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Posted on 5/11/14 at 2:12 pm to mmcgrath
quote:
She wants to have sex responsibly,
Sticking other people with the bill != responsible.
quote:
One could also say that sex is natural and not necessarily a "lifestyle choice" for people in their 20's and 30's.
One could also say the earth is flat, but it would be a foolish statement. As would trying to argue with a straight face that nonmarital sex is a medical necessity and not a lifestyle choice.
quote:
Yet that's exactly what they are trying to do.
Wrong. They're taking a hands off approach. She's grown up enough to make her own sexual choices, and she should be grown up enough to take responsibility for her own birth control.
quote:
there is a debate to be had on whether or not religious groups can claim some sort of exclusions from universal healthcare requirements based on their religious beliefs
Sure there's a debate. But you're arguing from a very weak position unless you can show a compelling government interest. Freedom of religion is a explicit, constitutionally protected right. Forcing a specific entity to bankroll your BC prescription is not.
Posted on 5/11/14 at 2:19 pm to Bestbank Tiger
The "abstinence" argument you hear is by far the most idealist position in politics. People are going to have sex, there is no way around it. As a society we should be equipping people with the knowledge and the resources to prevent unwanted pregnancy and the spread of std's.
Posted on 5/11/14 at 2:22 pm to Draconian Sanctions
Agreed, regardless of your position on BC and premarital sex anyone who supports abstinence only programs is an idealistic imbecile.
Posted on 5/11/14 at 2:24 pm to Draconian Sanctions
Knowledge???? So youre saying 16 year olds that are having unprotected sex dont know how babies are made??
Posted on 5/11/14 at 2:28 pm to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
The "abstinence" argument you hear is by far the most idealist position in politics. People are going to have sex, there is no way around it. As a society we should be equipping people with the knowledge and the resources to prevent unwanted pregnancy and the spread of std's.
We've had sex ed in public schools for a long time. And you can get free condoms from the local department of health. And birth control pills are fricking cheap as hell.
Posted on 5/11/14 at 2:34 pm to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
The "abstinence" argument you hear is by far the most idealist position in politics. People are going to have sex, there is no way around it.
I think you're in the wrong thread. The topic at hand is not whether people have sex. It's about sticking society with the bill. And the "idealist" position is refusing to accept the fact that sex can sometimes have undesirable consequences.
Unfortunately, anytime sex, liberals completely lose the capacity for rational thought. Giving someone the freedom to make their own choices, and the responsibility to manage the consequences of those choices, is the very definition of treating someone like an adult. Liberals are stunted adolescents when it comes to sex--they want an anything-goes environment but they want the government to give them a world with padded corners so they don't have to suffer any adverse consequences.
quote:
spread of std's
Those comprehensive sex ed classes worked great for you. Let me equip you with a little knowledge: The birth control pill doesn't prevent STDs.
Posted on 5/11/14 at 2:35 pm to Vols&Shaft83
if we could make sure every woman in this country used the pill until they're graduated with a secondary ed degree and married, i'd have no problem paying for it ...
Posted on 5/11/14 at 2:39 pm to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
The "abstinence" argument you hear is by far the most idealist position in politics. People are going to have sex, there is no way around it. As a society we should be equipping people with the knowledge and the resources to prevent unwanted pregnancy and the spread of std's.
What does the pill, which is the topic at hand, have to do with std's? And are you making the argument that fluke didn't have the knowledge or resources to prevent pregnancy or std's?
Posted on 5/11/14 at 3:05 pm to fleaux
quote:
Knowledge???? So youre saying 16 year olds that are having unprotected sex dont know how babies are made??
The average 16 year old in this country understands very little about protection and the mechanisms behind pregnancy. Knowing sex = babies isnt really adequate.
For instance, lots of teenage girls think standing up after sex will prevent pregnancy. They thinking putting hot sauce in their vagina after sex prevents pregnancy. They think they cant get STDs from oral or anal sex.
The list goes on and on.
Posted on 5/11/14 at 3:21 pm to Roger Klarvin
quote:Bet it works if used before sex
putting hot sauce in their vagina after sex prevents pregnancy
Posted on 5/11/14 at 3:29 pm to NC_Tigah
Ouch
Posted on 5/11/14 at 5:24 pm to mmcgrath
quote:
She wants to have sex responsibly, but the school's exclusion of contraceptive and other benefits restricts her ability to do so.
How?
Nobody is stopping her from seeking out other sources to get birth control abd/or funding for it.
She's just wrong because she wants to force an institution to pay for it against their will because she believes its some godforsaken right.
quote:
One could also say that sex is natural and not necessarily a "lifestyle choice" for people in their 20's and 30's.
What complete bullshite this is.
There are tons of people in their 20's and 30's that don't have sex very often and they do just fine. Sex is absolutely a choice, and people like her want to force people to subsidize a choice that is not essential to her well being. People like fluke are a blood sucker trying to game the system.
quote:
there is a debate to be had on whether or not religious groups can claim some sort of exclusions from universal healthcare requirements based on their religious beliefs.
A debate to force private groups, citizens and institutions to conform to standards they object to you mean.
This post was edited on 5/11/14 at 5:30 pm
Posted on 5/11/14 at 5:28 pm to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
The "abstinence" argument you hear is by far the most idealist position in politics. People are going to have sex, there is no way around it. As a society we should be equipping people with the knowledge and the resources to prevent unwanted pregnancy and the spread of std's.
I agree with you about abstinence. It's an ignorant idea when it comes to sex and it never works because it goes against human nature. The problem here forcing standards on people that don't agree with it under the guise of morality and the greater good.
Posted on 5/11/14 at 5:28 pm to Sentrius
quote:
Sentrius
Basically everything he said.
This hysteria over contraception is nothing more than a manufactured crisis (that doesn't even exist) to further an agenda that somehow, since some people don't think the government should be involved in mandating the provision of birth control, that those people hate women.
It's patently absurd.
This post was edited on 5/11/14 at 5:29 pm
Posted on 5/11/14 at 5:32 pm to GoBigOrange86
It's a mixture of legislating morality for the greater good and putting more power under the umbrella of gov't. Nothing more than that.
Posted on 5/11/14 at 5:35 pm to Sentrius
quote:
It's a mixture of legislating morality for the greater good and putting more power under the umbrella of gov't. Nothing more than that.
It was also a cynical ploy to use social issues to distract people from the horrible economy.
Posted on 5/15/14 at 7:00 pm to Bestbank Tiger
What kind of idiot would vote for her?
Posted on 5/15/14 at 7:09 pm to SavageOrangeJug
If there is 1% chance she could birth a Rex....I'll foot the bill for her total hysterectomy.
Posted on 5/15/14 at 8:16 pm to SavageOrangeJug
Funny...I don't recall Sandra Fluke speaking out against the relentless, sexist personal attacks made by liberals against Hillary Clinton or the Palins. It's only wrong when it happens to her. She represents everything that's wrong with politics.
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