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Gothic Serpent vs. Absolute Resolve a comparison
Posted on 1/5/26 at 8:38 am
Posted on 1/5/26 at 8:38 am
The only difference between these two operations is leadership yet the outcome is so much different.
The same units, the same basic gear, and the same basic training yet the outcomes are completely different.
Why? Leadership at the top. When Clinton tasked the same units (even the same damn company from the 160th) the main feedback provided was a daylight raid was a bad idea and we need more force than what you’re saying.
Clinton turned it all down and made the operation go, Irene went out and most people know what happened.
Absolute resolve started as a “how do we do this” and those in charge listened to the war fighters and provided pretty much everything that was asked for.
Two very similar missions with two completely different outcomes.
The same units, the same basic gear, and the same basic training yet the outcomes are completely different.
Why? Leadership at the top. When Clinton tasked the same units (even the same damn company from the 160th) the main feedback provided was a daylight raid was a bad idea and we need more force than what you’re saying.
Clinton turned it all down and made the operation go, Irene went out and most people know what happened.
Absolute resolve started as a “how do we do this” and those in charge listened to the war fighters and provided pretty much everything that was asked for.
Two very similar missions with two completely different outcomes.
5
Posted on 1/5/26 at 8:40 am to Mid Iowa Tiger
Pretty much.
Posted on 1/5/26 at 8:42 am to Mid Iowa Tiger
quote:
The only difference between these two operations is leadership yet the outcome is so much different.
That and 30+ years of learning, specifically from failures like Gothic Serpent
Posted on 1/5/26 at 9:27 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
That and 30+ years of learning, specifically from failures like Gothic Serpent
Funny that you think we needed 30+ years to learn that nightime is the best time.
Hell raiders in the 6th century knew that, but sure....say we needed 30+ years.
Posted on 1/5/26 at 9:41 am to Mid Iowa Tiger
You mean a morally bankrupt huckster like Slick who famously stated that he "loathed the military" wouldn't take their advice and intentionally put the soldiers in harm's way? Nooooooooo.
But, hey, he bit his lower lip and liberal white women thought he was compassionate.
But, hey, he bit his lower lip and liberal white women thought he was compassionate.
Posted on 1/5/26 at 9:42 am to UtahCajun
quote:
Funny that you think we needed 30+ years to learn that nightime is the best time.
Posted on 1/5/26 at 9:44 am to Mid Iowa Tiger
The biggest reason Gothic Serpent failed was a lack of LAV’s. Again, denied by Clinton/Aspin.
Posted on 1/5/26 at 9:58 am to Godfather1
quote:
The biggest reason Gothic Serpent failed was a lack of LAV’s.
I have never understood the opposition to armored vehicles that is so popular with the Left. An armored vehicle is DEFENSIVE in nature. It keeps people from getting hurt. Nothing about armor is offensive. Yet the Left loses their mind when local police get an armored vehicle. It's not hurting anyone driving around and keeping the occupants from getting shot. What is the issue?
Posted on 1/5/26 at 10:02 am to jbgleason
quote:
An armored vehicle is DEFENSIVE in nature.
Yes the armored cav is entirely defensive in nature and definitely isn’t designed to project force rapidly.
Come on you can come up with better arguments for bullet proof police cruisers than this…
Posted on 1/5/26 at 10:31 am to SlowFlowPro
Stick to chasing ambulances. You are mid at that. Low to everything else.
Posted on 1/5/26 at 12:00 pm to Godfather1
quote:
The biggest reason Gothic Serpent failed was a lack of LAV’s. Again, denied by Clinton/Aspin.
The biggest reason was they were asked to operate in the daytime in a crowded area without the proper complimentary assets.
Posted on 1/5/26 at 12:38 pm to jbgleason
quote:
Yet the Left loses their mind when local police get an armored vehicle. It's not hurting anyone driving around and keeping the occupants from getting shot. What is the issue?
Hell, you have tons of mouth-breathing edge lords on here. "Muh militarization of the police!"
Posted on 1/5/26 at 5:55 pm to Mid Iowa Tiger
quote:
The biggest reason was they were asked to operate in the daytime in a crowded area without the proper complimentary assets.
Yeah. Like light armor.
The mere presence of 4 LAV’s would’ve been sufficient to send the Mog marketplace scattering. Supported by the 4 Ranger air assault chalks, Delta could’ve gone in, extracted the target and been out on schedule.
Posted on 1/6/26 at 3:05 pm to tide06
quote:
Yes the armored cav is entirely defensive in nature and definitely isn’t designed to project force rapidly.
Right. The ARMORED VEHICLES and not the cannons and rocket launcher s are what make armored cav offensive.
We were discussing ARMORED VEHICLES here.
Posted on 1/6/26 at 3:25 pm to jbgleason
An armored vehicle containing people who carry arms is still projecting force.
Posted on 1/6/26 at 3:30 pm to Mid Iowa Tiger
No useful input on SOF strategy/tactics from me
Perhaps it's pure bias...but I suspect our ability to foster reliable and accurate intelligence assets in Venezuela was a major reason this op was so clean. Contrast that with our noted difficulties elsewhere in recent decades.
Perhaps it's pure bias...but I suspect our ability to foster reliable and accurate intelligence assets in Venezuela was a major reason this op was so clean. Contrast that with our noted difficulties elsewhere in recent decades.
Posted on 1/6/26 at 4:04 pm to Pettifogger
quote:
our ability to foster reliable and accurate intelligence assets in Venezuela was a major reason this op was so clean.
Intel was pretty good for GS and in fact most of the time we were there.
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