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re: Scott Bessent just summed up the migration crisis for America

Posted on 7/7/25 at 6:36 am to
Posted by UncleFestersLegs
Member since Nov 2010
16880 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 6:36 am to
quote:

From what I can find, the previous highest native-born US employment occurred in....July 2023, as the border was being flooded under Biden.
quote:



American-born employment hits record high as foreign-born jobs decline
by RYAN MINNAUGH | The National News Desk
Thu, July 3rd 2025 at 1:44 PM
Updated Thu, July 3rd 2025 at 3:18 PM

The U.S. labor market saw a significant shift in June as the number of American-born workers employed surged by 830,000, reaching the highest level ever recorded, according to the Department of Labor. This increase surpasses the pre-pandemic high set in October 2019.
ABC News American-born employment hits record high as foreign-born jobs decline
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476637 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 6:37 am to
quote:

previous


As I said, Trump's employment is following the prior post-Covid trend, so it will surpass the previous high naturally.
This post was edited on 7/7/25 at 6:38 am
Posted by UncleFestersLegs
Member since Nov 2010
16880 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 6:46 am to
quote:

As I said

quote:

From what I can find, the previous highest native-born US employment occurred in....July 2023,

quote:

This increase surpasses the pre-pandemic high set in October 2019.
Posted by Ace Midnight
Between sanity and madness
Member since Dec 2006
95637 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 6:46 am to
quote:

Nobody has been able to explain how this would work.


I have the feeling you will not accept an explanation you don't like.

quote:

Successful people who have money to invest having to pay more for goods (due to the inflationary pressure of higher wages) means less money will be spent elsewhere, especially in investing.



Meh. Successful people are creatures of their habits. Some end up being wasteful spenders regardless of return. Some are notoriously thrifty even with excess resources. Americans are profligate spenders, on average and in the aggregate, but Americans also adjust to the times, in my almost 6 decades of experience.

quote:

And the people who will get the bump in salary won't be making enough to have an abundance of extra money to invest. They'll still be in the lower-level earning demographics, and still struggling economically.


This just ignores the obvious and verifiable pattern that most folks' improvement throughout their lives is almost always in incremental steps (with a few bumps up/down here and there).

quote:

This means less money flowing to our more productive areas (which require the investment) and that means less economic/GDP growth.


Money finds the most productive outlet, almost by itself, at least in market-based system. In planned economies, sure, less disposable income is usually a death spiral.

quote:

There is a reason the "blood and soil" types peg this correctly and attack GDP/SOL (typically labeling economic success as an "economic zone") with to promote their proposed racial harmony.


Diagram that sentence for me.


This post was edited on 7/7/25 at 6:49 am
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476637 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 6:50 am to
I literally posted the data they relied on from the St Louis fed showing the July 2023 peak last page.

It's splitting hairs regardless.

if your theory is true, the trend under Biden would not have occurred.

Foreign and native employment increased.

And, as I pointed out earlier, even with foreign and native employment growing, there is still a huge demand for labor in plenty of fields available for the native unemployed today. You've kept ignoring this fact.
Posted by SquatchDawg
Cohutta Wilderness
Member since Sep 2012
20083 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 6:54 am to
One graph is thousands of people…the other is rate. Can you find two that use the same Y axis basis?
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476637 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 6:55 am to
quote:

Successful people are creatures of their habits. Some end up being wasteful spenders regardless of return. Some are notoriously thrifty even with excess resources. Americans are profligate spenders, on average and in the aggregate, but Americans also adjust to the times, in my almost 6 decades of experience.

I posted the data earlier ITT. Those people save/invest a lot more than poorer people.

quote:

This just ignores the obvious and verifiable pattern that most folks' improvement throughout their lives is almost always in incremental steps (with a few bumps up/down here and there).

These are not "career" jobs that illegals are working, though. There is no advancement as they're the lowest-level jobs, typically.

On the other hand, there are PLENTY of available trade jobs with advancement potential begging for these people to apply for, that the natives are not applying for.

quote:

Money finds the most productive outlet, almost by itself, at least in market-based system. In planned economies, sure, less disposable income is usually a death spiral.

Bessent seems eager to plan that redistribution.

quote:

Diagram that sentence for me.

The final "with" should be removed.

I'll just be overly verbose to explain this because the efficiency was confusing.

