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Started By
Message
re: Joe Biden did not ignore/defy the Supreme Court re: Student Loans
Posted on 2/12/25 at 9:52 am to DGuillory
Posted on 2/12/25 at 9:52 am to DGuillory
quote:
Magazis are sheep in an echo chamber.
They're just like the liberals they attack.
If their guy does it, yay.
Same thing other side, yay.
::deep breath::: ... REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!! OMB!!!!!!!
- You & SFP
0
Posted on 2/12/25 at 9:52 am to lsu777
quote:
Exactly so it’s very much up in the air if they have the ability to do so
No. One concurrence that has been ignored thereafter does not indicate many people other than Thomas agree. It appears 8 do not agree with him, in fact (or else he'd have someone join his concurrence or pick up the torch in later cases, which didn't happen).
Posted on 2/12/25 at 9:53 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:the public pays for all of this shite. Damn right release it to the public
I've never seen an audit before where random, curated spending is released publicly
Posted on 2/12/25 at 9:53 am to Ingeniero
quote:I wonder how many of these people that need to rack up 10 years of service are seeing their jobs eliminated as part of government downsizing and wasteful spending?
This is actually a good program and helps the government compete with private industry for good employees. Can't match the salary, but relieving loan debt in return for 10 years of service is a good trade-off to attract something other than bottom of the barrel applicants.
Posted on 2/12/25 at 9:54 am to slidingstop
quote:
from my observations, you've been wearing the same outfit for years.
Stop staring at me, creep.
Posted on 2/12/25 at 9:55 am to UncleFestersLegs
quote:
the public pays for all of this shite. Damn right release it to the public
In a final form.
The OIG has many examples of full audits of various things in government, if you want to see how they're typically delivered.
Nobody is against audit reports being released publicly, and my post specifically referenced "random, curated" data.
Posted on 2/12/25 at 9:58 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:In what way is it a straw man?
If it's a straw man, the rest of the post is invalid.
Simply because you declare it to be so?
quote:I am using the actual numbers from actual data, not merely your “gut feeling” based on your views of the legal profession you live within and survive off of.
Again, there is a major assumption baked into this declarative statement.
There is no assumption made.
If these were SOP, I would expect the same rate of usage between both parties.
Hell, with the hyper-politicization of both parties, I would expect numbers that were even somewhat close.
See, in your inability to focus on context or minutiae, you appear to assume that I stated that TROs aren’t used by the right at all, which if you had actually read through my entire earlier post, you would seen the opposite.
But in your infinitely self-aggrandizing, you stop after one line to make a point that isn’t even applicable.
This is why I usually don’t even bother.
This post was edited on 2/12/25 at 9:59 am
Posted on 2/12/25 at 9:59 am to JellyRoll
quote:
Shut up dude. I will take him at his word on this that he defied the Supreme Court. As we are learning through the unwrapping of the corruption of spending funds, there are many ways to fund his student loan forgiveness plan.
The Washington Post had an opinion piece on this very topic just yesterday titled No, Biden did not defy a Supreme Court order. What's funny is that during the campaign, he was shown as the tough guy standing up to the Supreme Court when he said,
"The Supreme Court blocked my original plan to help more than 40 million working- and middle-class American students get relief,” he added in July. “But they couldn’t stop me.”
He then said
“I promised to ease student debt for millions of folks,” he said in January on X. “The Supreme Court blocked me, but it didn’t stop me.”
Articles from Town Hall, the Boston Globe, and others proclaimed that Biden was "Defying the Supreme Court!" to show how tough he was. Now, as we are in Trumps term, it becomes "nuanced", that he really wasn't defying the court order, and that he didn't mean it that way. That's why people get so tuned out to these kinds of discussions. Meanings change when it suits a particular political purpose.
Town Hall
MSN/Fox
Boston Globe
Posted on 2/12/25 at 9:59 am to SlowFlowPro
Or has the case just never been heard?
Posted on 2/12/25 at 10:02 am to SlowFlowPro
But after the trial?
This shuts down the Executive over nothing but whim and wails.
If one branch wants to shut down another branchs constitutional work it shouldn't be presumed guilty...prove your innocence should it?
This shuts down the Executive over nothing but whim and wails.
If one branch wants to shut down another branchs constitutional work it shouldn't be presumed guilty...prove your innocence should it?
Posted on 2/12/25 at 10:03 am to SlowFlowPro
I already knew all this. Doesn't change the fact that Biden and the democrats went after the judges, smeared their names, said the sc was corrupt and sent death threats to them.
All while bragging that they will do whatever it takes to cancel student loan debt.
All while bragging that they will do whatever it takes to cancel student loan debt.
This post was edited on 2/12/25 at 10:05 am
Posted on 2/12/25 at 10:05 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:yeah the way it's typically done is working great.
how they're typically delivered.
