re: Pope, we must avoid rigid ideologies

The Bible is the literal word of God. The Pope is an Apostate that will face judgement for every false word spoken.

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If only those whom He elects unto salvation will call on His name, then what's the point of witnessing?

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What’s the point of worshipping at all? God has either damned you to hell before you were born or will force you to believe because he can’t be wrong about you going to heaven.

Martin Luther understood this ages ago.

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I can’t say. I don’t know of any

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Get out more.

Oh here ya go....

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Over 25% of Methodist churches abandon denomination as schism grows over LGBTQ+ issues

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There are babies a span long in hell.

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-John Calvin

John Calvin is Wrong

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2 Samuel 12, King David’s newborn son fell terminally ill. After seven days, the child died. In verses 22 and 23, the Bible records that David said: “While the child was alive, I fasted and wept; for I said, ‘Who can tell whether the Lord will be gracious to me, that the child may live?’ But now he is dead; why should I fast? Can I bring him back again? I shall go to him, but he shall not return to me.” It is clear that David’s dead infant son would never return to this Earth, but David also said that one day, he would go to be with his son. Through inspiration, David documented that his own eternal destination was going to be “in the house of the Lord” (Psalm 23:6). Therefore, we can conclude that “the house of the Lord” would be the eternal destination of his infant son to whom David would one day go.

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Furthermore, Jesus said in Matthew 18:3-5: Assuredly, I say to you, unless you are converted and become as little children, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven. Therefore whoever humbles himself as this little child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven. Whoever receives one little child like this in My name receives Me. And in Luke 18:16-17, Jesus remarked: “Let the little children come to Me, and do not forbid them; for of such is the kingdom of God. Assuredly, I say to you, whoever does not receive the kingdom of God as a little child will by no means enter it.” Therefore, we have been given a specific example in the Old Testament of an infant who died and would live forever in heaven. And Jesus Christ Himself, in the New Testament, stated that little children retain the qualities that make a person eligible to inherit the kingdom of God. We see, then, that infants and small children that die are in a safe state, and will live eternally in heaven.

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Well of course David won’t think his baby is in Hell. Jews don’t believe in Hell

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Ok, so do you believe in these doctrines? Kinda my point in asking this question, as I seem to remember you saying you are or your viewpoints are similar to calvinism.

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Yes, I do. I believe the "Calvinist" framework of soteriology, also called the "doctrines of grace".

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1) Total Depravity. I think the key difference between Catholic and Calvinist teaching is that we can cooperate with God's grace and Calvinist seem to suggest that we cannot resist God's grace, as I will talk about later. As I mentioned with my drowning example. We can't save ourselves from drowning but God reaches out his hand to us, and he saves us, but we can reject his grace. Another thing is while we are sinful, we are in our most simple nature good. God created us, he cannot create something evil, therefore man in himself is good. However because of sin and original sin, our nature is curropted.

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A couple of things here. Total depravity is the notion that the fall of man so affected our being that even our wills are corrupted. We are incapable of pleasing God, loving God, and doing anything morally good (including obeying God by having faith in Christ) without God first making us spiritually alive. The Bible teaches that man is spiritually dead (thus, totally depraved) while Arminianism (which Rome teaches in its own way) doesn't see man as spiritually dead, but spiritually sick and capable of choosing to believe in Jesus in our own power.

All the other points stand or fall on this one. If man is not spiritually dead without God's saving grace, then God's election would be based on man's free choice rather than God's free choice; Jesus would not have a specific people in mind that He was saving on the cross but would have only made salvation possible through His work (and also theoretically He could have died in vain for a people who wouldn't choose Him); that God's grace could be resisted and frustrated (making man sovereign, not God); and that man could lose his salvation even if he attained it (if we can choose to believe at one time, we can choose not to believe another later).

So the concept of total depravity or free will is really the lynch pin in this chain.

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2) unconditional election. Certainly nothing we do merits salvation, that would be pelagianism that states we can merit our own salvation. The key mistake here is that God chooses some but not others.

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The Scriptures plainly teach election, which means that God certainly does "choose" some and not others. This isn't really debatable without ignoring the Bible altogether, but the debate is about what basis God uses to choose or elect: does God choose to He will save based on His free and sovereign choice (Calvinism) or does He choose based on what He sees what others will do (Arminianism)? Is it's God's choice or man's choice? I believe the Scriptures clearly teach that it is God that is sovereign over all things (including salvation), not man.