"Blood and soil" types understand how their racial-based policies will negatively affect GDP and are honest about it and attack GDP/SOL directly. That's why they label the current US as an "economic zone" (to create negative implication on our economic status) and not a "nation" (which requires the racial harmony they seek).
Posted by udtiger
Over your left shoulder
Member since Nov 2006
115393 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 6:57 am to
quote:

I never thought I'd hear the GOP promote literal Democratic economic talking points ("Wall Street has done well; now it's time for Main Street to do well").


Did you not listen to the next 3 sentences? He literally said both could and would benefit.
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476637 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 6:59 am to
quote:

One graph is thousands of people…the other is rate.

Sorry. Good point. It's going to show basically the same trend but my comment about it stalling was off (as it would increase with US employment).

I'll see if St Louis Fed has that.

The larger point didn't even rely on that chart data. Nobody is suggesting that under Biden we didn't have a surge of illegals. If the argument is these illegals were displacing native workers, how did we reach such high employment of native workers under Biden? If the argument is correct, you'd have seen a decline (due to the mass wave takin er jerbs)
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476637 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 7:00 am to
quote:

Did you not listen to the next 3 sentences?

Yes

quote:

He literally said both could and would benefit.

And I am showing how that's not true

His argument here is flimsier than the "we have to grow our way out of the debt' nonsense.
Posted by udtiger
Over your left shoulder
Member since Nov 2006
115393 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 7:07 am to
quote:

And I am showing how that's not true


Rhetoric and conclusory statements aren't proof
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476637 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 7:22 am to
I've provided more than e did, for the record
Posted by UncleFestersLegs
Member since Nov 2010
16880 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 7:42 am to
quote:

if your theory is true, the trend under Biden would not have occurred.

Foreign and native employment increased.
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476637 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 7:45 am to
Post Covid, where is the dramatic decline?

A lower growth rate is not a decline.

If your argument is correct, there needs to be a precipitous decline in native employment and that graph shows that did not happen
Posted by hogcard1964
Alabama
Member since Jan 2017
19864 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 7:48 am to
TDS

Severe TDS
Posted by udtiger
Over your left shoulder
Member since Nov 2006
115393 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 7:55 am to
quote:


I've provided more than e did, for the record


I have yet to see any of these talking heads show up with charts and graphs.

Perhaps we can get you and Secretary Bessent together to argue your sides of this issue.
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476637 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 8:05 am to
I think they are making a political argument for votes more than an economic one.

Again, literal Democratic talking points ("Main Street" v. "Wall Street")

Loading Twitter/X Embed...
If tweet fails to load, click here.


LITERALLY a Bernie Sanders talking point

Or how about Hillary Clinton from 2016

quote:

Let's look at what is at stake here. We can never let Wall Street wreck Main street again. I spoke out against Wall Street when I was a Senator from New York. I have been standing up and saying continuously we have the law.


The Nation: Left Politics Can Win All Over the Country (2018)

quote:

After the 2008 economic collapse, blessed with dominant majorities at every level of state and federal government, a demographic edge that was expanding across the board, and a thoroughly discredited Republican economic philosophy, Democrats could have passed into law a series of big, bold, fundamental reforms that would have both thrilled their growing political coalition and solidified their credibility with working-class voters angered at the way Wall Street had destroyed the Main Street economy. Had they fundamentally restructured the financial industry, immigration, energy policy, the criminal-justice system, and the way campaigns were financed, Democrats could have built as sustained a governing majority as the New Deal had created in the 1930s. When they failed to deliver on restructuring how the economy worked for working people, and, importantly, failed to prosecute the Wall Street bankers whose fraud had led to the economic collapse, they lost credibility with working-class swing voters and the enthusiasm of their base. Democrats broke their own political coalition, and it remains broken to this day.


Populist economics are leftist economics by nature.
Posted by UncleFestersLegs
Member since Nov 2010
16880 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 8:16 am to
quote:

Post Covid, where is the dramatic decline?

A lower growth rate is not a decline.
Posted by GeauxBurrow312
Member since Nov 2024
6265 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 8:20 am to
Higher wages for the bottom also means less people on welfare
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476637 posts
Posted on 7/7/25 at 8:22 am to
quote:

Higher wages for the bottom also means less people on welfare


That's an assumption the current situation does not support

Plenty of good paying jobs are out there for people in welfare and they choose welfare
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