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Thoughts on Orozco Fiscal..
Posted on 7/15/13 at 10:30 am
Posted on 7/15/13 at 10:30 am
He's quietly flown under the radar this gold cup, and deserves a little bit of recognition, IMO. I don't think it's a stretch to say he's been our best overall defender, and certainly needs to be taken into consideration when Jurgen is piecing together our next A squad.
Better than Gonzalez in the last round of qualifying? I think you could make a reasonable argument...
Better than Gonzalez in the last round of qualifying? I think you could make a reasonable argument...
3
Posted on 7/15/13 at 10:32 am to Tennessee Jed
I actually think Gooch has been our best defender so far. Orozco has been decent though.
Posted on 7/15/13 at 10:46 am to Broski
If Gooch had been our best defender we wouldn't be at 6 points
Posted on 7/15/13 at 10:47 am to NewtonReb
quote:
If Gooch had been our best defender we wouldn't be at 6 points
That makes absolutely no sense at all.
Posted on 7/15/13 at 10:47 am to Tennessee Jed
quote:
Better than Gonzalez in the last round of qualifying? I think you could make a reasonable argument..
The fact that I don't really notice him that much means that he isn't having lapses in judgement like Gonzalez does sometimes. So that has to count for something.
Posted on 7/15/13 at 10:48 am to Broski
quote:
That makes absolutely no sense at all.
Gooch has been pretty poor overall, I think that's what Newton is getting at...
Posted on 7/15/13 at 10:48 am to Tennessee Jed
quote:
Gooch has been pretty poor overall,
Except he hasn't.
Posted on 7/15/13 at 10:51 am to Tennessee Jed
My personal opinion is that it is very difficult to evaluate players when our opposition is so poor. I'd still prefer Gonzalez and Besler be given time to become the partnership for the A team.
I'd probably rather see George John or Amobi Okugo be given a chance with the full team than Orozco.
I'd probably rather see George John or Amobi Okugo be given a chance with the full team than Orozco.
Posted on 7/15/13 at 10:53 am to Broski
quote:
Except he hasn't.
I know player ratings aren't the end all be all, but if you're looking for an unbiased source here, because we clearly disagree. NYtimes player ratings has had him with the lowest or tied for the lowest overall rating of any US player, in both the Cuba and Guatamala match.
Edit: Brek was lower in the Cuba match.
This post was edited on 7/15/13 at 10:54 am
Posted on 7/15/13 at 11:23 am to Tennessee Jed
quote:
Thoughts on Orozco Fiscal
First question: when did he drop the Fiscal part?
He has been solid. Might get a look at being our last CB included for next summer. One positive is that the ball does seem to find his head a lot on set pieces.
Posted on 7/15/13 at 11:25 am to Tennessee Jed
quote:
NYtimes player ratings has had him with the lowest or tied for the lowest overall rating of any US player, in both the Cuba and Guatamala match.
My advanced degree came from a Mississippi public school, so my numbers learnin' may not be the greatest.... but the 4.5s given to Torres, Bruin and Castillo for the Guatemala game *appear* to be lower than Gooch's 5.
It baffles me that people can't recognize that, other than age, there is ZERO difference between Gooch and Gonzalez.
ZEE-RO.
Posted on 7/15/13 at 11:29 am to Sheep
quote:
there is ZERO difference between Gooch and Gonzalez.
I agree with this.
Posted on 7/15/13 at 11:36 am to Fratastic423
I think he has looked like our best defender in the GC so far. Hasnt been challenged as hard as the others but I think that is partly his doing. He also has done really well getting his head on corners. Also, he shoved one up Mexico's arse in Azteca so theres a special place for him there.
Definitely warming up to him and Castillo.
Definitely warming up to him and Castillo.
This post was edited on 7/15/13 at 11:38 am
Posted on 7/15/13 at 11:39 am to Sheep
quote:
My advanced degree came from a Mississippi public school, so my numbers learnin' may not be the greatest.... but the 4.5s given to Torres, Bruin and Castillo for the Guatemala game *appear* to be lower than Gooch's 5.
It baffles me that people can't recognize that, other than age, there is ZERO difference between Gooch and Gonzalez.
ZEE-RO.
missed those. still think Fiscal has been marginally better than Gooch.
This post was edited on 7/15/13 at 11:40 am
Posted on 7/15/13 at 11:46 am to lsugradman
quote:
Also, he shoved one up Mexico's arse in Azteca so theres a special place for him there.
He also shite all over the 2008 Olympic team's chances, so he's still in my doghouse.
Posted on 7/15/13 at 11:46 am to Sheep
quote:
It baffles me that people can't recognize that, other than age, there is ZERO difference between Gooch and Gonzalez.
I generally agree with everything you have to say about the nats, but I do take exception to this.
They are definitely the same type of center back (ball winners), but I do think that Gonzo is better with his feet and with his distribution than Gooch ever was. Now, that being said Gooch was a great player for us, hopefully Gonzo can be as consistent as Gooch was before his AC Milan move and knee injury derailed his career. I do think Gonzo has more to his game than Gooch did. Gooch was a great fit for Bradley's counter attacking system next to a smart CB who could cover, but I think Gonzo is a slightly better fit for what Jurgen wants to do.
Posted on 7/15/13 at 12:07 pm to BobLoblaw
I really don't want Orozco Fiscal anywhere near the A team.
Posted on 7/15/13 at 12:13 pm to BobLoblaw
I think the similarities are greater than people realize, probably because Gooch is "old" and Gonzalez is "new."
Both are large, plodding center backs. Both lack top-end footspeed. Both use their size and long legs to recover when beat for speed. Both are prone to ball watching. Both are marginally adequate distributors, and prone to hoofing the ball up the field. Both are supposed to be great on set pieces, but the production doesn't match the expectations (Goodson and Orozco are better than both on set pieces, Omar was invisible on set pieces during the WCQs). Both seem prone to one big mistake that will lead to a goal scoring chance.
I really do feel that they're exactly the same. It's a matter of trading Omar's health for Gooch's experience.
Both are large, plodding center backs. Both lack top-end footspeed. Both use their size and long legs to recover when beat for speed. Both are prone to ball watching. Both are marginally adequate distributors, and prone to hoofing the ball up the field. Both are supposed to be great on set pieces, but the production doesn't match the expectations (Goodson and Orozco are better than both on set pieces, Omar was invisible on set pieces during the WCQs). Both seem prone to one big mistake that will lead to a goal scoring chance.
I really do feel that they're exactly the same. It's a matter of trading Omar's health for Gooch's experience.
This post was edited on 7/15/13 at 12:18 pm
Posted on 7/15/13 at 12:19 pm to Sheep
quote:
other than age, there is ZERO difference between Gooch and Gonzalez.
Then give me the younger guy.
Posted on 7/15/13 at 12:47 pm to Hester Carries
quote:
Then give me the younger guy.
You *prefer* less experience?
(I'm not advocating one over the other, I'm just trying to understand the "younger=better" mindset.)
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