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re: Liberals Please Answer...If ACA is so good..
Posted on 2/11/14 at 10:31 am to DontCare
Posted on 2/11/14 at 10:31 am to DontCare
quote:He didn't need a single fricking R vote so how could that possibly be an excuse?
of course they own it. the whole point is that, when obama took office, the GOP openly vowed to obstruct and resist his every move.
0
Posted on 2/11/14 at 10:32 am to DeltaDoc
The NYT had an interesting take. Liberals are good at ideas but they're not good at implementing them. That's why so many professors are liberals but so many governors are conservatives.
Posted on 2/11/14 at 10:33 am to DeltaDoc
I have no idea why he keeps delaying his own damned law. Millions of kids are dying before our very eyes while we stand idly by. We passed the mother of all laws five years ago to end the suffering and madness.
Posted on 2/11/14 at 10:34 am to Zach
quote:
The NYT had an interesting take. Liberals are good at ideas but they're not good at implementing them. That's why so many professors are liberals but so many governors are conservatives
An idea is not a plan
Posted on 2/11/14 at 10:34 am to DontCare
quote:
of course they own it. the whole point is that, when obama took office, the GOP openly vowed to obstruct and resist his every move
How many times does it have to be said? ZERO GOP votes. They were an irrelevant factor in the entire debate. I have no idea what your point is here? The ACA is failing because the GOP hated it and tried to repeal it?
Posted on 2/11/14 at 10:36 am to Draconian Sanctions
quote:Obviously because its not single payor? Yet...
I'm a liberal and i don't like the ACA at all, albeit for very different reasons than conservatives.
Posted on 2/11/14 at 10:36 am to UncleFestersLegs
quote:
The ACA is failing because the GOP hated it and tried to repeal it?
Like I said earlier, we are arguing with demented people. Who is crazier?
Posted on 2/11/14 at 10:37 am to Antonio Moss
quote:
Do you know how medical costs are set at the beginning of the fiscal year in the vast majority of health care systems?
It's all based on the Medicare reimbursement rate. The government's set price is what dictates reimbursement to private insurers.
healthcare costs billed to private insurance are much, much higher than medicare rates. here's the wiki page for hospital chargemasters. i think you'd be interested to see how you're charged for your healthcare services and why they're so much higher than medicare.
Posted on 2/11/14 at 10:40 am to DontCare
quote:
it isn't a "false dilemma" to say that "government overreach" has been fetishized. the only possible alternatives to western governance are either eastern governance or a hypothetical libertarian governance, which has not effectively ever existed.
Sure it is. Just because the ACA is a bloated, crony-capitalist piece of shite doesnt mean I want all building codes removed.
Posted on 2/11/14 at 10:44 am to UncleFestersLegs
quote:
Sure it is. Just because the ACA is a bloated, crony-capitalist piece of shite doesnt mean I want all building codes removed.
that is not the point i was making. my point was that "government overreach" is a political fetish that is applied too broadly. don't get so blustered.
Posted on 2/11/14 at 10:51 am to DontCare
quote:
of course they own it. the whole point is that, when obama took office, the GOP openly vowed to obstruct and resist his every move.
So, if the GOP went along with everything Obama wanted the ACA would be going along swimmingly? Really? This may be the stupidest position I've seen on this board in months.
Posted on 2/11/14 at 10:55 am to Zach
quote:
So, if the GOP went along with everything Obama wanted the ACA would be going along swimmingly? Really? This may be the stupidest position I've seen on this board in months.
no, but if they had participated in the process, rather than opposing it wholesale, they could have made contributions that, i think, would have made the law better. but they didn't do that.
Posted on 2/11/14 at 10:58 am to DontCare
quote:
they could have made contributions that, i think, would have made the law better
Like what?
Posted on 2/11/14 at 11:03 am to DontCare
quote:
healthcare costs billed to private insurance are much, much higher than medicare rates. here's the wiki page for hospital chargemasters.
Chargemasters are not what is billed to the insurance company. Look at a bill from your insurance next time. There is a major reduction under your "network" which reflects the difference in the charge master and the actual amount billed. Your wiki page even acknowledges that chargemasters are regarded as a fiscal fiction by payers.
quote:
i think you'd be interested to see how you're charged for your healthcare services and why they're so much higher than medicare.
Actually, most of my costs in a recent, expensive medical ordeal came out lower than Medicare reimbursements rates.
There are two aspects to look at when discussing costs effects on private insurers because of Medicare. You have to look at the initial set cost and the reimbursement rate. Medicare's initial costs set the guidelines in most healthcare systems in what to charge private insurers. But the lower reimbursement rate (especially with Medicaid) has a tremendous negative effect on private insurers and providers that are left with unpaid costs.
Posted on 2/11/14 at 11:14 am to DontCare
quote:Ignorance. They were effectively locked out of the amendment process, by the use of reconciliation rules.
no, but if they had participated in the process, rather than opposing it wholesale, they could have made contributions that, i think, would have made the law better. but they didn't do that.
Do you believe in the Big Bad Wolf too?
This post was edited on 2/11/14 at 11:16 am
Posted on 2/11/14 at 11:23 am to DeltaDoc
I don't think you're going to get any liberal to say they agree with ACA in it's entirety. I agree with some of the subsidies, less so with the medicaid expansion, and not at all with the restrictions on plans. Open exchanges with actual choices and freedom to choose plans with moderate subsidies would have been preferable to me, and probably a lot of other people. The Democratic party wanted control, and they risked this entire clusterfrick for it.
Posted on 2/11/14 at 11:30 am to Antonio Moss
quote:
Chargemasters are not what is billed to the insurance company. Look at a bill from your insurance next time. There is a major reduction under your "network" which reflects the difference in the charge master and the actual amount billed. Your wiki page even acknowledges that chargemasters are regarded as a fiscal fiction by payers.
there was a really good article in TIME called Bitter Pill about healthcare costs. it detailed how chargemasters are aware of the upfront charge limits that private insurers are willing to pay and they base their charges upon that. so, if they know that blue cross will only pay 80%, and the chargemaster wants to receive 80 cents, then they charge $1 rather than charge 80 cents and only receiving 80% of that.
Posted on 2/11/14 at 11:33 am to Taxing Authority
quote:
Ignorance. They were effectively locked out of the amendment process, by the use of reconciliation rules.
can you provide a link that shows a proposed amendment or change that a republican was barred from putting on the table? i'm not patronizing you, i'm just interested to see how they wanted to contribute but were prevented.
Posted on 2/11/14 at 11:33 am to DontCare
quote:
there was a really good article in TIME called Bitter Pill about healthcare costs. it detailed how chargemasters are aware of the upfront charge limits that private insurers are willing to pay and they base their charges upon that.
providers charging what their customers are willing to pay? Imagine that! What else would they base their charges on? Posted on 2/11/14 at 11:38 am to DontCare
quote:Just google reconciliation rules if you want to see how he amendment process is limited to committees (all of which were controlled by democrats).
can you provide a link that shows a proposed amendment or change that a republican was barred from putting on the table? i'm not patronizing you, i'm just interested to see how they wanted to contribute but were prevented.
I don't give two ishts about intent. No substantive amendment was possible. Why would expect them to be proposed? Proposed to whom? Sky God?
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