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A disturbing trend with our defense
Posted on 12/19/08 at 12:22 pm
Posted on 12/19/08 at 12:22 pm
This even occurred last year under the national championship team. Does anyone else notice how teams just march right down our throats on their opening drives of the game.
Its gotten to the point where I'll just be happy if we hold a team to 3 on their opening drive.
I might be off on some of these, but over the last 2 years off the top of my head these teams either scored a td or a fg on their opening drive of the game on us. ( most of them were tds)
2007
Florida
Auburn
Tennessee
Ohio State
Alabama
2008
Florida
Troy
Arkansas
Ole Miss
Bama ( turned it over after they drove down inside our 10).
There might even be some more I forgot. Thats pretty pathetic anyway though. These were all against non cream puff teams too. Ive never seen a team let another team constantly move all over them on the opening drive so many times. I dont know if its coaching, or the players taking a while to get into the game or what, but it needs to get fixed ASAP.
Its gotten to the point where I'll just be happy if we hold a team to 3 on their opening drive.
I might be off on some of these, but over the last 2 years off the top of my head these teams either scored a td or a fg on their opening drive of the game on us. ( most of them were tds)
2007
Florida
Auburn
Tennessee
Ohio State
Alabama
2008
Florida
Troy
Arkansas
Ole Miss
Bama ( turned it over after they drove down inside our 10).
There might even be some more I forgot. Thats pretty pathetic anyway though. These were all against non cream puff teams too. Ive never seen a team let another team constantly move all over them on the opening drive so many times. I dont know if its coaching, or the players taking a while to get into the game or what, but it needs to get fixed ASAP.
This post was edited on 12/19/08 at 12:31 pm
7
Posted on 12/19/08 at 12:25 pm to am4titansandlsu
never really happened before, the D was terribly coached this year, no control whatsoever, guys just didn't care and it showed, the first time I saw that in awhile.
This post was edited on 12/19/08 at 12:26 pm
Posted on 12/19/08 at 12:29 pm to am4titansandlsu
quote:
These were all against no cream puffs too.
Revision note - this sentence makes no sense. If you mean that none of these teams that were driving on us were cream puffs, it goes against your argument. With the listing of teams, obviously you don't mean "These were all cream puffs." Just a helpful note. I am bad with grammar and punctuation, so consider the source.
Posted on 12/19/08 at 12:31 pm to Ace Midnight
quote:how so?
If you mean that none of these teams that were driving on us were cream puffs, it goes against your argument
Posted on 12/19/08 at 12:31 pm to tubucoco
quote:
never really happened before, the D was terribly coached this year, no control whatsoever, guys just didn't care and it showed, the first time I saw that in awhile.
it happened too many times last year as well
Posted on 12/19/08 at 12:33 pm to am4titansandlsu
not like the total breakdown of this year, they respected Pelini
Posted on 12/19/08 at 12:37 pm to am4titansandlsu
quote:
how so?
What are you trying to say by mentioning the teams were "not" cream puffs. How would that help your argument about how bad the defense was against those teams on their first drives.
And its very common for offenses to have most of their success early in games when quite often the first dozen or so plays are scripted. Then the adjustments come by the defense.
I can stomache the opposition catching us offguard to start a game much more so than if our defense struggled late.
Posted on 12/19/08 at 12:40 pm to HOUbengal
quote:
What are you trying to say by mentioning the teams were "not" cream puffs. How would that help your argument about how bad the defense was against those teams on their first drives.
I was using it to say there most likely would have been more examples of teams moving the ball with ease on us, but pretty much all the games it didnt happen were against terrible teams. Whenever we play a good team, they have pretty much ripped right through our defense on the opening drive.
Posted on 12/19/08 at 12:41 pm to am4titansandlsu
I've been disturbed by the slow starts it seems we've had the last few years, and esp. the sloppiness on sr. days the last 3 years.
Posted on 12/19/08 at 12:41 pm to am4titansandlsu
quote:
This even occurred last year under the national championship team
It started with the Arizona St game in 2005 and then on and off until the second half of the South Carolina game in 2007.
Since the S Car game last year, our defense has not been the defense of the old.
We need better defensive coaching, much better than what even Pelini had to offer.
Posted on 12/19/08 at 12:46 pm to siliconvalleytiger
I think Bo held it together, but I believe both the system and players are to blame. I believe some of the Sr. lost the fire after winning the title last season. Other schools have figured the Tigers defensive system out. Whoever, becomes the new coord. needs to bring in a new system.
Posted on 12/19/08 at 12:48 pm to siliconvalleytiger
quote:
Since the S Car game last year, our defense has not been the defense of the old.
We need better defensive coaching
I think this has been pretty well established, and coaching changes are being done.
I'd like to see LSU sign some elite LBs once in a while and learn how to slow down a spread offense.
Posted on 12/19/08 at 1:21 pm to am4titansandlsu
quote:
how so?
I don't know any other way of saying it - your argument is stronger if Cream Puffs are taking their opening drive and scoring. If you say that a bunch of teams are taking the opening drive and scoring, no cream puffs either... you see, it is more expected for a strong team to take their opening drive and score than a cream puff. It is more of a sign of weakness or a problem if the cream puffs are running all over you.
I'm sorry, this is as clear as a I can make it.
