic American concerns, that’s accurate with regard to American assets placed in the ME but they can’t project power beyond the region
quote:

If you agree with all of these, then there's no other option but to support the military action we are taking.

Nope. At most we could’ve hit them with air and missile strikes, armed some insurgents and evaluated again down the road. No need to consider ground troops or anything beyond what was done last year because it’s unnecessary to our critical interests domestically or internationally.
Posted by deuceiswild
South La
Member since Nov 2007
4774 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 8:58 am to
quote:

I reject all of it.... They were no direct threat to us...


I agree they were not a direct military threat....if we are going to discount the number of Americans they've already killed over the decades. And their desire to continue doing so.

But there are other types of threats. The aggregate and chronic effects of those other types of threats are pretty serious.
Posted by aubie101
Russia
Member since Nov 2010
3842 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 8:58 am to
quote:

Agreed

But they were a threat to some of our economic interests and that can't be completely ignored

The problem is...we initiated the war and forced the issue on them being a threat to our economic interests. It's their method of warfare. They wouldn't be doing these things in a time of peace.


Economically yes, but we have seen how engaging in this adventure has insured that pain to be felt....

Sidenote--I can't believe Trump did this move. The midterms are coming and he has to know he screwed himself. But the dude refuses to admit mistakes.
Posted by Centinel
Idaho
Member since Sep 2016
45482 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 9:00 am to
quote:

They wouldn't be doing these things in a time of peace.


Correct. They'd have other pursuits.





Posted by deuceiswild
South La
Member since Nov 2007
4774 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 9:02 am to
quote:

You believe this?
Are you retarded?


I do believe it. And I am not retarded.

They've stated this desire out loud. While I do realize we're talking about Iran here, generally world leaders don't make such bold claims without being prepared to back them up, else they lose credibility, and therefore, power. It should be taken seriously.

The MAD theory is something to consider for sure. Do you trust that Israel would not retaliate with nukes if Iran struck first? I don't know. Maybe they wouldn't. But I don't fully trust them not to.

Why do you not believe it?
Posted by wdhalgren
Member since May 2013
5030 posts
Posted on 4/6/26 at 9:03 am to
Very nice synopsis of the costs of doing nothing, which have been studiously ignored by US legacy media.
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