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In what I consider to be a very positive development, halfway through the season...

Posted on 1/15/24 at 6:46 pm
Posted by Dinky Mulberry
Member since Aug 2021
2290 posts
Posted on 1/15/24 at 6:46 pm
---raise your hand if you had my man...Herb Jones...shooting 38.1% on 3s...after shooting 33.7% & 33.5% for his first two years. (The league average is 36.7%)

This guy is ONLY gonna get better & better.
Posted by Balsamic_duck
Member since Jun 2017
4356 posts
Posted on 1/15/24 at 6:55 pm to
Herb and BI attempt roughly the same amount of 3s. That’s wild.
Posted by Dinky Mulberry
Member since Aug 2021
2290 posts
Posted on 1/15/24 at 7:06 pm to
quote:

Herb and BI attempt roughly the same amount of 3s. That’s wild.


Wish I had an answer for BI's refusal to look for open 3s. Gotta be some kinda mental thing. I've only been here for 2 1/2 yrs now...but the numbers seem to say he was a very solid (& willing) 3-pt shooter his first coupla years in NO.

Maybe some of you guys that have been around longer than me, have the answer. On Herb, by playoff time, I expect Herb to be shooting about 10 shots per game with 5 of them being 3-pters. I'm not sure what to expect...out of BI.
Posted by Pistol44
New Orleans
Member since Jun 2019
2298 posts
Posted on 1/15/24 at 7:56 pm to
quote:

Wish I had an answer for BI's refusal to look for open 3s


Off game, but this is why a real PG could help the Pels. PG should be able to create shots from 3 off the dribble. Neither BI or Zion has that in their bag and thats a big reason for lack of spacing. Also, no one really can grow into the role because the ball is in their hands most of the time and limits their best abilities as finishers.
Posted by Balsamic_duck
Member since Jun 2017
4356 posts
Posted on 1/15/24 at 8:03 pm to
quote:

Off game, but this is why a real PG could help the Pels. PG should be able to create shots from 3 off the dribble. Neither BI or Zion has that in their bag and thats a big reason for lack of spacing. Also, no one really can grow into the role because the ball is in their hands most of the time and limits their best abilities as finishers.
CJ and Herb don’t have issues shooting 3s. Hell neither does JV, he’s towards the top of 3PAs for centers. It’s a BI problem and only a BI problem.
Posted by shel311
McKinney, Texas
Member since Aug 2004
112635 posts
Posted on 1/15/24 at 8:14 pm to
quote:

Off game, but this is why a real PG could help the Pels
A Zion centric offense accomplishes the same and does so better than likely any actual PG we could realistically get.

Also, I don't really buy the theory because other shooters are getting up 3s no problem, whether it's catch and shoot or off the dribble, so why does only BI need that?

Players ahead of BI in 3pt attempts per 36:

Trey
Hawkins
CJ
Ryan
Alvarado
Naji
Herb


If Alvarado/Naji/Herb are getting more 3s to than BI, then it's clearly just a BI issue.
Posted by TeddyPadillac
Member since Dec 2010
29817 posts
Posted on 1/15/24 at 8:15 pm to
BI 3 point shooting by type
2024
Catch and shoot 39% on 2.7 attempts per game.
Pull ups 29% on 1.1 attempts per game
2023
Catch and shoot 42% on 2.7
Pull ups 33% on 1.0
2022
Catch and shoot 36% on 3.2
Pull ups 21% on 0.9
2021
Catch and shoot 43% on 3.2
Pull ups 30% on 2.3


What you’ve seen is him take less pull up 3s, which is a good thing. We’ve also seen him be more of the PG on this team always initiating the offense, and we don’t want him shooting threes when he’s dribbling the ball. Hard to shoot more catch and shoot 3s if you always have the ball
You want more BI 3s then get a real PG or let Zion be the PG.
Posted by shel311
McKinney, Texas
Member since Aug 2004
112635 posts
Posted on 1/15/24 at 8:18 pm to
quote:

What you’ve seen is him take less pull up 3s, which is a good thing.
True but what your stats don't show is the amount of times BI passes up on a legit wide open 3 to take one step inside the 3pt line to shoot a contested 20 footer.
quote:

You want more BI 3s then get a real PG or let Zion be the PG
See the attempts per 36 I posted above. I truly don't think it would make a noticeable difference for BI but likely helps just about everyone else.

BI just doesn't shoot 3s, it is what it is.
Posted by supe12sta12z
Tiger Town
Member since Apr 2012
12940 posts
Posted on 1/15/24 at 8:19 pm to
Much rather him pull up than a iso middy off 3 defenders.

Posted by Pistol44
New Orleans
Member since Jun 2019
2298 posts
Posted on 1/15/24 at 8:20 pm to
quote:

It’s a BI problem and only a BI problem


BI doesn’t take pull up 3s, he’ll spot up or take them occasionally in transition. Zion doesnt take them at all. Crazy that they both often operate with the ball behind the top of the key though.
Posted by shel311
McKinney, Texas
Member since Aug 2004
112635 posts
Posted on 1/15/24 at 8:23 pm to
quote:

BI doesn’t take pull up 3s
He doesn't take enough catch & shoot 3s either. He steps in and shoots long contested 2s repeatedly.
Posted by TeddyPadillac
Member since Dec 2010
29817 posts
Posted on 1/15/24 at 8:24 pm to
quote:

True but what your stats don't show is the amount of times BI passes up on a legit wide open 3 to take one step inside the 3pt line to shoot a contested 20 footer.


Don’t exaggerate it.
He’s not taking pull up 2s from just inside the 3 point line. I would agree he passes up open 3s more than he should, but he’s doing it to get to the rim or to take a 12’ jumper, which is a big difference from a 20 footer. And I agree that I’d rather he take that open catch and shoot 3, unless there’s no shot blocker in the game and he can easily finish at the rim.
I’d like to see him taking 4-5 catch and shoot 3s and stick to no more than 1 pull up 3.
Posted by shel311
McKinney, Texas
Member since Aug 2004
112635 posts
Posted on 1/15/24 at 8:34 pm to
quote:

He’s not taking pull up 2s from just inside the 3 point line.
There's been a bunch of examples and posters call it out every time all season, where BI has a wide open 3, takes 1 dribble in, then takes a contested long 2.
This post was edited on 1/15/24 at 8:35 pm
Posted by TeddyPadillac
Member since Dec 2010
29817 posts
Posted on 1/15/24 at 9:00 pm to
quote:

There's been a bunch of examples and posters call it out every time all season, where BI has a wide open 3, takes 1 dribble in, then takes a contested long 2.


Most people are idiots and don’t know what they are talking about. A shot from the elbow with a guy in front of him that poses zero threat to his shot is not a 20’ contested jumper. And I’m not saying I’d rather that 15’ uncontested jumper over an open 3.
in reality it’s probably happened once every 3 games as described, it’s just that people want to see it and remember it so they can bitch about it.

I can’t say I’ve looked for it so I could be completely wrong, but I’ll start paying attention to it. Maybe I’m the idiot here.
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