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re: Official US/Israel vs Iran war thread
Posted on 6/18/26 at 10:43 am to hawgfaninc
Posted on 6/18/26 at 10:43 am to hawgfaninc
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.@VP: "You're talking about billions and billions of nuclear infrastructure that the U.S. destroyed. In order for them to rebuild that program, they would have to get a lot of money — and we have them in an economic chokehold right now that we're not going to release until they fundamentally change their behavior... That would mean a real inspections regime. That would mean a real enforcement regime. That would mean the destruction of their enriched stockpile."
Posted on 6/18/26 at 10:45 am to hawgfaninc
Posted on 6/18/26 at 10:46 am to hawgfaninc
Posted on 6/18/26 at 10:47 am to hawgfaninc
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Part of the huge disconnect about the deal, which is a recurring problem with Trump and normal people, is that Trump doesn't see the deal the way we see the deal. It's provisional and contingent to him. You can see this reflected in almost everything he says about it.
The reason for this is that Trump is extremely high-agency, and extremely high-agency people don't worry about making mistakes or whatever else and just do things that seem plausibly good and savvy, which Trump is also very good at.
They do this because they know if things go wrong, they'll just do something else because they're extremely high-agency and extremely confident in their abilities.
A good fighter doesn't get in the ring concerned about if the guy is going to fight in a way he doesn't really expect. He gets in the ring confident in his ability to fight and to adapt to the conditions he's faced with. He "goes according to the situation."
Trump is a good fighter. He goes according to the situation. He doesn't really care much about what's on paper beyond how he can use it in the current play to get advantage and the next play to gain another advantage, even if that means dropping the deal (and bombs).
It's extremely hard to understand this when you prefer guidelines, contracts, certainty. It's even harder to abide it when you feel like you, yourself, are stuck in a dangerous low-agency position with what appears to be a mad king making fatal errors that impact you and yours.
I said something like this yesterday to someone, and the reply was, "you're giving Trump a lot of credit." Well, yeah. Trump's earned a lot of credit, frankly, and in many cases it was by being extremely high-agency Trump while the world bit its nails and melted down ("Rocket Man, everything is gonna be alright... Rocket Man...").
I think it's a good time to breathe and let the man's agency work a bit. If it goes as badly as people fear, there's plenty of time later to hang it around JD's neck and seize a different victory from the jaws of defeat.
Posted on 6/18/26 at 10:53 am to hawgfaninc
Trump is effectively trusting the Ayatollah to negotiate in good faith. The odds are he’s going to get burned and we’re going to go right back to square one.
Posted on 6/18/26 at 10:53 am to klrstix
quote:
It seems rather naive for the Arab world to think (as it seems to be the case..) that they can just ignore the neighborhood idiots and sooner or later they will go away...
What the other Gulf states should be concerned about (I assume they are) is Iran's alliance with China. In a world without China's support, Iran's ability to develop conventional and nuclear weapons, fund foreign militia, threaten the SOH, threaten their neighbors, would have been much less than what they actually were, and to a lesser extent still are.
The other Gulf states also know that China has a huge foreign energy dependency, largest oil and natural gas importer in the world by a very large margin. When an energy deficient giant starts creating an aggressive, powerful authoritarian attack dog in your energy abundant neighborhood, feeding them weapons materiel and technology, it doesn't take a great logical leap to deduce that their intentions may be hostile. Throw in the fact that China is developing a major overland trade route, as part of the Belt and Road project, that passes directly through Tehran and it should give Middle East energy producers plenty of reason for concern.
This post was edited on 6/18/26 at 11:32 am
Posted on 6/18/26 at 11:01 am to hawgfaninc
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Posted on 6/18/26 at 11:02 am to hawgfaninc
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For all the pundits and influencers pushing the lie that the United States is giving billions to Iran: watch this.
You’re lying.
@VP sets the record straight:
"The only way the Iranians get any of those resources, not a single penny by the way from the United States of America under any circumstances, but the only way that they would ever get any benefit of the bargain is if they comply fully and change their behavior. So you really have a win/win situation for the United States of America."
