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re: Covid Data --- Correction.. I was wrong
Posted on 9/10/21 at 10:51 pm to Privateer 2007
Posted on 9/10/21 at 10:51 pm to Privateer 2007
quote:Do we really know this if they are lumping in deaths within 14 days of vaccination
Still looks as if "vaccine" has utility in preventing death.
1
Posted on 9/10/21 at 11:05 pm to ChexMix
Fully vaxed equal >14 days post 2nd shot. Unvacinated equals no shots.
Posted on 9/11/21 at 7:17 am to RiverCityTider
The numbers are interesting. RiverCity (I’m in Jax too), are you saying that fully vaxxed includes all people with at least 1 shot? How are those with 1 shot yet not 14 days post-second shot classified? I was under the impression that the Brit and Israeli studies only define fully vaxxed as someone 14 post second shot?
Second, though the article uses percentages to determine the amount of unvaxxed (by excluding minors since they aren’t eligible for the vax), the unvaxxed numbers and deaths aren’t disclosing whether they include minors (who are mostly unvaxxed, but also unlikely to die from covid).
I guess what I’m wondering is whether percentage wise the numbers of unvaxxed adults cases and deaths may be comparable to vaxxed cases and deaths when you discount the minors from the unvaxxed numbers (to be extent the info doesn’t already do that?)
Disclaimer: I did t read bc I’m not clicking on the links.
Second, though the article uses percentages to determine the amount of unvaxxed (by excluding minors since they aren’t eligible for the vax), the unvaxxed numbers and deaths aren’t disclosing whether they include minors (who are mostly unvaxxed, but also unlikely to die from covid).
I guess what I’m wondering is whether percentage wise the numbers of unvaxxed adults cases and deaths may be comparable to vaxxed cases and deaths when you discount the minors from the unvaxxed numbers (to be extent the info doesn’t already do that?)
Disclaimer: I did t read bc I’m not clicking on the links.
This post was edited on 9/11/21 at 7:23 am
Posted on 9/11/21 at 7:29 am to interdesting
What's really interesting is that COVID-19 isn't worthy of even this thread- not to mention the eleventy jillion before it.
People die. It's our nature.
People die. It's our nature.
Posted on 9/11/21 at 7:36 am to RiverCityTider
quote:
Regardless, the death rate looks very low for the unvaxed and no where near a rate that would justify forced vaccinations.
You just said you're already in the 90%
Posted on 9/11/21 at 7:49 am to Gideon Swashbuckler
True, true, true. Covid kills unhealthy and aged folks in the vaaaaaaaaasst majority of cases. That “pandemic” of death has existed since time itself. Yet, we’re ‘worrying’ about that now? But why? Distraction.
Unvaxxed is simply a way of identifying “rebels” to the party line (right now it’s under the guise of safety, in reality it’s the proxy for slavery). Unvaxxed will be hunted down, drained of businesses, money, property, and ultimately their lives. It’s already started with lockdowns to kill small business. Next is the employers’ vaccine or no job ‘choice.’
Next will be freezing bank accounts and taking land (designated as covid breeding grounds, like nuisance properties that can be taken by the government, for less than ‘fair value.’). At that point any people that remain unvaxxed, they will just come and take your kids or kill your families.
They are splitting off people to get vaxxed before the death squats come. By the time the remaining unvaxxed include only those that have survived the “6 point covid plan” to remain unvaxxed, the media won’t report the killings and there won’t be any rebels left to organize against the death squads.
Unvaxxed is simply a way of identifying “rebels” to the party line (right now it’s under the guise of safety, in reality it’s the proxy for slavery). Unvaxxed will be hunted down, drained of businesses, money, property, and ultimately their lives. It’s already started with lockdowns to kill small business. Next is the employers’ vaccine or no job ‘choice.’
Next will be freezing bank accounts and taking land (designated as covid breeding grounds, like nuisance properties that can be taken by the government, for less than ‘fair value.’). At that point any people that remain unvaxxed, they will just come and take your kids or kill your families.
