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re: Police shoot man in Fresno... bodycam footage
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:39 pm to Salmon
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:39 pm to Salmon
quote:
the cop tells him "reach one more time and I will shoot you" and the guy lift up his shirt now we can all say "well he was probably going to hold his gun shot wound" but did the cops know that?
At a bare minimum you have to consider that you just shot him two, now three times in the stomach/chest. He is moving at a snail's pace. You can afford to wait and see what he's doing before you shoot him a 4th time with a shotgun from point-blank range.
At no point once he is on the ground do I believe the officers feared for their lives. They didn't move towards him or away from him. They just stood there, and if/when he moved, they shot him again. That is a problem.
3
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:42 pm to slackster
quote:
At a bare minimum you have to consider that you just shot him two, now three times in the stomach/chest. He is moving at a snail's pace. You can afford to wait and see what he's doing before you shoot him a 4th time with a shotgun from point-blank range.
No shite. His movements were extremely sluggish (like you'd expect from someone that had just been shot 3 times). Is he supposed to remain perfectly still after being shot? Were they just going to keep shooting until he stopped moving? WTF
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:43 pm to slackster
I doubt they would have approached him while he was still moving
so y'all would rather them just let him bleed out?
so y'all would rather them just let him bleed out?
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:45 pm to Salmon
quote:
I doubt they would have approached him while he was still moving
Why wouldn't one officer rush and and detain him while the other officer covered him? Isn't that what they are trained to do?
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:45 pm to slackster
quote:
a bare minimum you have to consider that you just shot him two, now three times in the stomach/chest. He is moving at a snail's pace. You can afford to wait and see what he's doing before you shoot him a 4th time with a shotgun from point-blank range.
At no point once he is on the ground do I believe the officers feared for their lives. They didn't move towards him or away from him. They just stood there, and if/when he moved, they shot him again. That is a problem.
Exactly his movements were not the movements of a guy about to pull out a gun and go John Wayne on anyone. He's no threat to anyone. No need to shoot him any more once he's down. Get him restrained and get him medical attention and hopefully save his life. Instead they executed him from virtual point blank range with a shotgun.
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:46 pm to tgrbaitn08
quote:
Why wouldn't one officer rush and and detain him while the other officer covered him? Isn't that what they are trained to do?
are they?
if he is assumed armed do they rush him?
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:47 pm to Salmon
quote:
if he is assumed armed do they rush him?
BRPD did
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:48 pm to tgrbaitn08
quote:
BRPD did
was he acting aggressive beforehand? or just not complying?
did he ever reach like he was going for a gun before?
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:48 pm to Salmon
quote:
so y'all would rather them just let him bleed out?
As opposed to shooting him point blank with a shotgun?
"Hold on guys... let me put another shot into him before we get any closer"
Yeah that's not at all how this is supposed to work.
FTR as an officer in that situation, I would have felt perfectly safe in approaching him with my firearm pointed at him after the first 3 shots and handcuffing him. You can easily tell from the video that he doesn't have the motor skills necessary to make a quick grab for any weapon.
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:48 pm to Salmon
quote:
was he acting aggressive beforehand? or just not complying?
did he ever reach like he was going for a gun before?
who is he?
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:49 pm to tgrbaitn08
quote:
who is he?
Sterling
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:51 pm to Salmon
quote:
Sterling
Different scenario, they were called to the scene because Sterling was waving a gun, plus they knew who he was and knew he had a criminal record. So, knowing that Sterling had a gun and a record, BRPD still opted to take him down before they were forced to shoot him.
This post was edited on 7/14/16 at 3:52 pm
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:52 pm to tgrbaitn08
quote:
Different scenari
obviously...so why compare?
quote:
knowing that Sterling had a gun
did they know this? cause they seemed pretty surprised when they saw it
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:53 pm to terd ferguson
quote:
As opposed to shooting him point blank with a shotgun?
"Hold on guys... let me put another shot into him before we get any closer"
Yeah that's not at all how this is supposed to work.
Exactly. Deadly force is supposed to be used to neutralize a threat. Once that threat is down and no longer able to be a threat, the firing is supposed to stop. That didn't happen here though and a 19 yr old kid is dead as a result.
quote:
FTR as an officer in that situation, I would have felt perfectly safe in approaching him with my firearm pointed at him after the first 3 shots and handcuffing him. You can easily tell from the video that he doesn't have the motor skills necessary to make a quick grab for any weapon.
Agree 100%. IN MY OPINION there is no valid reason those cops, supposedly fully trained cops I might add, should have not realized once he was on the ground he had been neutralized and no longer posed any threat.
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:54 pm to Salmon
quote:
if he is assumed armed do they rush him?
I wouldn't have rushed him from the start... but after the first 2 shots I would have. The officer with the pistol hits him center mass with a double tap. At that point it looks like those officers are 5 feet or so from the guy. Any of them could have easily went straight at the guy on the ground and detained him. He was done at that point.
Then they put a 3rd round into him... yet another opportunity for any of them (still standing around 5 ft away) to detain him. Instead they tell him to stop moving and when he doesn't Rambo unloads point blank with a damn shotgun.
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:55 pm to Darth_Vader
quote:
Exactly. Deadly force is supposed to be used to neutralize a threat. Once that threat is down and no longer able to be a threat, the firing is supposed to stop.
they obviously felt he was still a threat with the way he was moving and still reaching for his pants/pockets
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:55 pm to Salmon
quote:
did they know this? cause they seemed pretty surprised when they saw it
This is what puzzles me about the Sterling shooting.
Reeks of all-around shitty police work imho
This post was edited on 7/14/16 at 3:56 pm
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:56 pm to Darth_Vader
I mean he isn't even picking up his head or anything... just kind of moving his arms around like a zombie. There's no way anyone should watch that video and think this guy was still a threat after the 3rd shot.
Hell he wasn't a threat after the first 2 shots.
Hell he wasn't a threat after the first 2 shots.
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:57 pm to terd ferguson
quote:
if he is assumed armed do they rush him?
I wouldn't have rushed him from the start... but after the first 2 shots I would have. The officer with the pistol hits him center mass with a double tap. At that point it looks like those officers are 5 feet or so from the guy. Any of them could have easily went straight at the guy on the ground and detained him. He was done at that point.
Then they put a 3rd round into him... yet another opportunity for any of them (still standing around 5 ft away) to detain him. Instead they tell him to stop moving and when he doesn't Rambo unloads point blank with a damn shotgun
Yep. Shots one and two, totally justified. Shot three, questionable at best, almost certainly not called for. Shot four, that's a straight up execution.
Posted on 7/14/16 at 3:57 pm to terd ferguson
quote:
There's no way anyone should watch that video and think this guy was still a threat after the 3rd shot.
probably right, but watching the video is different from being there, no?
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