Posted on 6/18/26 at 11:03 am to hawgfaninc
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NOW: "Joy Behar is way tougher than the Iranians, and she and I are best friends now."
VP Vance jokes about being a battle-tested negotiator after making it through his appearance on 'The View.'
Vance also says he's not worried about Trump blaming him if talks with Iran "go sideways," saying he knows the president was only making a joke.
Posted on 6/18/26 at 11:04 am to hawgfaninc
Posted on 6/18/26 at 11:07 am to hawgfaninc
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.@VP: "I've seen skeptics of the deal, people say, 'the Iranians will never change their behavior!' Well, maybe that's true, and if so, they don't get ANY of the benefits of the bargain—but isn't it worth trying? Isn't it worth seeing whether this incredibly weakened position that @POTUS has put the Iranians under... motivates them to change their behavior?"
Posted on 6/18/26 at 11:11 am to hawgfaninc
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VP @JDVance just nuked the warmongers lying about the MOU:
"It's a misrepresentation of the MOU ... the idea that they get benefits before they change their behavior is fundamentally a talking point that is issued by people who want the conflict to continue indefinitely despite the fact that that's not good for the American people."
AMERICA FIRST!
Posted on 6/18/26 at 11:12 am to hawgfaninc
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.@VP: "We destroyed a substantial number of their ballistic missiles and their ballistic missile launchers... all @POTUS said yesterday is that of course countries don't give up the right of self defense...but we do expect that it's part of the final deal—they are not going to be able to build the kind of missiles that can broadly threaten the entire world."
Posted on 6/18/26 at 11:14 am to hawgfaninc
Vance just fricked Bibi on National TV
Posted on 6/18/26 at 11:41 am to hawgfaninc
Posted on 6/18/26 at 11:51 am to ArHog
quote:
Vance just fricked Bibi on National TV
This anti-Israel drivel is possibly the dumbest, most ignorant nonsense ever espoused on this board. Israel is probably our most important single ally for one reason: The day Israel is no longer our ally is the day China and Russia start assuming control of the Middle East, using Iran as their proxy and/or forward operating base. China already has great influence as the largest destination for Persian Gulf oil. If Russia and China gain control of ME oil flows, combined with China's global trade position and Russia's oil reserves, they would have significant leverage over Europe, Africa and all of Asia. Anyone who claims that the ascent of China/Russia in the ME would not be a massive threat to the United States' economic, military, and geopolitical status is either dumb as a rock or a paid foreign propagandist.
This post was edited on 6/18/26 at 7:21 pm
Posted on 6/18/26 at 12:02 pm to BayouBengal51
If this is true then Israel needs to blast away. Hopefully this will cancel the agreement and we start blasting away again.
Posted on 6/18/26 at 12:07 pm to RetiredSaintsLsuFan
quote:
If this is true then Israel needs to blast away. Hopefully this will cancel the agreement and we start blasting away again.
Part of the MOU is that all parties, including their allies and proxies are to respect each others sovereignty and cease action on all fronts. Hezbollah has never stopped firing missiles, rockets and drones into Israel for one day since Sunday and they won't stop anytime soon. As a result, Israel will not stop with airstrikes and military action in Lebanon.
Trump and the IRGC can bitch all they want, but neither of their allies will stop attacking any time soon. Israel will keep defending itself and killing muzzie terrorists and Hezbollah will keep attacking Israel at the behest of the IRGC and their Jihadist philosophy.
Posted on 6/18/26 at 12:10 pm to RetiredSaintsLsuFan
Blasting away the weapons we provide. I wish them luck with that.
Posted on 6/18/26 at 12:36 pm to 1999
Israel has to defend itself. What would we do? Trump Knows fully well Iran isn't going to honor this agreement and I think he's consolidating support from the other mid east countries. Iran is going to get what they deserve and the other mid east countries will support that remedy. Israel playing their role. My opinion.
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