re: Pope, we must avoid rigid ideologies

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wouldn't trust secular media to accurately portray what Pope Francis and others in the Church say.

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I was critical of the Pope at first, but it’s clear lately that he and the church are under attack.

It’s clear that he was trying to bring two political sides together.

It’s clear that he didn’t ok blessing the union of gays. He is blessing them as a person just like anyone who goes to communion with their arms crossed. Just like the final blessing at mass.

What I don’t understand is why he felt the need to say it.

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You show me.

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That Jesus left us a church, gave us a leader (Peter and his successors) and a group of people to lead the Church?

Sure

Matthew 16:13-20 (Jesus gives authority to Peter)
Matthew 18:15-20 (power to bind and loose given to apostles)
John 20:23 (given the power to retain or forgive sins)

I could go on, but there are plenty of passages in scripture that point to Jesus giving authority to his apostles and therefore the authority to govern the church. The Pope and the Bishops of the Church are simply continuing that mission Jesus gave his apostles.

The Curia mostly made up of bishops, assist the Pope who has the highest authority in the Church on earth (Jesus is the ultimate authority but he is in heaven).

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Our very first pope denied Jesus despite the fact that he lived with him for three solid years.

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Someone should have told Peter he was the first pope he obviously didn’t know it.


Ephesians 2:19-21 talks about God’s church being built on apostles ( plural) and prophets, not on a single man, Peter. It goes on to say the foundation of the church is Christ, not Peter.


Ephesians 4:11-12
And he gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the shepherds and teachers,
12 to equip the saints for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ
Why isn’t the office of the Pope listed in the hierarchy of church leadership? Paul doesn’t even hint at a chief pastor or leader.


1 Peter 5:1 So I exhort the elders among you, as a fellow elder and a witness of the sufferings of Christ, as well as a partaker in the glory that is going to be revealed:


Peter himself describes himself as a fellow elder and makes no declaration of some special role or office.

Revenue must be down

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It goes on to say the foundation of the church is Christ, not Peter.

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And that is true. Christ is and shall always be the universal head of the Church. The pope is merely his chief royal steward who, in Old Testament times, was in charge of the kingdom when the king was away.

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Peter himself describes himself as a fellow elder and makes no declaration of some special role or office.

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Peter was known for his humility. And in Ephesians, Paul himself tells us that Christ left us a church with a clear hierarchy: Apostles, Prophets, Evangelists, Presbyters, and Deacons. Peter was obviously in the rank of Apostles.

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words, stop living that 'sinful' lifestyle. If a Catholic gay wants a blessing, let him/her go to confession, vow to give up the lifestyle, receive absolution and live a chaste life, then I don't have any problem with that. Jesus came to save sinners, 'repentent' sinners. It's that simple.

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If they do this, they would have to do it to the no fault divorced people too and that’s too much of their revenue.

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Jesus, saved and forgave the woman caught in adultery, but told her, "Go and sin no more" (John 8:11) . In other words, stop living that 'sinful' lifestyle. If a Catholic gay wants a blessing, let him/her go to confession, vow to give up the lifestyle, receive absolution and live a chaste life, then I don't have any problem with that. Jesus came to save sinners, repentent sinners.

These gays are showing up requesting a blessing with no intention of giving up their sodomous lifestye. Big difference, and you know it. Quit trying to rationalize sin.

This Pope is blessing sin, which is impossible.

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I can assure you that I’m not trying to rationalize sin or the importance of a repentant heart.


But when someone isn’t in a state of grace to receive communion, they are allowed to go up and receive a blessing instead, no? It doesn’t make their sin ok, and it doesn’t bless their sin. It acknowledges their separation from the Eucharist while allowing them an expression/reception of God’s Grace. Neither you nor I know the heart of the person walking up to receive a blessing. They may be doing it to appease their mother in the pew next to them, they may be doing it because they got drunk and took a girl home from the bar, they may have simply let their mind wander during the gospel. Maybe someone hasn’t been to confession in 3 years. Some of them are probably sorry. Some of them probably aren’t. It’s not necessarily our job to decide who is sorry, and it’s never been the Priest/Eucharistic Minister’s job to say, “wait, why are we blessing you instead of giving you Communion?” and I think the Pope’s message is simply that receiving a blessing (as blessings can be administered to crowds of hundreds) doesn’t necessarily require you to be in a state of grace as does the reception of a sacrament (which is more or less something that has been the teaching as long as I’ve been alive (see above)).

No where in the teaching does he seem to confuse even the importance of receiving a blessing as on par with any of the sacraments (drawing a clear distinction between them actually), nor does he equate the reception of a blessing with forgiveness or acceptance of the sin.


Until it is clarified why someone who may not receive communion would otherwise be OK with receiving a blessing, I am going to have a hard time finding the controversy in the original statement. If any priest were to say something like, “I bless you for being in a homosexual union,” then he should be quickly relieved of his duties and probably his membership to the church in general. Any chance you could shed some light there? And I’m trying to be sincere. You have accused me of rationalizing once, but I honestly do not understand where the difference here is.

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I forget. What did Jesus think of the tax collectors and prostitutes, and what was the clergy at the time’s opinion on Jesus’s interactions with them?

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You do forget that part at the end where he admonished the sinners, “Go and sin no more.”

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It means that this pope is a false pope.

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ironic considering the pope has no meaning to Christ. the entire position is false.