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Message
re: Climate Change...kids are thinking they have no future and filled with hopelessness.
Posted on 9/23/19 at 12:18 pm to wt9
Posted on 9/23/19 at 12:18 pm to wt9
quote:
The reason there is doubt is because there is manipulation with the narrative/data and massive amounts money involved.
This goes to my point. I realize there is money involved on both sides. But consider the state holders on either side and who has the most to lose. The concept that climate change is man-made is an existential threat to the oil industry (for the most part). This money is also highly concentrated relatively speaking.
quote:
NASA and anybody else that owns the data will not provide the raw data.
NASA is a government organization. All of the data is freely available. The scientific debate takes place in published journals and subject to peer review.
quote:
0+ trillion for the new green deal, you are fooling yourself if you don't think the puppet masters wont get get at least 20% of that
I agree that the green new deal is bogus. But just like discussing the Paris climate accord, those policies are not relevant to the question of whether man is causing climate change and something needs to be done.
For fans of free markets (myself included), you should look into "cap and dividend." LINK
2
Posted on 9/23/19 at 12:55 pm to lalouisiane
quote:You're so biased and myopic that you don't even realize (or maybe just you don't care) WHY this concept is a threat to the oil and gas industry.
The concept that climate change is man-made is an existential threat to the oil industry (for the most part).
If the oil and gas industry is going to lose money and power due to a shift away from fossil fuels, and our energy supply needs aren't going to lower (and in fact will continue to increase), then who is gaining the money and power the oil and gas industry is losing?
And, why do we need to be taxed and lose things to make this shift?
Who's getting our tax dollars?
All the businesses and organizations that have to cut their carbon output, what happens to their products or services costs?
If I can't drive an SUV that uses gas anymore, what do I get to drive? And how much will it cost me? What happens to my existing SUV? Do I have to buy a new "Green" car? Who owns and has stock in that company?
And there's a million of these questions. And in the end, somebody is profiting, the government has significantly more control, the government is taxing us much more, and they are handing out contracts to their cronies with more of our money, and the wealth in this country just keeps pooling to the Elite while we get stripped of less and less power over who governs us and the laws they place over us.
You are so freaking naive if you don't realize this is nothing more than another ploy to make certain rich elites more rich and powerful at our expense.
And when one does realize that this is the real motivation, then the entire subject that enables it has zero credibility.
Posted on 9/23/19 at 1:18 pm to BeefDawg
quote:
BeefDawg
You obviously didn't read about cap and dividend in my previous post, not that I expected you would. You have clearly made up your mind.
Posted on 9/23/19 at 1:36 pm to lalouisiane
quote:All you’ve done is ignore shite anyone has said or asked and post links to biased drivel.
You obviously didn't read about cap and dividend in my previous post, not that I expected you would. You have clearly made up your mind.
Posted on 9/23/19 at 1:44 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
The fraud isn't climate change imo, it's the doomsday outcomes that terrify kids and retarded adults, and the calls for a new economy because of climate change.
There is a very reasonable middle ground that few seem to like. Seems to me that Republicans wanted to cast doubt on the issue to line their pockets via oil companies and dems want to use it as a way to win an election (and probably to line their own pockets too)
Posted on 9/23/19 at 3:12 pm to bmy
quote:
There is a very reasonable middle ground that few seem to like. Seems to me that Republicans wanted to cast doubt on the issue to line their pockets via oil companies and dems want to use it as a way to win an election (and probably to line their own pockets too)
This. I'm trying to make the point that climate change is caused by humans. How we address it (Paris Climate Accord, cap and trade, etc.) is an issue where reasonable minds can differ. I really hope some skeptics will look into cap and dividend.
Posted on 9/23/19 at 3:26 pm to lalouisiane
quote:
NASA is a government organization. All of the data is freely available. The scientific debate takes place in published journals and subject to peer review
You are wrong on this one. You can get data from NASA but it is in their format. Theres no place to get the raw data. They don't want it out there.
quote:
For fans of free markets (myself included), you should look into "cap and dividend
Anybody that believes this is free market is full of shite.
Posted on 9/23/19 at 3:32 pm to Kikicaca
Using the Children of the Corn to promote your agenda is very scary.
Posted on 9/23/19 at 3:35 pm to wt9
quote:
You are wrong on this one. You can get data from NASA but it is in their format. Theres no place to get the raw data. They don't want it out there.