Posted on 12/19/08 at 2:59 pm to Ace Midnight
quote:
I don't know any other way of saying it - your argument is stronger if Cream Puffs are taking their opening drive and scoring. If you say that a bunch of teams are taking the opening drive and scoring, no cream puffs either... you see, it is more expected for a strong team to take their opening drive and score than a cream puff. It is more of a sign of weakness or a problem if the cream puffs are running all over you.
I'm sorry, this is as clear as a I can make it.
ok I see the angle you took it at. I was just using to show whenever we play a good team they go right down the field on us. It would be even more of a problem if teams like App state or North texas were doing it.
Posted on 12/19/08 at 3:09 pm to am4titansandlsu
I've noticed the slow starts the last couple of years as well, and they have bothered me. Fortunately, the Tigers have usually tightened up as games play out... maybe not so much this year.
I was actually thinking of starting a thread with a similar idea-- was going to ask the same question, but specifically with regards to if people thought the slow starts were indicative of game plans coming in or just discipline/attitude.
If game planning, would it suggest that the game plan is not so good at first, but that the coaches are good at making adjustments as the games go on (again, this year not so good as last).
If it is more on the players' level of discipline/attitude (starting without intensity), it would also seem ironic that as the game progresses, it usually brings out the best in LSU and and they claw their way back into games with a lot of determination and intensity.
I'd be curious to hear what people think.
I was actually thinking of starting a thread with a similar idea-- was going to ask the same question, but specifically with regards to if people thought the slow starts were indicative of game plans coming in or just discipline/attitude.
If game planning, would it suggest that the game plan is not so good at first, but that the coaches are good at making adjustments as the games go on (again, this year not so good as last).
If it is more on the players' level of discipline/attitude (starting without intensity), it would also seem ironic that as the game progresses, it usually brings out the best in LSU and and they claw their way back into games with a lot of determination and intensity.
I'd be curious to hear what people think.
Posted on 12/19/08 at 3:45 pm to epbart
quote:I think that for this to come out "off the top" of someone's head several weeks after regular season ended is improbable. I think someone has been flailing around looking for a new reason to bitch, and has instead happened on the same, retread crap that has been run to death here:
I'd be curious to hear what people think.
1) the defense this year was bad (obviously true)
2) the defense last year sucked (obviously the conclusion only a habitual bitcher could make with total disregard of the actual season)
Posted on 12/19/08 at 3:54 pm to King Joey
I think the disturbing trend is that people don't realize how close the line is between being in the top 3 in defense and being in the top 40. The difference can literally be one or two plays per game (see UGA, UF, Bama, etc). We had around 780 plays that our defense was on the field. So, you are talking about a difference of about 25-30 plays out of almost 800 over the course of an entire season that completely change the stats from year to year.
Now, don't get me wrong, we were pretty bad on D this year. But, I think people are forgetting that even under Saban, we had a few plays per game that had us scratching our heads. Heck, we lost several games on those crucial plays.
I think that we've completely inflated our view of our defense from recent years and in comparison, nothing will compete with that because it isn't real.
Were we good when we had Saban, yeah. But, we still only had a top 5 defense maybe 2 out of his 5 years?
Now, don't get me wrong, we were pretty bad on D this year. But, I think people are forgetting that even under Saban, we had a few plays per game that had us scratching our heads. Heck, we lost several games on those crucial plays.
I think that we've completely inflated our view of our defense from recent years and in comparison, nothing will compete with that because it isn't real.
Were we good when we had Saban, yeah. But, we still only had a top 5 defense maybe 2 out of his 5 years?
Posted on 12/19/08 at 4:41 pm to King Joey
quote:
I think someone has been flailing around looking for a new reason to bitch
Certainly not me. In fact, I point out that if we blame slow starts on the coaching staff for not planning well enough, then we have to give them credit for in game adjustments for the large number of times the team came back to win (again-- moreso last year).
And if you want to blame the motivation of the players for the slow starts, then it is ironic how much heart they've shown in the way they have consistently ratcheted up their intensity during games and come from behind to win. To show that kind of heart is commendable.
Again, it is easier to give a more positive spin to these things last year, when we were winning most of these games enroute the the BCSCG, but the trend of falling behind early definitely goes back to at least last year. Maybe the only difference between this year and last year is that last year the Tigers made their own luck with a lot of effort; this year maybe the odds just caught up with them. But both years have a lot of slow starts and falling behind early as a common factor.
Posted on 12/19/08 at 5:32 pm to hashtag
quote:
people don't realize how close the line is between being in the top 3 in defense and being in the top 40. The difference can literally be one or two plays per game
Agreed. The success of a team during a given game and over the course of the season really depends on so many little things. From the preparation going into the game by every coach and every player, to the attitudes, to the execution of all eleven players on all 60 or 70 or 80 plays-- that's a lot of moving parts. And 2 or 3 mistakes in a given game, next thing you know, the statistics look skewed. Add to that the snowball effect of accumulating mistakes that I'm sure bothered some players and arguably affected their performance, next thing you know a defense that should have been top 5, or at least top 10, falls further down the rankings.
Posted on 12/20/08 at 12:36 pm to epbart
quote:
Were we good when we had Saban, yeah. But, we still only had a top 5 defense maybe 2 out of his 5 years?
I'm an LSU fan not a Sabanite but it should be mentioned that the defense near the end of his time at LSU was great. IOW, it was trending upwards. '03 is without peer in the 21st Century and '04 wasn't shabby either.
This post was edited on 12/20/08 at 12:37 pm
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