Posted on 2/12/25 at 10:06 am to SlowFlowPro
So you are telling us Mr. Potato head was lying when he bragged about ignoring the SCOTUS? Ok
Posted on 2/12/25 at 10:06 am to Scruffy
quote:
In what way is it a straw man?
Fair point. The term "straw man" may not apply. You may not be reshaping my argument. I'll edit my comment.
If it's a straw man OR is objectively false, the rest of the post is invalid.
quote:
I am using the actual numbers from actual data
You are using data. Your comment was about more than just citing data, as it made an opinion about whether or not the data you're referencing justified the "SOP" of the 2 parties. THAT comment had a major assumption baked into it.
quote:
Hell, with the hyper-politicization of both parties, I would expect numbers that were even close.
Well, and this ties into the referenced assumption above, it depends on the individual EOs and their scope/propriety/legality.
Trump's first admin was very bad about following the law regulating these executive acts, and we're not talking about at the district court level. They routinely lost on appeal for failure to follow the rules. The biggest example was the attempt to reverse DACA. This is largely in part to Trump hiring people from outside of government who simply didn't know how t do things properly.
THIS admin then sets a modern record for EOs in a month, with many of them being released specifically to get challenged (like the birthright citizenship EO).
I spoke about this for the past few years as a huge hope that he learned his lesson the first time and would not fall into the same traps in Trump vol 2.0, but he's clearly just doing the same strategy again. I would specifically reference this in discussions about DOGE during the campaign.
Now, if you engage in fatalism, you'll argue this strategy doesn't matter.
Posted on 2/12/25 at 10:07 am to goatmilker
quote:
But after the trial?
There will be a record and a judgment discussing the variables you referenced that are currently vague.
quote:
If one branch wants to shut down another branchs constitutional work it shouldn't be presumed guilty...prove your innocence should it?
Again, this isn't always working against you. See: Biden vax mandates or the recent BOI/Fincen reporting stuff that was enjoined (and celebrated on here).
This post was edited on 2/12/25 at 10:08 am
Posted on 2/12/25 at 10:10 am to lsu777
quote:
Or has the case just never been heard?
Ignoring the 8-1 status, I think other cases with injunctions have gone to the Supreme Court since that concurrence.
Posted on 2/12/25 at 10:15 am to Stan Switek
quote:
Articles from Town Hall, the Boston Globe, and others proclaimed that Biden was "Defying the Supreme Court!" t
The Boston Globe piece said "Defy", but was an opinion piece (so irrelevant and not reporting)
The TownHall article's author used the language
quote:
Biden defended his defiance of the Supreme Court, stating that his administration acted legally.
While ignoring which law Biden referenced here
quote:
"My Administration is able to deliver relief to these borrowers – and millions more – because of fixes we made to broken student loan programs that were preventing borrowers from getting the relief they were entitled to under the law," he continued.
Hint: it ws PSLF as my OP indicates.
The Fox News article relies on partisans attacking Biden, without referencing Biden "defying" anything.
quote:
On Wednesday, he announced that Savings on Valuable Education (SAVE) plan that cancels debt for enrolled borrowers who have been in repayment for at least 10 years and hold $12,000 or less in student loan debt. Those with larger debts will receive relief after an additional year of payments for every additional $1,000 they borrowed.
If you click the link in that text, it goes to a more specific article
quote:
The Biden administration has previously approved $56.7 billion in debt cancelation for more than 793,000 borrowers through the Public Service Loan Forgiveness (PSLF) program; $45.6 billion for 930,500 borrowers through improvements to income-driven repayment; $11.7 billion for 513,000 borrowers with a total and permanent disability; and $22.5 billion for 1.3 million borrowers through closed school discharges, borrower defense and related court settlements.
Posted on 2/12/25 at 10:19 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
I've never seen an audit before where random, curated spending is released publicly without full context
Come on man!! There's no context that could justify much of what's being made public. It's beyond defending and is obvious waste and fraud. It's indefensible. Any reasonable person doesn't need it to be "provided context".
Posted on 2/12/25 at 10:22 am to lake chuck fan
quote:
Come on man!! There's no context that could justify much of what's being made public. It's beyond defending and is obvious waste and fraud.
Waste? Yes
Fraud? Unlikely
quote:
Any reasonable person doesn't need it to be "provided context".
I think the context you were given is shaping your above views, specifically the incorrect one about fraud, which is part of my point about how this information is being released/spread.
It's also permitting lots of assumptions and literal misinformation (like the stuff about Ben Stiller from a literal propaganda website).
Posted on 2/12/25 at 10:24 am to SlowFlowPro
Slo
Why should any branch of the Government shut down what it believes is constitutional and perhaps for the public good before a single appeal is decided on?
If citizens can remain free until
appeal how on earth cannot a branch of the US government not get like consideration.
Why should any branch of the Government shut down what it believes is constitutional and perhaps for the public good before a single appeal is decided on?
If citizens can remain free until
appeal how on earth cannot a branch of the US government not get like consideration.
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