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re: Why America was founded as a Christian nation
Posted on 4/25/25 at 8:28 pm to the808bass
Posted on 4/25/25 at 8:28 pm to the808bass
quote:
Materialism is a shite explanation for life and living. Some people are figuring that out.
There’s something to be said for a 75 year old house and enough money for a steak and a good beer once a week.
0
Posted on 4/25/25 at 9:51 pm to N.O. via West-Cal
quote:historically false
they made this explicit in the First Amendment
Posted on 4/25/25 at 9:55 pm to IMSA_Fan
quote:misleading. America was a nation founded as Christians governing Christians in a Christian manner. It's all over the documents. It's in the writings of the founding fathers. It's thoroughly interwoven into the culture of the time
America was not founded as a Christian nation
Posted on 4/25/25 at 10:00 pm to Azkiger
quote:Secularists, please stop quoting the Treaty of Tripoli
Have you read article 11 of the Treaty of Tripoli?
Posted on 4/25/25 at 10:03 pm to EphesianArmor
quote:you've missed several citations itt that show otherwise
America was NOT founded as a Christian nation
Posted on 4/25/25 at 10:25 pm to Auburn1968
quote:Precisely. This is the context to the separation clause in Jefferson's letter and it gives us a glimpse into what the FF saw the phrase to mean - not an exclusion of religion in government. Jefferson himself went to church services in the HOR.
One of the triggers was the Congregationalists of Massachusetts declaring themselves to be the state religion and taxing other denominations to build Congregationalist churches
While the context of the letter is about the congregationalists, the overall concern in america amongst the separationists of the day was the catholic church establishing schools in the colonies. That was a main driving force behind the establishment clause.
Today, people ignorantly think the establishment clause means the government has to remain religiously neutral, which is ahistorical.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 10:34 pm to somethingdifferent
quote:
As the government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion,-as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion or tranquility of Musselmen,-and as the said States never have entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mehomitan nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries.”
I don't understand what's unclear about this. Our government wasn't founded on Christian beliefs which prevents us with having any inherent conflict with the Barbary states. Pretty plain language from a founder who had personal beliefs about religion.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 10:37 pm to oklahogjr
Did you read the article. It explains why you're wrong.
Did you read the other articles posted itt. They explain why you're wrong
Do you know the context of Jefferson's letter to the Danbury baptists?
Did you read the other articles posted itt. They explain why you're wrong
Do you know the context of Jefferson's letter to the Danbury baptists?
quote:This is historically incorrect
Our government wasn't founded on Christian beliefs
Posted on 4/25/25 at 10:40 pm to theballguy
quote:Just because Hollywood and the national media says that is the case it's far from the truth. The faith in Christ in growing at very fast rate.
Well, if it was, it's not anymore. Christianity in the western sense is slowly shrinking.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 10:43 pm to theballguy
quote:You are not God and far from a judge in Christ's court. You have no clue just like any of us what Trump's Relationship is with Christ. Yes he is a sinner just like all of us but that doesn't make him a non believer. I hope you don't claim yourself to be a Christian if so you really need to get back into your Bible.
Trump is definitely not a Christian
Posted on 4/25/25 at 10:58 pm to the808bass
Christianities decline in Europe is tied by many to World War 2. The horror of what took place, and the atrocities led many Christians to question their faith. One silver lining I hope will occur from all the problems that have gone along with mass Muslim immigration is a return to Faith.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 11:08 pm to somethingdifferent
quote:
Our government wasn't founded on Christian beliefs
This is historically incorrect
Which Christian beliefs were we founded upon? Be specific.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 11:11 pm to oklahogjr
I’d probably start with the Declaration of Independence and work from there.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 11:14 pm to somethingdifferent
quote:
Secularists, please stop quoting the Treaty of Tripoli
I honestly don't understand what Thomas' argument is.
"There's a larger context, it's a treaty between two governments."
Yeah, so?
"But President John Adams gave a proclamation where he stated some opinions!"
Yeah, so?
"Yeah, but the second treaty contains no such language!"
Yeah, and the second treaty doesn't contain the US Constitution either.
In what context does the entire US senate vote (no one voted against) on a document that contains the language "As the government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion," and not mean that the government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion? When they want to "state that differing religious opinions shall not be considered a pretext for violating the treaty"? Article 11 is saying, in no uncertain terms, that there is no religious dispute between governments. There is no other way to read it.
What are we even talking about here? Are you and Thomas Essel shoving cope pills up each others asses?
This post was edited on 4/25/25 at 11:24 pm
Posted on 4/25/25 at 11:25 pm to oklahogjr
quote:
Which Christian beliefs were we founded upon? Be specific.
One would think the 10 commandments would at least be apart of that list, seeing as how Christians want it on every piece of publicly owned land.
Flipping through the 10 commandments, less than half are law. And the ones that are law are universal laws (good luck finding a government that doesn't criminalize stealing and killing).
They've got nothing.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 11:33 pm to lsuguy84
quote:
probably start with the Declaration of Independence and work from there.
The Bible is clear what to do about taxes and earthly rulers... It couldn't be more contradictory. Specifically the book of Romans dealt a lot with this...
quote:
For because of this you also pay taxes, for the authorities are ministers of God, attending to this very thing. Pay to all what is owed to them: taxes to whom taxes are owed, revenue to whom revenue is owed, respect to whom respect is owed, honor to whom honor is owed.
quote:
Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment. For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is good, and you will receive his approval, for he is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God's wrath on the wrongdoer. Therefore one must be in subjection, not only to avoid God's wrath but also for the sake of conscience
This post was edited on 4/25/25 at 11:34 pm
Posted on 4/25/25 at 11:47 pm to oklahogjr
quote:apparently, you aren't interested in reading the articles that have been cited itt. It would help to answer your question
Which Christian beliefs were we founded upon? Be specific.
As I said, in general, the FF viewed america as Christians governing Christians in a Christian manner
It has already been mentioned that they went to church services in government buildings. Why does that not register with you?
I asked you about the Danbury letter.
Posted on 4/25/25 at 11:53 pm to Azkiger
quote:Someone who is quoting the treaty without the rest of the context mentioned itt. The colonists were chiefly concerned with the catholic church establishing schools in the new world. Given that and the Danbury letter, the tripoli language is more about a theocracy than the beliefs of the FF. They could see the distinction between the Christian culture of the government as opposed to established state religion. Unfortunately, many contemporary americans are duped into ignorantly believing the establishment clause totally obliterates religion from government
What are we even talking about here?
Why was the language removed from the draft when it was completed later?
Posted on 4/25/25 at 11:56 pm to oklahogjr
quote:Have you ever read Daniel 3?
The Bible is clear what to do about taxes and earthly rulers... It couldn't be more contradictory
Posted on 4/25/25 at 11:59 pm to somethingdifferent
quote:
Someone who is quoting the treaty without the rest of the context mentioned itt.
Outside of an April Fools joke, what context can make the statement that "the United States government is not founded on the Christian religion" not mean that the United States government is not founded on the Christian religion?
This post was edited on 4/26/25 at 12:01 am
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