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re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict

Posted on 6/29/23 at 12:52 pm to
Posted by notiger1997
Metairie
Member since May 2009
58513 posts
Posted on 6/29/23 at 12:52 pm to
Do other countries not have feasible long range missiles to give at this time? Of course I support the US doing it, but wondering if anyone else could help immediately.
Posted by StormyMcMan
USA
Member since Oct 2016
3812 posts
Posted on 6/29/23 at 1:07 pm to
quote:

There's a lot of speculation around the situation with Prigozhin and Wagner, so let's clarify what we know so far:

1?? Prigozhin has been exiled to Belarus. The specifics of his future are currently under Putin’s consideration. Lukashenko has hinted at the temporary nature of Prigozhin's stay, indicating a lack of interest to permanently host such individuals, but it’s likely that there will be no choice and he will have to. Without diving into speculation about the exact arrangements, the apparent aim is to neutralise Prigozhin, ‘lock him up’ outside of Russia, and the next steps will unfold with time.

2?? Wagner is being separated from Prigozhin, signaling an end to Wagner as it was previously known. There will be a dissection of the organisation: some parts will be removed, some taken, and others dismantled. This concerns Africa and Syria too. The Foreign Ministry is already actively participating in this. Wagner's involvement varied widely, so the Kremlin (read MFA, SVR and GRU) will vet Wagner’s operatives, their resources, and audit their presence, seeking whether a presence is necessary at all. We won't see a Wagner 2.0, at least the way it was.

3?? I don’t expect a purge in the style of Stalin; that's not Putin's approach. His perspective splits individuals into heroes, traitors (who face severe consequences), or lost souls who may be pardoned if they repent in time. Arrests are possible within this framework, but figures like Surovikin are less likely to be targeted. The challenge here is that Putin isn't the same as before, and there are influential figures with their own agendas, like Sergei Shoigu, who may be interested in eliminating internal opposition. So final fate of Surovikin is unclear.

4?? Prigozhin’s mutiny has underscored a potentially newer quality of the regime, which is not entirely new but is now more apparent. If Putin used to control the players, the power dynamics are now shifting. Given Putin's detachment and distorted view of reality, the players are starting to manipulate Putin. While I was always very reluctant to perceive Putin as being manipulated, the effects of his 23-year reign, his ageing, and the pressures of war could be leading to this shift. Prigozhin's struggle to reach the president and Shoigu's attempt to tackle the Wagner issue are the outcomes of Putin's inaction. This mutiny was so shocking that the regime appeared to many as near to collapse, which significantly undermines Putin’s ability to secure control in the eyes of the political class.

5?? Lastly, we're now witnessing the initial signs of an anti-elite trend in society. This shouldn't be confused with anti-Putin or anti-war sentiments. People are becoming increasingly frustrated with an inefficient and bloated elite, either scoffing at them or expressing silent indignation. Although this trend may not have immediate political implications, it may pose potentially a significant challenge later.

LINK
Posted by jfan244888
Soda City, SC
Member since Jul 2021
849 posts
Posted on 6/29/23 at 1:13 pm to
LINK

Here's a Perun vid that discusses long range vid. Its 1 hour long but a great watch.

The short answer is no. They U.S. relies on the Air Force for long range missiles bombing. The Army only has access really to HIMARS, M270, and ATACMS which is only good for about 300 miles (and there isn't a lot of them). The Chinese and Russians have much longer ranges because they didn't abide by the INF Treaty that eliminated missiles from 500 to 5000 kilometers.

Now that the treaty no longer exists the Army is trying to fast track a new missile system. They are getting some pushback from the Air Force though.

Going to be a while before something is available for countries to buy/develop something better. We've also has some costly failures as well.

For now HIMARS M270and the German PZH2000 are doing the work.
This post was edited on 6/29/23 at 1:39 pm
Posted by IAmNERD
Member since May 2017
19364 posts
Posted on 6/29/23 at 4:13 pm to
quote:

Do other countries not have feasible long range missiles to give at this time?

They're already getting Storm Shadow. It has slightly less range than ATACMS, but is more "stealthy" than ATACMS in theory. I'm sure that Ukraine would like both so they can make the Russians pick their poison:focus on trying to track and destroy the low flying SS closer to the front lines, or move some missile defense assets back to get more time to track and shoot down the ballistic ATACMS.
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