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Started By
Message
1
Posted on 4/8/14 at 10:01 pm to Scoop
quote:
Why over play his hand unless he really is just gonna go balls out until he is checked?
Well no one has shown any balls to check him.
He will keep going until we have the balls to at least bluff him.
That's why a week ago I posted that our move should be to mass european union troops on the Ukraine border, basically mirror russia's actions.
Posted on 4/8/14 at 10:05 pm to Scoop
quote:
Putin got Crimea and the ports.
I thought that was his move.
What the hell is he thinking?
He played the Crimea thing beautifully.
Why over play his hand unless he really is just gonna go balls out until he is checked?
It's looking like 1938 out there.
Posted on 4/8/14 at 10:06 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
quote:
Ukraine may have better intel of what Russia is going to do than we do.
And probably better intel than the neo-con "think" tank American Foreign Policy Council.
Posted on 4/8/14 at 10:09 pm to Layabout
Neocon, lol?
10 years ago called and wanted it's buzzword back.
10 years ago called and wanted it's buzzword back.
Posted on 4/8/14 at 10:18 pm to constant cough
At this point I don't think Putin will flip the NATO switch, though at this point I wonder if he might be able to go into a NATO country without the NATO switch being thrown.
I feel like he is going to nip at former, non-NATO, Soviet Republics where he expects little resistance, take them back and reassess at that point.
He knows the west will acquiesce to his moves and just speak words unless he hits a NATO country. Only then will he truly test the a West. He'll get a pass until then.
I feel like he is going to nip at former, non-NATO, Soviet Republics where he expects little resistance, take them back and reassess at that point.
He knows the west will acquiesce to his moves and just speak words unless he hits a NATO country. Only then will he truly test the a West. He'll get a pass until then.
This post was edited on 4/8/14 at 10:20 pm
Posted on 4/8/14 at 10:26 pm to Scoop
Putin has one thing going for him, though, and he knows it:
The "leader" of the West is a feckless little girl named Obama.
The "leader" of the West is a feckless little girl named Obama.
Posted on 4/8/14 at 10:29 pm to Scoop
with the way thing have ran for the last six years...How can Obama/NATO stop him?
Chickens have come to roost
Chickens have come to roost
Posted on 4/8/14 at 10:37 pm to wickowick
quote:
and warned Russian leader Vladimir Putin that there will be consequences if he takes over any more Ukrainian territory
So the red line has been drawn??????
Posted on 4/8/14 at 10:39 pm to Scoop
The question is, how much fight is within the Ukrainian people? I get a sense after talking to a Ukrainian a few days ago, that they are so fed up with the corruption, that becoming part of Russia looks good to them. Their economy is damn bad. Ukraine's corrupt leadership has little respect within the country. Maybe the military has some backbone, but we've yet to see it. I think we are looking at another version of WWII France, which may not be all bad. And then there will be Ukrainian resistance to deal with.
Are Ukrainians willing to shed blood for Ukraine?
Are Ukrainians willing to shed blood for Ukraine?
Posted on 4/8/14 at 10:42 pm to Scoop
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I read that Crimea gets a significant amount of their electricity from eastern Ukraine. If so, it was only a matter of time until Putin tried to take that as well. Because while they gained a warm water port with Crimea, they also took on a welfare state from an economic standpoint.
Posted on 4/8/14 at 11:00 pm to TideCPA
So what is the point (OP)? Is it that we are not sharing the intel so they don't put up a good fight and more lives aren't lost?
Posted on 4/8/14 at 11:09 pm to Paluka
quote:
I'm am curious if the Ukraine is really unaware that this invasion may occur. Surely, they are gathering intelligence as well.
I would hope that the ukrainian military is. It would take a freak up of massive proportions to not prepare for an invasion of eastern ukraine after Crimea was invaded.
The more important question is what will the Balkan countries and Poland do? Will they help defend ukraine (not necessarily troops shoting but the othe military-lite options that have been discussed on here 50 zillion times) and in doing so force the US's hand?
Posted on 4/8/14 at 11:12 pm to CptBengal
quote:
my guess is Kazakhstan is next
He doesn't want Republics back.