They are splitting off people to get vaxxed before the death squats come. By the time the remaining unvaxxed include only those that have survived the “6 point covid plan” to remain unvaxxed, the media won’t report the killings and there won’t be any rebels left to organize against the death squads.
Posted on 9/11/21 at 7:53 am to RiverCityTider
The simple point is simply vaccinating everyone won’t mean this goes away! Could there be less deaths, yes assuming effectiveness of the vaccine does not wear off or a newer strain “evades” the vaccine.
Either way, having 100% vaccination will not stop that progression.
Either way, having 100% vaccination will not stop that progression.
Posted on 9/11/21 at 7:56 am to RiverCityTider
Death percentage of unvaxxed .002%.
Death percentage of vaxxed .009%.
Looks like being unvaxxed is safer, not that either one justifies all the nonsense going on lately.
Death percentage of vaxxed .009%.
Looks like being unvaxxed is safer, not that either one justifies all the nonsense going on lately.
Posted on 9/11/21 at 9:16 am to Topisawtiger
I corrected the original post because honestly, I thought the ratio of vaxed to unvaxed was about 2 to 1. In reality, 90% of adults are fully vaxed. There simply are not many unvacinated adults. And there are very few unvacinated adults over 50.
Most of the deaths are over 50.
The percentage of deaths to total cases among unvaccinated people over fifty look very bad. Around 7 percent fatality.
Imagine how much worse it is for 60, 70 and 80+ year olds? It's sort of scary.
I don't want to contribute to the misinformation so I have to acknowledge this error in thinking.
And look at the cases under 50 for the unvacinated. There were 213k cases among this group. That compares with 62k cases among the vaxed. That's one in 35(unvaxed) or so versus one in 740 (vaxed).. That's twenty times worse.
The death rate among 50+ unvaccinated tells us that the vax works. The case rate among <50 unvaccinated tells us that the unvacinated are spreading the disease at a faster rate.
It still seems to me that a more rational approach would be to vaccinate the old, be it 50+, 60+ or whatever,and allow the young to achieve natural immunity.
Older people should be strongly encouraged to get vaccinated.
Young people have little to gain in getting it, unless you consider the risk of spreading it to an old person, which is more likely if your not vaccinated.
But morally, it is very defensible to say that the obligation rests with old people to get vaccinated to protect themselves and thereby, not expose younger people to the unknown risks of this experimental drug.
If the Government would focus on telling the truth and not dealing in half truths and dictatorial measures, we would likely be able to persuade those at highest risk to protect themselves.
I am now strongly considering getting vaxed. But one if the things that holds me back is that I don't like Nazis and people who simply wave off the fact that this is a free country where you persuade people, and not threaten them.
And the reason we even have to take a deep dive into British data is because in this country the media spewing garbage and talking points and the people aren't allowed the real facts.
Most of the deaths are over 50.
The percentage of deaths to total cases among unvaccinated people over fifty look very bad. Around 7 percent fatality.
Imagine how much worse it is for 60, 70 and 80+ year olds? It's sort of scary.
I don't want to contribute to the misinformation so I have to acknowledge this error in thinking.
And look at the cases under 50 for the unvacinated. There were 213k cases among this group. That compares with 62k cases among the vaxed. That's one in 35(unvaxed) or so versus one in 740 (vaxed).. That's twenty times worse.
The death rate among 50+ unvaccinated tells us that the vax works. The case rate among <50 unvaccinated tells us that the unvacinated are spreading the disease at a faster rate.
It still seems to me that a more rational approach would be to vaccinate the old, be it 50+, 60+ or whatever,and allow the young to achieve natural immunity.
Older people should be strongly encouraged to get vaccinated.
Young people have little to gain in getting it, unless you consider the risk of spreading it to an old person, which is more likely if your not vaccinated.
But morally, it is very defensible to say that the obligation rests with old people to get vaccinated to protect themselves and thereby, not expose younger people to the unknown risks of this experimental drug.
If the Government would focus on telling the truth and not dealing in half truths and dictatorial measures, we would likely be able to persuade those at highest risk to protect themselves.