It also follows that if man's will is corrupted (totally depraved) and man is spiritually dead, that if God looks down the corridors of time (as it's commonly stated) to see what man would choose, He would see man choosing to hate Him and reject the offer of salvation every time because man is incapable in and of himself to do so due to his spiritual deadness. It's why man must be "born again" (man can't make himself be born again).

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3) Limited Atonement, this is maybe too much to get into in this thread, but again we hold Jesus died for all but some reject his grace. There is also the issue of penal substitution vs satisfaction, but this may beyond what we are talking about here.

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If Jesus paid the debt for everyone, then no one owes anything. Jesus' infinite sacrifice was enough to pay for the sins of all people, so if He died for everyone, then everyone should be saved. On the cross, Jesus actually bore sin. He didn't bear sin hypothetically.

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4) Irresitable grace, if we hold to this teaching than where does freedom stand? If we can't resist God's grace than how are we free?

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This doctrine is about regeneration. The baby has no say about its birth, and we have no say in the new birth. The dead have no say in their resurrection, and the spiritually dead have no say in their spiritual resurrection This is a passive act: we receive the new birth and we receive the spiritual resurrection; we can't reject it because it happens without our ability to say otherwise. The question is what that new birth "does".

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5) Perserverance of the Saints. Simply put this is another way to say we can't lose our salvation. Catholics disagree, and this goes again to freedom and if we can resist God's grace.

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If God is the one who makes spiritually dead people alive based on His free choice to save them, then He will keep them from falling away.

Your choice of words regarding freedom highlights the primary difference between the Calvinist (biblical) view and the Arminian or anti-calvinist view: is God sovereign or is man? Is God free or is man? You expressed concern more than once for the freedom of man, but did you ask about God's freedom? Is God free to love whom He wants in a special way or is He not? Is He free choose a people for Himself or is He not? The nation of Israel is a picture of the realized Church, and Israel was chosen by God out of the nations as a special people and bride for Himself, based not on anything in herself but based on God's free choice to set His love on her. He reminded Israel of this by telling her that she was no better, bigger, stronger, or more deserving than the other nations, and Paul understood this when in Romans 9, he discusses God's plan of election to choose according to His will and purpose.

If all things are to be done for the glory of God, which gives God the most glory even in salvation? I believe the biblical view is that God is glorified in monergistically showing mercy by saving a people who were His enemies and didn't want anything to do with Him except to replace Him with gods of their own making before He gave them a heart of flesh after removing their heart of stone. That is what brings God glory and what compels people to worship such a gracious savior.

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How you like those lesbian pastors at your Protestant churches?

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It's a sin and a disgrace to Christ for women to be pastors, even more so unrepentant lesbians. It's a mockery of Christ.

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Today the Church remembers what we call the Holy Innocents, those 2 and under boys killed by Herod as told by Matthew 2:16. What is the eternal state of those souls? 2 year olds can't choose Jesus, but would a loving merciful God condemn infants to hell even though they had no choice and in an indirect way died for Christ?

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The Bible teaches that children are made holy by having believing parents (1 Cor. 7:14). David believed he would see his dead infant again one day in that he would go to be with him.

I believe there is warrant to assume that God will show mercy on the children of His people. Children of believing parents are baptized in Presbyterian churches because the promise of salvation is "to you and your children..." (Acts 2:39) and the covenant sign of baptism is given to children of covenant members in the Church for the same reason that the sign of the old covenant was given to male children of covenant members in Israel. The natural way the Church is grown is by evangelism to the world and through evangelism in the home (children of Christian parents being raised in the Lord and carrying on the faith).

Because God does work through families and salvation is of God's free choice, not man's, I do believe that God does sovereignly bless children of Christians with saving grace if they die in infancy.

I don't believe that God saves all children that die in infancy (or youth, generally). For one, God works through Christian families and blesses children as being part of the covenant community, but those blessings aren't given to all people everywhere. Second, God is under no obligation to save anyone, even children. Just because children are cute and precious to us doesn't mean they are more valuable or worthy of salvation to God than a teenager or young adult or an elderly adult. Thirdly, God has included children in His temporal judgements historically, including in the great flood and when God's people were clearing out the Promised Land from tribes that were God's enemies; the children were not to be spared. Lastly, if all that is required to go to Heaven is to die as a child, then abortion should be met with mixed emotions, and we at least be partially thankful for the children dying throughout the world in non-Christian areas, because that means they get a free ticket to Heaven while their parents and older siblings are going to Hell for having the unfortunate privilege of living.

God is not obligated to save anyone, even children, but I believe He does show mercy to children of believers just like He shows mercy in saving their parents.