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re: If college were free, how many more people would have a degree?
Posted on 2/24/20 at 12:05 am to TheCheshireHog
Posted on 2/24/20 at 12:05 am to TheCheshireHog
quote:
You’d definitely have to start doing that here or a bachelors degree becomes equivalent to a high school diploma.
This is what dullards don't get. The reason a college degree historically gave you a big leg up in the job market was because it was exclusive. It set you apart from the masses.
Employers will still want to hire the best and brightest and will always come up with some sort of system to find them.
Giving every single person a welfare college diploma won't magically make them all get great jobs.
Posted on 2/24/20 at 4:21 am to Eli Goldfinger
On another note that's obviously an issue with the U.S. workforce, not enough graduates
Posted on 2/24/20 at 5:13 am to Eli Goldfinger
College professor here! Definitely against free tuition - if there’s no money coming in, there will be no facility upgrades, no quality in teaching or research bc the pay wouldn’t be worth it, etc.
However, I do wish the loan system would be cut drastically and only given to the top 30% of students - at least until the lower students can go through a year of college and show some level of success. The loan system has universities letting in students who have no business even sniffing a college campus.
I have one student now...I’m actually angry that the university would admit her - angry on her behalf because she is getting completely scammed. She can barely form a coherent sentence and has little in the way of comprehension skills - reading or otherwise. Even if she does manage to complete her degree, she won’t be able to get a job that would be any better than if she didn’t go to college. And then she’ll have a massive amount of debt to go along with it.
We have to stop making a college degree this big thing that everyone should have. Society needs blue-collar workers! We need sanitation workers, welders, auto-mechanics, Walmart employees, plumbers, et al.
However, I do wish the loan system would be cut drastically and only given to the top 30% of students - at least until the lower students can go through a year of college and show some level of success. The loan system has universities letting in students who have no business even sniffing a college campus.
I have one student now...I’m actually angry that the university would admit her - angry on her behalf because she is getting completely scammed. She can barely form a coherent sentence and has little in the way of comprehension skills - reading or otherwise. Even if she does manage to complete her degree, she won’t be able to get a job that would be any better than if she didn’t go to college. And then she’ll have a massive amount of debt to go along with it.
We have to stop making a college degree this big thing that everyone should have. Society needs blue-collar workers! We need sanitation workers, welders, auto-mechanics, Walmart employees, plumbers, et al.
Posted on 2/24/20 at 5:16 am to Anastasia Beaverhousen
quote:
I have one student now...I’m actually angry that the university would admit her - angry on her behalf because she is getting completely scammed.
Affirmative action?
Posted on 2/24/20 at 6:15 am to Eli Goldfinger
quote:
If college were free, how many more people would have a degree?
Depends on the school setting a 1.0 GPA as a minimum required to graduate.
Posted on 2/24/20 at 6:20 am to Eli Goldfinger
College isn't right for everyone.
This will be a colossal waste of money...but the Dems never have never cared about this.
This is their chance to take total control of all education.
This will be a colossal waste of money...but the Dems never have never cared about this.
This is their chance to take total control of all education.
Posted on 2/24/20 at 6:22 am to Eli Goldfinger
I think the more important question to ask is why are college degrees necessary for most jobs?
Sure there are a handful where you definitely want someone with a formal education but I'd say 75% of even white collar jobs don't really require a degree even if it's the preference of the employer.
Other than medical, accounting, and engineering what do you really need a 4 year let alone a post graduate degree for? I'm sure I'm missing 1 or 2 things but most jobs you can do without a degree.
Sure there are a handful where you definitely want someone with a formal education but I'd say 75% of even white collar jobs don't really require a degree even if it's the preference of the employer.
Other than medical, accounting, and engineering what do you really need a 4 year let alone a post graduate degree for? I'm sure I'm missing 1 or 2 things but most jobs you can do without a degree.
Posted on 2/24/20 at 6:27 am to Eli Goldfinger
quote:
college were free, how many more people would have a degree?
If college were “free” (tax payer funded tuition), how much higher would college tuition and cost rise? We saw first hand college tuition explode after government guaranteed student loans. If you want to eliminate this “crisis”, then get government out, make the universities guarantee the loans.