I am now strongly considering getting vaxed. But one if the things that holds me back is that I don't like Nazis and people who simply wave off the fact that this is a free country where you persuade people, and not threaten them.
And the reason we even have to take a deep dive into British data is because in this country the media spewing garbage and talking points and the people aren't allowed the real facts.
This post was edited on 9/11/21 at 9:30 am
Posted on 9/11/21 at 9:49 am to interdesting
quote:
on 9/11/21 at 7:17 am to RiverCityTider
The numbers are interesting. RiverCity (I’m in Jax too), are you saying that fully vaxxed includes all people with at least 1 shot? How are those with 1 shot yet not 14 days post-second shot classified? I was under the impression that the Brit and Israeli studies only define fully vaxxed as someone 14 post second shot?
Second, though the article uses percentages to determine the amount of unvaxxed (by excluding minors since they aren’t eligible for the vax), the unvaxxed numbers and deaths aren’t disclosing whether they include minors (who are mostly unvaxxed, but also unlikely to die from covid).
I guess what I’m wondering is whether percentage wise the numbers of unvaxxed adults cases and deaths may be comparable to vaxxed cases and deaths when you discount the minors from the unvaxxed numbers (to be extent the info doesn’t already do that?)
Disclaimer: I did t read bc I’m not clicking on the links.
They give the totals for partially vaxed, fully vaxed (>14 day), and unvaxed.
I used only fully vaxed and unvaxed.
As far as adults, total vaxed data isn't given... Only total Delta cases by vax status.
I found the fully vaxed rate to be 90% of adults elsewhere, as well as the population under 18, which is 20%, so 8o% × 90% is 72% of a total population vaxed, and 80% × 10% or 8% unvacinated, among adults.
The population is about 67 million. So it works out to about 47 million vaxed and 5 million unvacinated adults.
I'm just assuming the data in the study represents a vast majority of adults, as all they give at under 50 and over 50 data.
This post was edited on 9/11/21 at 9:56 am
Posted on 9/11/21 at 9:53 am to RiverCityTider
quote:
RiverCityTider
quote:
Most of the deaths are over 50.
quote:
Imagine how much worse it is for 60, 70 and 80+ year olds? It's sort of scary.
The death rate for over 80 is about what it's always been. (No LINK)
So old age is probably the leading cause of death for humans, unless you are a minority youth without good parenting. Then your odds of dying of covid is far less than murder.
I like some of your points RCTider - I'm just manipulating stats. -But I'm still not scared.
Posted on 9/11/21 at 10:04 am to 1loyalbamafan
I didn't really consider cause if death controversy. I'm sure it's there.
But all I'm saying is if someone is over 60, the vax probably helps more than it hurts by a good bit. Throw in obesity and other illnesses and it seems pretty clear cut.
All that being said, I think the old Rahm Emanuel adage is definitely at play, "Never let a crisis go to waste." The universal mandate and passports sure to result are the main goal of the totalitarian government.
And I have no doubt about it. And people who don't consider that are very foolish indeed.
But all I'm saying is if someone is over 60, the vax probably helps more than it hurts by a good bit. Throw in obesity and other illnesses and it seems pretty clear cut.
All that being said, I think the old Rahm Emanuel adage is definitely at play, "Never let a crisis go to waste." The universal mandate and passports sure to result are the main goal of the totalitarian government.
And I have no doubt about it. And people who don't consider that are very foolish indeed.
This post was edited on 9/11/21 at 10:07 am
Posted on 9/11/21 at 10:18 am to RiverCityTider
Don't take it. Certainly, don't go to England and take the AstraZeneca
Posted on 9/11/21 at 10:34 am to RiverCityTider
Ok, I gotta say this, what are you talking about? Your figures in your op states that there were 220,000 cases of unvaxxed with 536 deaths while there were 114,000 cases of vaxxed with 1091 deaths. Those are the numbers you should look at if in fact they are correct. In this instance who cares how many people are vaxxed or not? What are the death rates? This puts death rates at .002% vaxxed, .009% vaxxed. Am I missing something or is my computer totally messed up?