Is it exempt from FOIA? What data are they hiding? Never heard of that before.
quote:
Anybody that believes this is free market is full of shite.
It is a market-based solution. Total carbon emissions are capped. The carbon credits are subject to auction-based bidding (not arbitrarily determined by Congress as under cap and dividend). The tax will trickle down to goods that use carbon (increased costs of goods). Every person in the US gets a pro rata share of the tax. IF you use less carbon-based products, its a net benefit to you. If you use more carbon-based products, it is a net loss to you. The full cost of the externality is realized by the market and individuals are incentived to make consumption choices based on that.
Posted on 9/23/19 at 3:53 pm to lalouisiane
quote:
I'm trying to make the point that climate change is caused by humans. How we address it (Paris Climate Accord, cap and trade, etc.) is an issue where reasonable minds can differ. I really hope some skeptics will look into cap and dividend
How much of it is caused by humans?
That's really the aurgument. Cap and dividend is price control and tax. I have 18 years to get to SS. If they passed it now, no way would I ever see the money.
I try to be reasonable and read the counter arguments. I guess I am too synical of anything the government controls.
I am in the energy business, I see it every day. From solar to nuclear, nobody analyzes to total impact. I was in a plant that produces 2000MWs of energy, basically with jet engines and natural gas. I also been in a solar farm that produces 20MWs of energy. Both had about the same footprint. I have never seen an analysis on the impact solar has on the massive amounts of land.
Why do the climate change proponents not support nuclear? We have regulated this portion of energy industry out of business. At it is probably the best fuel option out there by a long shot.
Posted on 9/23/19 at 3:55 pm to Perfect Circle
quote:
Common sense solutions keep getting ignored, or pushed aside, in favor of histrionics and hysteria. Tells me all I need to know about climate change.
LINK
I like it. Too bad Russia would have to cooperate.
As messed up as it sounds, Russia actually has an incentive for climate change to occur because it will open up tons of land and sea access for them.
Posted on 9/23/19 at 3:58 pm to bmy
quote:
Why shite on greta? She was calm and pleaded with congress to listen to professional scientists.
Why do you want to kill millions of brown people bmy?
Posted on 9/23/19 at 3:58 pm to Kikicaca
she's 16....
this should void your argument
this should void your argument
Posted on 9/23/19 at 4:13 pm to bmy
quote:What? Do you really think her childhood has been stolen? So you think we're close to an extinction level event? Do you think she has any idea of how naive she is and how much she's been filled with catastrophizing bullshite? She was hysterical and embarrassing.
We need more Greta (realistic)
Posted on 9/23/19 at 4:13 pm to lalouisiane
quote:
it exempt from FOIA? What data are they hiding? Never heard of that before.
NASA data foia
Its old but proves my point.
Here's the result after the data is retrieved.
cfact.org NASA data pulled out of hat
My point is that if the data is open source anybody could pull it from any test location. Much like we can pull wind speed from nearest buoy to hurricane eye wall.
quote:
Cap and dividend
Just a different version of cap and trade. Which politician is going to make 300 million this time. The average person would see very little of the money.
Edited to add another link show NASA data is not above board
judicial watch
This post was edited on 9/23/19 at 4:39 pm
Posted on 9/23/19 at 4:14 pm to Kikicaca
1st world problem
2nd and 3rd world kids are worried about where their next meal is coming from
2nd and 3rd world kids are worried about where their next meal is coming from
Posted on 9/23/19 at 4:16 pm to lalouisiane
quote:So without humans the climate would stay the same?
This. I'm trying to make the point that climate change is caused by humans
Posted on 9/23/19 at 4:27 pm to mindbreaker
quote:
Regardless of what you believe in regards to man made climate change
Planting more trees is a good idea
Investing in renewable energy is a good idea
Picking up your damn trash is a must
Worldwide push to recycle everything possible is a must.
I agree with this. Overfishing, air pollution, habitat loss, clean freshwater...these are real problems that anyone should want to solve.
But instead, the left fixates on climate change.
Posted on 9/23/19 at 4:33 pm to lalouisiane
quote:
Disregarding the science, which is conclusive, who do you think has more of an interest in lying?
Be specific. Tell us what is conclusive?
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