re: How much better off we would all be if the South had been permitted to secede

My southern brothers always leave this out of any discussion of the Civil War.
We bought em and bred them by the millions for one reason. fantastic profit by the elites and aristocracy of the South..

Without the industrial might and population of the north, the south would have been taken over by Mexico or some European power who would be aided by slaves who rose in revolt.

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Doubt it. The north and the west would not have been shackled by a dirt poor, unindustrialized South.

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There were only 34 states at the start of the civil war, the west was for the most part a vast nothingness.

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Even if the south were allowed to secede, the two nations most likely would have kissed, made up and rejoined each other within a couple decades.

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Maybe.

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I wonder if we'd be a member of the Commonwealth of Nations given our past status as a colony and the heavy Anglophilia in places like Virginia, South Carolina and Georgia. 90 years separate SC's secession and the London Declaration, which allowed republics to join the Commonwealth.

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Unless slavery was abolished, IMHO Great Britain wanted no part of allowing the CSA to become a part of the Commonwealth of Great Britain.

However, I do believe that World War One might have ended more early with an ALLIED victory because the CSA would have sent some Divisions over to the Western Front to help Britain and France. When we examine the unique Culture of the American South, we can see that it comes directly from pastoral English Culture of the 18th Century. The Confederate whites felt very close to this English Culture and IMHO they would have been willing to fight alongside British Divisions in WW 1.

The CSA would have helped Britain, not stayed neutral.

We likely would not have morphed into a 20th century superpower and had a robust middle class.
Not really a fan of Spike Lee, but he did a pretty funny mockumentary about 20 years ago centered around if the South had won the war.
Worth watching if you haven’t seen it.

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You are one seriously stupid MF.

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The South had no industry, and agriculture was stagnant. There was no other way the war could have ended, but if the South had won, another power would have come in and swept up the pieces.

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Maybe

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Eh, the idustrial revolution was the death nail to slavery. It was on the way out.

Oil discoveries in West Virginia and south into Oklahoma and Texas would have brought talks to the table.

I feel foreign powers trying to play games in North America would have caused both sides to come back together.

But maybe I am wrong. Who knows. I am glad it ended the way it did.

The Irish were a great asset; the North could easily replace soldiers and weapons, while the South could not. With the blockade preventing the South from receiving much-needed supplies, it was only a matter of time. After some initial struggle, Lincoln finally put capable leaders in charge.

I'm not disparaging the South. I enjoy my visits there, and the people I met were awesome.

Only partially agree. The southern planter class gave us the elite public colleges of the south to educate themselves...LSU, Ole Miss, UNC. The also influenced the creation of southern private schools like Duke, Tulane, Emory, etc. They certainly never intended to educate the common man.

Do agree that the class was mostly disinterested in industrialization since most made their money from the production of their inherited land. The planters who had oil land are another story,