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re: NJ challenging EO to end birth right citizenship

Posted on 1/23/25 at 9:58 pm to
Posted by ell_13
Member since Apr 2013
87962 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 9:58 pm to
quote:

I'm consistent in my analysis
False. If you are a textualist as you claim, then the jurisdiction piece wouldn’t only apply to diplomats as it currently does. It would apply to anyone here temporarily: people visiting on vacation, people here illegally, etc. Just because it hasn’t been applied as written, doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be discussed. In fact, quite the opposite.
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476171 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 9:59 pm to
quote:

I’m saying there are long standing exceptions to ju soli that have been upheld by lower courts.


Ones that fall in line with Wong (like the hostile occupation one you cited)

You made a specific argument about territorial waters and then posted a link to something that completely disagreed with you. You've yet to explain this.

quote:

You keep leaning on Wong

It's the literal law of the land with almost 130 years of appellate jurisprudence confirming and strengthening the ruling.

You say "leaning" like I'm doing something controversial or against the grain when I'm just stating the law.

quote:

there’s a strong constitutional case here.

You'd think one appellate court in 130 years would agree with you.
Posted by Jbird
Shoot the tires out!
Member since Oct 2012
90391 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 9:59 pm to
His deep legal go to..

That's irrelevant.
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476171 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 10:00 pm to
quote:

Tell that to the courts that consider this EO.

Like the one with a Republican judge who immediately enjoined it and effectively laughed at it?
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476171 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 10:00 pm to
quote:

If you are a textualist as you claim, then the jurisdiction piece wouldn’t only apply to diplomats as it currently does. It would apply to anyone here temporarily:

That's not how people of the time understood the words

See: Wong Kim Ark

Posted by tigersownall
Thibodaux
Member since Sep 2011
16977 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 10:01 pm to
So you’re not disagreeing to being a pedophile?
Posted by SammyTiger
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Feb 2009
79393 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 10:02 pm to
Scalia on gay right and weed is a different person than scalia on anything else.
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476171 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 10:02 pm to
quote:

His deep legal go to..

That's irrelevant.


Showing why arguments are irrelevant is important in actual legal rhetoric.

Lots of lawyers slam the proverbial table in briefs.
Posted by Vacherie Saint
Member since Aug 2015
47536 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 10:02 pm to
quote:

effectively laughed at it?


Watch me do Slo shite.


LIIIINK?
Posted by Jbird
Shoot the tires out!
Member since Oct 2012
90391 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 10:03 pm to
So claiming irrelevance is a win!

That's easy
Posted by Vacherie Saint
Member since Aug 2015
47536 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 10:03 pm to
You are an awful fricking lawyer.

There’s no way you do anything useful in the field with the time you spend on here trolling.
Posted by Dandy Chiggins
Member since Jan 2021
795 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 10:04 pm to
Agree;

Also,
WKA parents were Chinese laborers who were legal residents who had entered the country legally; but not citizens.
Illegal aliens are not legal residents, and have not entered legally. That’s a pretty big difference.

In WKA the Court reasoned that the phrase "subject to the jurisdiction" meant being within the complete allegiance and obedience of the United States, which included those present legally in the US.

And; before arguments about the 2 specific exceptions from WKA, those exceptions are for those who are legally in the country at the time of their child’s birth (ex. A diplomat); not for those who are here illegally. Citizenship status of children of Illegal immigrants wasn’t decided in WKA.
Posted by Jbird
Shoot the tires out!
Member since Oct 2012
90391 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 10:04 pm to
Hold on let me help.

That's irrelevant!
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476171 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 10:04 pm to
quote:

Watch me do Slo shite.


LIIIINK?


That was easy

quote:

“I’ve been on the bench for over four decades, I can’t remember another case where the question presented is as clear as this one is. This is a blatantly unconstitutional order,” Coughenour, an appointee of Ronald Reagan, said from the bench. “There are other times in world history where we look back and people of goodwill can say where were the judges, where were the lawyers?”

Coughenour, speaking to a standing-room-only courtroom in downtown Seattle, interrupted before Brett Shumate, a Justice Department attorney, could even complete his first sentence.

“In your opinion is this executive order constitutional?” he asked.

Said Shumate, “It absolutely is.”

“Frankly, I have difficulty understanding how a member of the bar could state unequivocally that this is a constitutional order,” Coughenour said. “It just boggles my mind.”
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476171 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 10:05 pm to
quote:

You are an awful fricking lawyer.



Posted by Vacherie Saint
Member since Aug 2015
47536 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 10:06 pm to
Still not seeing the “effective laughter” but his ruling means very little in the grand scheme. But I guess you’ll have to learn this the hard way.
Posted by ell_13
Member since Apr 2013
87962 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 10:06 pm to
quote:

That's not how people of the time understood the words
Oh really?



“This will not, of course, include persons born in the United States who are foreigners, aliens, etc”
Posted by momentoftruth87
Your mom
Member since Oct 2013
86110 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 10:07 pm to
He’s not wrong, you offer discount divorces and there’s a reason why you do that instead of excelling in your profession.
Posted by JoeHackett
Member since Aug 2016
5171 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 10:07 pm to
quote:

Like the one with a Republican judge


He's a Republican or are you assuming that because he was appointed by Reagan?
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476171 posts
Posted on 1/23/25 at 10:07 pm to
quote:

And; before arguments about the 2 specific exceptions from WKA, those exceptions are for those who are legally in the country at the time of their child’s birth (ex. A diplomat); not for those who are here illegally.


This is patently not true.

The concept of "being here illegally" did not exist at the time.

quote:

Citizenship status of children of Illegal immigrants wasn’t decided in WKA.

Only if you make shite up like the above quote.
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