Posted on 9/11/21 at 10:41 am to RiverCityTider
quote:
220k cases unvaxed
114k cases fully vacinated
536 deaths Unvaxed
1091 deaths fully vaxed
This is with 90% of the adult population fully vaxxxed?
So if the total population is ~67M and 20% (or 13.4M) are not "adults", that leaves 53.6M adults. If 90% are vaccinated that means 48.24M are vaccinated and 5.36M unvaccinated.
The Vaxscists (Vaccine Fascists, trademark pending) will look at that and say something along the lines of "see the efficacy? A lower percentage of fully vaxxed are getting sick and dying than those who are not vaccinated! We need more laws to force vaccinations!!111111"
Those per capita numbers look like this
Cases
.0410 of the unvaccinated population became infected
.0024 of the vaccinated population had breakthrough infections
Deaths
.0001 of the unvaccinated population died from COVID
.00002 of the vaccinated population died from COVID
The answer, of course, is that both are statistically insignificant but that with the hype and pressure being applied to get the vaccines the new cases and deaths should be zero.
And, most importantly, this information would have been known and these outcomes could have been avoided had there been adequate testing time done before mass injections (of which we still don't even know what adverse reactions may happen just two years after both injections, much less any boosters).
This post was edited on 9/11/21 at 10:44 am
Posted on 9/11/21 at 11:15 am to Bard
Yes but, almost all the unvaxed deaths are over 50. That works out to a 7% morality rate.
And a way disproportionate number of cases under 50 are unvaxed... at a rate of about 20 times more.
So it is dangerous for old people not to be vaxed.
At 60, your odds of making it through the year are about 99% based on actuarial tables. Let's say you are 40lbs overweight. Do you want those odds to drop to 85% ?
They say, and it seems clear, that everyone is going to get this eventually.
So those are the odds older people are looking at.
And a way disproportionate number of cases under 50 are unvaxed... at a rate of about 20 times more.
So it is dangerous for old people not to be vaxed.
At 60, your odds of making it through the year are about 99% based on actuarial tables. Let's say you are 40lbs overweight. Do you want those odds to drop to 85% ?
They say, and it seems clear, that everyone is going to get this eventually.
So those are the odds older people are looking at.
This post was edited on 9/11/21 at 11:17 am
Posted on 9/11/21 at 11:19 am to RiverCityTider
If You Are Vaccinated and You Fear the Un-Vaccinated, You Might Be a Moron
LINK - GP
LINK - GP
quote:
Why is the idiot Biden threatening the un-vaccinated? According to Biden the vaccines work. If you get the vaccine then you will not get Covid. Right? So if you are protected from Covid what difference does it make to you if someone else wants to take the risk of not getting vaccinated? If it will only affect the un-vaccinated then it should be none of your business if another free American chooses to not get vaccinated.
But it appears that Dementia Joe and his team of inept advisors know that the vaccine is not really a vaccine. A true vaccine–made out of Covid–would produce immunity to Covid. But we now know that it does not.
Posted on 9/11/21 at 11:22 am to RiverCityTider
My friend died this morning from Covid and was not vaccinated. 45 year old healthy male.
Posted on 9/11/21 at 11:39 am to RiverCityTider
quote:
I corrected the original post because honestly, I thought the ratio of vaxed to unvaxed was about 2 to 1. In reality, 90% of adults are fully vaxed. There simply are not many unvacinated adults. And there are very few unvacinated adults over 50.
I don't want to contribute to the misinformation so I have to acknowledge this error in thinking.
This type of thinking means you need to be banned, not just from this board, but the internet in general.
But for real thanks for providing more light than heat.
Posted on 9/11/21 at 11:48 am to Kjnstkmn
quote:
If You Are Vaccinated and You Fear the Un-Vaccinated, You Might Be a Moron
Just looking at the British data, there are over 200,000 cases among about 7 million unvaxed and only 60,000 cases among 47 million vaxed, so I'm afraid your probably better off being around the Vaccinated.
This post was edited on 9/11/21 at 11:49 am
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