re: Sky Screamers Rejoice! Senate votes to repeal the repeal of Net Neutrality

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. We are playing a zero sum game and the tyranny of capital

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economies and capital are NOT zero sum.

try again.

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How about if there was only one road paving company in your city and that company partners with Ford to mold the road to match only Ford tires thus making a other vehicles basically impossible to drive and then it made a law that all Fords have no speed limits and all other vehicles can only go 2 miles per hour.

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In that scenario, would you consider anyone a competitor to Ford?

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Sigh.

You STILL seem to think "competition" means "product that replicates other product".

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Or is your answer, well it's a free market someone else should come along and pave an entire new road system and build and entire new car manufacturing facility and have it be competitively priced and available before the existing monoply crushes it out of existence

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And you ask me why I bring up prior liberal "gee govt save me" arguments!


That right there.

Dude. You're in law school? Cool. If you have an electives left over, talk a walk over the Econ section. Cause yeah. If some company creates the world's shittiest product that is 100% anti-customer as you described, the free market is absolutely going to frick them in the arse.

Sheesh

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the local phone company is also AT&T

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Absolutely not. Our local company isn't affiliated with AT&T.

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Yes, but until the lack of competition can be remedied, NN is needed. WIthout NN AND competition, those ISP's get to ensure there never will be any competition.

Now, once there is competition, NN can be de-regulated because it is something the market will overwhelmingly demand if given the choice to do so.

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But see, I don't like how the default answer is not to pursue free-market ideas but to stop the gap with more federal regulation. If we need to pursue busting up monopolies in the future, why not pursue that now and forego any talk of additional regulation until it has been determined that the free market cannot cannot respond to the demand?

R

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ight now, the consumers have no leverage because they have no choice.

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That's not entirely true, at least not in a universal sense. There are multiple carriers, just not many, and it is region-specific.

Right now, the consumers have no leverage because they have no choice.

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When the control of the flow of information and access to the physical marketplace of commerce becomes monopolized

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What you should be advocating is increased competition, not increased regulation.

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You STILL seem to think "competition" means "product that replicates other product".

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When we're discussing economics, "competitors" that are not substitute products in the eyes of consumers are not treated by consumers like competitors. That means that behaviors such as price elasticity/in-elasticity (which are largely dependent upon consumer choice of competing products) happen as though that competitor were not available because the consumer does not see it as a real alternative. Even though they technically compete, they're actually competing in separate niches for separate markets that only overlap in rare circumstances (like the compact, walkable neighborhood where the worker lives in close proximity to their job). These are the exception, not the rule.

The problem with ISP's is that even assuming that these completely different products, that consumers do not view as substitute products, are viable substitutes, the same companies that are the broadband ISP's ALSO own these alternative services (wireless, telephone dsl, satellite). There is very very little real choice, and almost zero consumer leverage.

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Sigh.

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Another example of you refusing to answer a simple question.

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If some company creates the world's shittiest product that is 100% anti-customer as you described, the free market is absolutely going to frick them in the arse. 

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You think the consumer is currently fricking Comcast in the arse?

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Dude. You're in law school? Cool. If you have an electives left over, talk a walk over the Econ section. 

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I graduated law school and in both law school and undergrad I extensively studied government regulations and free market history both politically and economically of the phone system, the beginnings of the internet, and the current landscape.

What are you qualifications for this discussion?

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When we're discussing economics, "competitors" that are not substitute products in the eyes of consumers are not treated by consumers like competitors. That means that behaviors such as price elasticity/in-elasticity (which are largely dependent upon consumer choice of competing products) happen as though that competitor were not available because the consumer does not see it as a real alternative.

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much to the advantage of those that invest in markets.

Congratulations, you;ve figured out how hedge funds work!

YAY!

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Absolutely not. Our local company isn't affiliated with AT&T.

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You are very fortunate.

AT&T has 40% of the landline telephone market.

Another 30% is Comcast, Verizon, Cox, and T-Mobile.
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