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Started By
Message
re: Video, ".22 Handgun for Self-Defense?"
Posted on 3/27/13 at 1:29 pm to RATeamWannabe
Posted on 3/27/13 at 1:29 pm to RATeamWannabe
quote:
RATeamWannabe
Can you draw a paint illustration of what the video teaches us for those of us that don't have the patience to watch it?
1
Posted on 3/27/13 at 1:30 pm to Chad504boy
Posted on 3/27/13 at 2:12 pm to RATeamWannabe
I don't trust rimfire. Period.
Posted on 3/27/13 at 2:25 pm to bapple
because it is "rimfire" or because it isnt large enough cal that you trust it ability to do the job?
Ive always heard that rimfire is unreliable (and I there may be stats to back that) but id bet that less than .02% of the bullets I run through my 22s misfire when struck. Is it possible that the "unreliability perception is because it is mostly shot through lesser quality guns that maybe because they are less expensive guns are not taken care of as well as more expensive guns are?
I may be reaching but I know that I take pretty care of my little 22's and I just dont have problems with misfires...
Ive always heard that rimfire is unreliable (and I there may be stats to back that) but id bet that less than .02% of the bullets I run through my 22s misfire when struck. Is it possible that the "unreliability perception is because it is mostly shot through lesser quality guns that maybe because they are less expensive guns are not taken care of as well as more expensive guns are?
I may be reaching but I know that I take pretty care of my little 22's and I just dont have problems with misfires...
Posted on 3/27/13 at 2:37 pm to StinkDog12
quote:
but id bet that less than .02% of the bullets I run through my 22s misfire when struck.
The failure rate for me has been much higher. For bulk packs it's been around 90%-95%. Granted, higher quality 22 rounds will have better ignition, there is still a risk of the firing pin not hitting the rim hard enough or the powder not igniting. Centerfire primers are softer and more reliable - period. Even if someone believes otherwise, I'd rather not bet my life on the chance that I just hear a "click."
This post was edited on 3/27/13 at 2:38 pm
Posted on 3/27/13 at 2:37 pm to StinkDog12
quote:
Ive always heard that rimfire is unreliable
Round cycling / jamming is the unreliable aspect.
Posted on 3/27/13 at 2:42 pm to StinkDog12
quote:
ability to sling 25 at him
Don't really want to start the shotgun vs AR debate, but you could probably do better with 3 shells worth of birdshot and it would be much quicker.
Posted on 3/27/13 at 2:52 pm to StinkDog12
quote:
because it is "rimfire" or because it isnt large enough cal that you trust it ability to do the job?
Both.
quote:
Ive always heard that rimfire is unreliable (and I there may be stats to back that) but id bet that less than .02% of the bullets I run through my 22s misfire when struck. Is it possible that the "unreliability perception is because it is mostly shot through lesser quality guns that maybe because they are less expensive guns are not taken care of as well as more expensive guns are?
I don't know that I've ever seen published what is the standard "failure to fire" rate for rimfire ammo. Don't know exactly what mine is, but it's high enough that I'm NOT going to trust my life to a rimfire unless nothing else is available. I don't clean my rimfires all the time and I don't have any "high end" rimfires, but they are clean enough and good enough quality to shoot 22LR ammo. Rimfire ammo is historically NOT as reliable to fire as is centerfire ammo.
Posted on 3/27/13 at 2:54 pm to Big Worm
quote:
Round cycling / jamming is the unreliable aspect.
Yeah, that is a sigificant contributor to poor reliabity issues experienced due to misfires.
Posted on 3/27/13 at 2:56 pm to CP3
quote:
Don't really want to start the shotgun vs AR debate, but you could probably do better with 3 shells worth of birdshot and it would be much quicker.
no arguments here.... I guess I am not a real "has to be one best way to defend yourself" type of guy when it comes to home defense.
Any gun is better than no gun...and some guns are clearly better than other guns...but to me how you handle yourself in the situation is probably more important than the caliber of the bullet, hollow point or not, pistol versus AR versus shotgun....
