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Started By
Message
re: USW strike...** POSSIBLE END IN SIGHT **
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:06 am to stout
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:06 am to stout
quote:
Yea I answered his post but that was a crazy leap to make.
I prefaced that it would be, but the point was being made that a major industry being decimated would have trickle down effects in a certain area.
1
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:07 am to fightin tigers
quote:
that a major industry being decimated
It's not being decimated though. It's simply adjusting for the current market. Bubbles pop and it happens then we recover.
Detroit is the way it is because unions actually ruined the car industry there.
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:07 am to tigerinthebueche
quote:
I don't understand the mindset that "O&G doesn't affect me". If you're in Texas or Louisiana, chances are it effects you. Even if you're not directly in the field, the states well being is directly tied to it so it is a fatally myopic view to think you aren't or won't be feeling some discomfort as well.
It is not only those states. It is the entire national economy. Just like the people who don't worry about 10 of millions of illegals because it is just a California or Texas thing. We all pay for it one way or another.
So the "trash" that work harder than 90% of this board are vilified and yet we feel sorry for the lazy asses who suck on the government teat for generation after generation?
The media has done a terrific job of making Big Oil the villian. The media always reports the amount of oil companies profits in the billions, but never reports the profit percentage. Oil companies spend billions to make billions in profits. I once saw a report that the average oil company made 3% profit. The same media services blasting them for such profits were making 22% profit.
Where is the outcry about Pharmaceutical companies or Insurance companies? Do you ever wonder why there is a Walgreens or CVS on every street corner? Because the markup on the active ingredients of some of the medicines we take are 58000%.
The left accuses the right for using Terrorism as a "boogie man", we the left has created such a "boogie man" with the O&G industry. Our quality of life would suck without oil and the derivatives of it.
I laugh when I hear people say that oil needs to be replaced by solar, wind, etc. When was the last time that you heard of anyone making plastics, rubber, makeup, or any of the other thousands of things that come from oil with solar, wind, etc.?
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:08 am to fightin tigers
quote:
With the economy picking back up
that was largely on the back of O/G, so i wouldn't get too excited about our economic outlook
it's like a snake eating its own tail
lower prices may make demand for refined petro go up though, which i've argued on here (about LC not being hit hard like laffy)
quote:
If profits keep going up for your company why would you convince yourself to take a paycut?
it's about the margins more than profit
also, stockholders judge profits in relation to their expected return. employee value is determined by the market
profit and employee value are not related
employee value is based in supply and demand of the employee. as a warning, there are a lot of unemployed people in laffy looking for work, which will further lower the value of the "refinery employee".
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:09 am to SlowFlowPro
I agree, but then that would be less money for the union fat cats.
There's obviously more to it than what's being released, and what is being released is only from one side so you know what that means.
There's obviously more to it than what's being released, and what is being released is only from one side so you know what that means.
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:09 am to stout
I actually work for a contractor and I think the slow down for refining will help the Gas/Chemical expansions that have already started. The refineries would have to compete for the labor on the construction side if they were expanding or turning around units on large scale. The way this is going down labor won't be as stretched at crunch time.
Unions had their run, but have put themselves in their current situation. We often wish for the days of true apprenticeships and pride in work, but that came at a cost.
Unions had their run, but have put themselves in their current situation. We often wish for the days of true apprenticeships and pride in work, but that came at a cost.
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:10 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
i always believe that if unions want to make it an issue, unions should be responsible for the health care and retirement of their members
have employers contribute certain set amounts to the unions for the unions to purchase group health insurance and invest for retirement
This has been proposed before and rejected. Healthcare will probably go that way at some point.
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:10 am to Terry the Tiger
quote:
So the "trash" that work harder than 90% of this board are vilified and yet we feel sorry for the lazy asses who suck on the government teat for generation after generation?
wait
what?
quote:
Where is the outcry about Pharmaceutical companies or Insurance companies?
i mean i agree with you about looking at the margins (see my post above), but big pharma is criticized pretty often. and fricking health insurance companies were just put on full blast for half a decade with the whole Obamacare debate
quote:
I laugh when I hear people say that oil needs to be replaced by solar, wind, etc. When was the last time that you heard of anyone making plastics, rubber, makeup, or any of the other thousands of things that come from oil with solar, wind, etc.?
this argument isn't for this board...and certainly not for this thread, baw
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:11 am to brass2mouth
quote:
I agree, but then that would be less money for the union fat cats.
quite the opposite my friend
more money to pillage
more responsibility, though
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:11 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
quote: it's the other issues. things like health care and retirement are always the biggest issues with these things i always believe that if unions want to make it an issue, unions should be responsible for the health care and retirement of their members have employers contribute certain set amounts to the unions for the unions to purchase group health insurance and invest for retirement move the risk from the employer to the side representing the workers, demanding these products/services
frick that. I don't want those union fat cat crooks in charge of my retirement and insurance.
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:11 am to Stexas
quote:
The way this is going down labor won't be as stretched at crunch time.
I said this a while ago.
All of those man camps they built around Lake Charles for this boom waiting on outside labor to come in will have to find a new way to market themselves.
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:12 am to fightin tigers
quote:
This has been proposed before and rejected.
by labor or management? i assume labor
and i laugh at the thought (b/c it means labor doesn't trust their union management)
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:12 am to shiftworker
quote:
frick that. I don't want those union fat cat crooks in charge of my retirement and insurance.
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:13 am to stout
you see SASOL back off of committing to the other expansions? i think it was last week
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:14 am to Teauxler
quote:
6% Annual raise
$7500 signing bonus
90/10 insurance
Triple time
I have seen what the unions are asking for multiple times but what are the plants offering? Would like to see how far apart they are.
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:18 am to SlowFlowPro
The GTL project has always been a unicorn project anyway. Leucadia was working in the same type of project for close to 10 yrs and just pulled the plug in the last few months.
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:19 am to Stexas
so what is still on the table. i know a few of the other planned expansions are on shaky ground
the big SASOL one is a go
are the projects in Cameron still going ahead?
the big SASOL one is a go
are the projects in Cameron still going ahead?
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:22 am to SlowFlowPro
All the LNG and ethanol projects are still go. If LNG stays cheap that's good for feedstock projects and export projects...
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:24 am to Stexas
Excellent
it's time for the rise of Cultural Lake Chuck, especially while Lafayette can't afford it's patronage anymore
it's time for the rise of Cultural Lake Chuck, especially while Lafayette can't afford it's patronage anymore
Posted on 2/1/15 at 10:24 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
by labor or management? i assume labor
and i laugh at the thought (b/c it means labor doesn't trust their union management)
Both sides actually.
The unions want it so they can profit more. Union labor can actually see it is a bad idea, they won't drink the kool-aid.
From a company aspect, no way they turn over guaranteed stock purchases by giving up retirement contributions.
quote:
b/c it means labor doesn't trust their union management
Trust them to negotiate, not invest their future. Plus they will lock you into the union with your retirement. At least now a worker can take their 401k when they leave.
This post was edited on 2/1/15 at 10:26 am
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