Putin has enough trouble without bringing in ethnic groups that don't want to be part of Russia. If he moves anywhere it is only into border areas with ethnic Russian majorities.
That helps off set his demographic problem and gets the shitty economy off of the mind of Great Russian nationalist.
I think we start funding and supporting breakaway parts of the Russian Republic, he has more separation problems than he can handle if we invigorate the separatists.
War on the periphery again.
Posted on 4/8/14 at 11:16 pm to CarrolltonTiger
quote:
I think we start funding and supporting breakaway parts of the Russian Republic, he has more separation problems than he can handle if we invigorate the separatists.
War on the periphery again.
The big problem with that is Obama is a PUSSY! He could have probably stopped all of this by sending an aircraft carrier into the region to support ukraine and after the first russian troops entered Crimea he should have held a press conference saying the missile defense system was going back in.
Posted on 4/8/14 at 11:30 pm to Scoop
quote:
Putin got Crimea and the ports.
I thought that was his move.
What the hell is he thinking?
He played the Crimea thing beautifully.
Why over play his hand unless he really is just gonna go balls out until he is checked?
Two reasons:
First, Crimea is dependent on the Ukranian infrastructure grids. Russia is starting connections of their own across the Kerch Straits but that will take time and money, and with Gazprom putting the squeeze on Ukraine, it's only a matter of time before they get angry and cut Crimea off, and suddenly all of your happy new Russian citizens are reading by candlelight and pooping in outhouses. Seizing southeastern Ukraine up to Kherson will take care of this.
Secondly, there isn't really much to Crimea economically. The port's value is mostly military, the main industries are tourism and pink salt. It has a lot of sentimental value for Russia but it will be a large drain on the Russian economy. That's why Russia has been floating "I got nothing" development ideas like casinos, etc. Eastern Ukraine, on the other hand, is where all the industry is. Donetsk, ground zero for the current provocations, is Ukraine's main coal-producing oblast and does most of the steel and power production.
Putin has no interest in the entire Ukraine. Western Ukraine is basically Polish Iowa and with a pro-Ukranian populace and so many friendly, rich countries nearby the insurgency would be cost-prohibitive. He'll reduce it to a rump state, with the added bonus of destabilizing the current government enough so that the fascists he's been bitching about (who currently are only polling at about 2-5%) really DO take over, and then sit at the Dnieper looking smug.
This post was edited on 4/8/14 at 11:34 pm
Posted on 4/8/14 at 11:40 pm to willthezombie
quote:
The big problem with that is Obama is a PUSSY! He could have probably stopped all of this by sending an aircraft carrier into the region to support ukraine and after the first russian troops entered Crimea he should have held a press conference saying the missile defense system was going back in.
The GHW Bush is already in the Mediterranean and has been for months. Sending a carrier group into the Black Sea proper would require permission from Turkey, which they're unlikely to grant as Russia would consider it an act of war. Also, we'd be putting that carrier group in serious jeopardy; Russia is not some dinkus third-world country that doesn't have submarines or fighter jets of its own.
Posted on 4/9/14 at 6:12 am to Scoop
Read Brett Stephens yesterday.
Posted on 4/9/14 at 8:51 am to wickowick
quote:
U.S. intelligence agencies now have detailed information that Russia has amassed the kind of forces needed for a full-scale invasion of Ukraine. But the Obama administration hasn’t shared with Ukraine the imagery, intercepts, and analysis that pinpont the location of the Russian troops ready to seize more Ukrainian land, The Daily Beast has learned.
How credible is the 'Daily Beast'? Do they have proven inside sources? If not, this article is BS.
Posted on 4/9/14 at 8:57 am to CarrolltonTiger
quote:
He doesn't want Republics back.
Putin has enough trouble without bringing in ethnic groups that don't want to be part of Russia. If he moves anywhere it is only into border areas with ethnic Russian majorities.
Oh I dont think he wants all of Kazakhstan...but they do have massive oil/gas and REMs there in the relatively uninhabited northern areas.
easy pickings.
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