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re: Deserves own thread JUSTICE FOR THE 96
Posted on 4/27/16 at 6:50 am to BleedPurpleGold
Posted on 4/27/16 at 6:50 am to BleedPurpleGold
quote:
I'm not really sure what the frick Heysel has to do with this
I'm not really sure how you don't understand that Heysel had a lot to do with it.
2
Posted on 4/27/16 at 7:28 am to RandySavage
I'm trying to put myself in the shoes of someone who he a family member die in this tragedy. I don't know what my reaction to this would be. We all knew that this was not the fans fault and it was poorly handled by event staff and law enforcement. Does an official ruling really provide closure? I'm saddened that 96 people lost their lives and that it took 27 years for a clear judgement to be passed down. However, this judgement does nothing to bring back all of the lost family and friends who were there to simply support their club.
Posted on 4/27/16 at 7:33 am to lynxcat
The major issue is how long it took for their names and the fans to be cleared and the blame being shifted to who actually was responsible.
Lots of lies and cover ups went on to protect the establishment of officials in place who did not want to take responsibility. Also The Sun printing a totally false and vile story placing blame on Liverpool fans just days after it happened didn't help things either.
Lots of lies and cover ups went on to protect the establishment of officials in place who did not want to take responsibility. Also The Sun printing a totally false and vile story placing blame on Liverpool fans just days after it happened didn't help things either.
Posted on 4/27/16 at 7:51 am to StraightCashHomey21
quote:
both the tragedies had huge effects on the game in Britain and in Europe that were extremely negative. No one went to jail over what happened.
They did have a huge effect. But so did United firms stabbing Blackpool fans to death which is the entire reason we have segregated supporter sections today separated by fencing. However, you don't see me bringing that tragedy up in every discussion about Munich. I don't because it's disrespectful to what happened to those who died in Germany that day. That is my only point. Heysel has no place in this discussion on this day. It's a day to celebrate justice, not caveat it with "well that's great and all, but....."
And yes, the murderers did serve time in jail.
quote:
I think the word you are looking for is tribalism.
No, sectarian works just fine. It's used to refer to factions within a group, religious or otherwise.
quote:
Second nothing I said was disrespectful or out of place. Like I said its about heeling old wounds so football can move forward. Maybe if you were not so defensive about Liverpool, you could articulate what I was saying.
The fact that you brought it up at all is disrespectful.
I agree that Heysel hasn't had its proper closure. That wound is still open, and people in both Turin and Liverpool have not had adequate dialogue about it. That needs to change. But that's a subject for a different thread. You can wave around the tired accusations of defensiveness all you want, but talking about it in a thread divoted to discussion of the victims of Hillsboroug on the day the inquests are released is evidence of a severe lack of tact.
This post was edited on 4/27/16 at 7:55 am
Posted on 4/27/16 at 7:53 am to RandySavage
quote:
I'm not really sure how you don't understand that Heysel had a lot to do with it.
I know your views on this subject. I'd prefer not to discuss the subject at all with you, so you'll forgive me if I ignore your posts from here on out.
Posted on 4/27/16 at 7:56 am to BleedPurpleGold
quote:
They did have a huge effect. But so did United firms stabbing Blackpool fans to death which is the entire reason we have segregated supporter sections today separated by fencing. However, you don't see me bringing that tragedy up in every discussion about Munich. I don't because it's disrespectful to what happened to those who died in Germany that day. That is my only point. Heysel has no place in this discussion on this day. It's a day to celebrate justice, not caveat it with "well that's great and all, but....."
Talking about United fans killing another set of supporters and a plane crash in the same thread makes no sense bc they are no way related.
But the 39 def has a place in this thread b/c Heysel is basically a forgotten tragedy. All we hear about was the 96 and rightly so, but those Juve fans never got their justice or anywhere the amount of coverage.
quote:
And yes, the murderers did serve time in jail.
they received suspended sentences
quote:
The fact that you brought it up at all is disrespectful
No its not get over it, Juve fans deserve their justice just like Liverpool fans got theirs.
This post was edited on 4/27/16 at 8:00 am
Posted on 4/27/16 at 9:05 am to StraightCashHomey21
quote:
All we hear about was the 96 and rightly so, but those Juve fans never got their justice or anywhere the amount of coverage.
Maybe in the rest of the country, but LFC has erected a monument, donated money countless times to their family supporters group, and offered gestures of friendship on occasion as happened in the tie in 2005. There's no doubt that more should be done, but there was a certain justice present, inadequate as it may be. In regard to Hillsborough, not only was there no day in court, but the reputations of those innocent people were dragged through the mud. The situations are apples and oranges here. Neither situation is worse than the other, they're just not related or comparable.
quote:
hey received suspended sentences
Which were then appealed by prosecutors resulting in jail time.
quote:
No its not get over it, Juve fans deserve their justice just like Liverpool fans got theirs
They certainly deserve not only more monetary support, but (and I think more importantly) more symbolic support. Something like a permanent minute of silence on the anniversary should be observed so those families know their fallen relatives aren't forgotten by those at the club. However, I just can't see a reason to bring that situation up in this thread. They are vastly different.
Posted on 4/27/16 at 9:13 am to StraightCashHomey21
I a still in awe of all these old soccer tragedies.
One of the things that got me more into the history of the game were finding out about these events.
the lack of media coverage isn't shocking
One of the things that got me more into the history of the game were finding out about these events.
the lack of media coverage isn't shocking
Posted on 4/27/16 at 9:19 am to BleedPurpleGold
quote:
Maybe in the rest of the country, but LFC has erected a monument, donated money countless times to their family supporters group, and offered gestures of friendship on occasion as happened in the tie in 2005
Has the club every said yea it was our fault. Instead the chairman back then blamed it on Chelsea fans.
quote:
Which were then appealed by prosecutors resulting in jail time.
pretty sure they got to go back to the UK after the trial. spent time in jail during the proceedings to what ive read.
quote:
They certainly deserve not only more monetary support, but (and I think more importantly) more symbolic support. Something like a permanent minute of silence on the anniversary should be observed so those families know their fallen relatives aren't forgotten by those at the club. However, I just can't see a reason to bring that situation up in this thread. They are vastly different.
Honestly I think it might be too late to get Juve to accept any kind of apology. Their views on this have been pretty clear unfortunately.
Posted on 4/27/16 at 10:11 am to StraightCashHomey21
quote:
Has the club every said yea it was our fault. Instead the chairman back then blamed it on Chelsea fans.
No. There was a PM at the game who claimed to have seen the men who started the attack speaking in cockney, shaved heads, and wearing the Union Jack. He said he thought they were national front (not Chelsea). The chairman backed this position with little to no evidence other than the politicians statement. It was stupid and I'm not sure if the club ever apologized for that. If not they absolutely should.
quote:
pretty sure they got to go back to the UK after the trial. spent time in jail during the proceedings to what ive read.
They did but were jailed after the appeal was granted and suspended sentences overturned.
quote:
Honestly I think it might be too late to get Juve to accept any kind of apology. Their views on this have been pretty clear unfortunately.
I think so too. Turin has shown a complete aversion to even mentioning the topic, unfortunately. For some reason it's a taboo subject even to them, and the families have been very vocal about their displeasure with that. Regardless, I think it's important for LFC to show some type of support, with or without Juve's supporter's blessing.
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