Posted on 3/27/13 at 2:58 pm to TigerOnThe Hill
quote:
Rimfire ammo is historically NOT as reliable to fire as is centerfire ammo
Yeh...I am not arguing that, that may be true...I just thinking out loud about the reason why.
Posted on 3/27/13 at 3:19 pm to TigerOnThe Hill
quote:
Don't know exactly what mine is, but it's high enough that I'm NOT going to trust my life to a rimfire unless nothing else is available.
And boom goes the dynamite.
Posted on 3/27/13 at 3:54 pm to StinkDog12
quote:
Yeh...I am not arguing that, that may be true...I just thinking out loud about the reason why.
That's a good question to ask. Like I mentioned, I've never seen a referenced "failure" rate w/ 22LR ammo, but would be interested to see one. I suspect the fact that compared to centerifire ammo, 22LR has a higher rate of misfiring, jamming, etc because: the ammo is generally so inexpensive; lots of chamber dimension variations in the 22LR guns; variations in the rim thickness of the ammo, etc. Prolly better info here: LINK
Posted on 3/27/13 at 4:31 pm to RATeamWannabe
quote:
What is really interesting to me is the extra penetration from a lack of velocity. Wouldnt believe it if I didnt see it
I saw a myth busters ep when the exact same thing happened when guns were shot into water. the slower the round the deeper into the water
Posted on 3/27/13 at 9:14 pm to RATeamWannabe
I have a SR22 in the center console of my Jeep Cherokee. Not because I think it is the most effective round. Not because I inherently trust .22 in any shape form or fashion.
I have it in there because it is the only handgun out of the 5 I have that will fit in that tiny arse console.
I do however have what I consider to be one of the more reliable .22 rounds, CCI Mini Mags in the gun.
I've been keeping my eyes open for a good deal on a .38 snubby to keep in there. I'm also in the market for a new truck in the near future, at that point, my Sig SP2022 will probably be along for the ride.
I am also planning on getting my CCDW in the next couple of months. At that point, everything could change. In KY, you don't have to have a CCDW to keep a handgun in your vehicle in the open or concealed in any compartment originally built into the vehicle. With a CCDW though, you can put it anywhere you want.
Until then, I guess like others have said, it is better than pepper spray or a sharp stick.
I have it in there because it is the only handgun out of the 5 I have that will fit in that tiny arse console.
I do however have what I consider to be one of the more reliable .22 rounds, CCI Mini Mags in the gun.
I've been keeping my eyes open for a good deal on a .38 snubby to keep in there. I'm also in the market for a new truck in the near future, at that point, my Sig SP2022 will probably be along for the ride.
I am also planning on getting my CCDW in the next couple of months. At that point, everything could change. In KY, you don't have to have a CCDW to keep a handgun in your vehicle in the open or concealed in any compartment originally built into the vehicle. With a CCDW though, you can put it anywhere you want.
Until then, I guess like others have said, it is better than pepper spray or a sharp stick.
Posted on 3/27/13 at 10:53 pm to Cracker
quote:
What is really interesting to me is the extra penetration from a lack of velocity. Wouldnt believe it if I didnt see it
I saw a myth busters ep when the exact same thing happened when guns were shot into water. the slower the round the deeper into the water
Yeah, that's how supersonic, expanding rifle bullets routinely behave. Some years ago I did a number of science fair projects that studied bullet penetration into water soaked newspaper at different velocities and different bullet weights. Comparing 30 caliber Nosler BT's, the consistent findings were: at the same velocity, the heavier bullet penetrates deeper; w/ bullets of the same weight, slower bullets penetrate deeper than faster bullets; as bullet velocity increases so does bullet expansion. The faster bullet penetrates less because of it expands more. Would've liked to evaluate pistol bullets, be never got to.
During the science project, I shot a single 40 grain 22LR (don't remember the load) into the stack of newspapers. The bullet penetrated 8"! For comparison, IIRC the 125 gr NBT @ muzzle velocity of 2600 fps penetrated 10-11".
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