Dems love attacking private business or corporations for cost and greed, but dead silent on college tuition and cost rising 77%... most of that since government involvement.
Posted on 2/24/20 at 6:29 am to bstew3006
quote:
If college were “free” (tax payer funded tuition), how much higher would college tuition and cost rise?
Look at medical cost trendlines before and after Medicare. There's your answer (hint: they will explode)
Posted on 2/24/20 at 6:37 am to Eli Goldfinger
quote:
free college isn’t a gateway to more graduates.
This shouldn't be controversial - it is a truism. While there are probably a handful of folks for whom cost is a barrier, most kids who are truly college material (from whatever background) find a way through. Even without parental resources, grants, loans, student jobs, military service, what have you - they just find a way.
If you had "free" college for everyone, you would have even more wastes of oxygen non-matriculating for about a decade after experimenting with gender/ethnic studies, Marxist philosophy, art history, and so forth, and still not complete a degree program. All on the taxpayer dime. Or if they do complete such a program, will bitch that there aren't 6-figure jobs in those fields.
College students need to have some skin in the game.
Now, having said that, colleges have colluded to increase prices proportionally to increases in student aid packages and have successfully perpetrated a scheme on the American taxpayer to extract literally billions (if not trillions) of dollars of public money.
Posted on 2/24/20 at 6:43 am to Ace Midnight
In the mid 1980s, semester tuition at LSU (full time) was $900. Today, that would be $2,118.00.
Actual semester tuition for LSU this Spring?
$5,945.00 (more than double).
This will not improve if "free college for all" becomes a thing.
Actual semester tuition for LSU this Spring?
$5,945.00 (more than double).
This will not improve if "free college for all" becomes a thing.
This post was edited on 2/24/20 at 6:43 am
Posted on 2/24/20 at 6:47 am to Eli Goldfinger
Not a whole lot more. Even if tuition is free, you need a place to live, food, utilities, health insurance, transportation (unless you live close enough to walk).
Taking yourself out of the workforce costs more than community college or even resident tuition for most states.
Taking yourself out of the workforce costs more than community college or even resident tuition for most states.
Posted on 2/24/20 at 6:52 am to Powerman
quote:
I think the more important question to ask is why are college degrees necessary for most jobs?
While there is a lot of truth in this, if you are filling a position, and you’ve got fifty applicants, what is the first cut you are going to make?
Posted on 2/24/20 at 6:53 am to Eli Goldfinger
When things become free they lose their value. Just how it is.
Posted on 2/24/20 at 7:01 am to DiamondDog
quote:
Besides, we already have free college. It’s called joining the service. Been that way for 70+ years
I get the spirit of what you’re saying here and it’s right... except for one thing. Not everyone is allowed to serve. The military does turn people away - many of whom excel at college.
Posted on 2/24/20 at 7:02 am to Eli Goldfinger
They need to make people accountable for TOPs and other free tuition programs.
If they do not complete the course the state or federal government should be able to be reimbursed for the cost of the program that person used plus interest.
The state of federal government should be able to garnish that persons earnings until the debt is paid.
If they do not complete the course the state or federal government should be able to be reimbursed for the cost of the program that person used plus interest.
The state of federal government should be able to garnish that persons earnings until the debt is paid.
Posted on 2/24/20 at 7:04 am to TheCheshireHog
quote:
Does Germany still screen kids out from college around middle school age?
Yes and so does France and many other European countries I’m sure. Personally I’d love to see this solely for the meltdown that would occur when many of these ignorant libs find out that they aren’t able to go to college and are encouraged to go to a vocational school because they aren’t as intelligent as they think they are. Oh and the calls of racism that would occur when minority enrollment drops because the policies they advocated for ultimately harms minority college participation.
Posted on 2/24/20 at 7:05 am to scrooster
quote:Information.
Anything that is free has no value.
Posted on 2/24/20 at 7:07 am to TheCheshireHog
The US needs this sort of system badly. Bring back shop, woodworking, home ec, etc. take the kids that have no business going to college on track to learn a craft. Some crafts offer six figure incomes, and at least on the Gulf Coast, there are shortages of welders, instrument/analyzer techs and such. For the relatively small percentage that do make it through a 4 year college, there are a lot that end up with useless degrees.
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