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Gentlemen, please, rest your sphincters

Posted on 3/19/20 at 10:25 am
Posted by Ronaldo Burgundiaz
NWA
Member since Jan 2012
6795 posts
Posted on 3/19/20 at 10:25 am
For many reasons: too much TP use can cause your brown starfish to bleed, but more importantly for your own sanity.

Stanford epidemiologist raises concerns:
A fiasco in the making? As the coronavirus pandemic takes hold, we are making decisions without reliable data

Highlights:

quote:

Draconian countermeasures have been adopted in many countries. If the pandemic dissipates — either on its own or because of these measures — short-term extreme social distancing and lockdowns may be bearable. How long, though, should measures like these be continued if the pandemic churns across the globe unabated? How can policymakers tell if they are doing more good than harm?

quote:

We don’t know if we are failing to capture infections by a factor of three or 300. Three months after the outbreak emerged, most countries, including the U.S., lack the ability to test a large number of people and no countries have reliable data on the prevalence of the virus in a representative random sample of the general population.

quote:

This evidence fiasco creates tremendous uncertainty about the risk of dying from Covid-19. Reported case fatality rates, like the official 3.4% rate from the World Health Organization, cause horror — and are meaningless

quote:

The one situation where an entire, closed population was tested was the Diamond Princess cruise ship and its quarantine passengers. The case fatality rate there was 1.0%, but this was a largely elderly population, in which the death rate from Covid-19 is much higher.

Projecting the Diamond Princess mortality rate onto the age structure of the U.S. population, the death rate among people infected with Covid-19 would be 0.125%. But since this estimate is based on extremely thin data — there were just seven deaths among the 700 infected passengers and crew — the real death rate could stretch from five times lower (0.025%) to five times higher (0.625%).

quote:

That huge range markedly affects how severe the pandemic is and what should be done. A population-wide case fatality rate of 0.05% is lower than seasonal influenza.

quote:

Could the Covid-19 case fatality rate be that low? No, some say, pointing to the high rate in elderly people. However, even some so-called mild or common-cold-type coronaviruses that have been known for decades can have case fatality rates as high as 8% when they infect elderly people in nursing homes. In fact, such “mild” coronaviruses infect tens of millions of people every year, and account for 3% to 11% of those hospitalized in the U.S. with lower respiratory infections each winter.

These “mild” coronaviruses may be implicated in several thousands of deaths every year worldwide, though the vast majority of them are not documented with precise testing. Instead, they are lost as noise among 60 million deaths from various causes every year.

quote:

If we assume that case fatality rate among individuals infected by SARS-CoV-2 is 0.3% in the general population — a mid-range guess from my Diamond Princess analysis — and that 1% of the U.S. population gets infected (about 3.3 million people), this would translate to about 10,000 deaths.

quote:

In the absence of data, prepare-for-the-worst reasoning leads to extreme measures of social distancing and lockdowns. Unfortunately, we do not know if these measures work. School closures, for example, may reduce transmission rates. But they may also backfire if children socialize anyhow, if school closure leads children to spend more time with susceptible elderly family members, if children at home disrupt their parents ability to work, and more. School closures may also diminish the chances of developing herd immunity in an age group that is spared serious disease.

quote:

Flattening the curve to avoid overwhelming the health system is conceptually sound — in theory. A visual that has become viral in media and social media shows how flattening the curve reduces the volume of the epidemic that is above the threshold of what the health system can handle at any moment.

Yet if the health system does become overwhelmed, the majority of the extra deaths may not be due to coronavirus but to other common diseases and conditions such as heart attacks, strokes, trauma, bleeding, and the like that are not adequately treated. If the level of the epidemic does overwhelm the health system and extreme measures have only modest effectiveness, then flattening the curve may make things worse: Instead of being overwhelmed during a short, acute phase, the health system will remain overwhelmed for a more protracted period. That’s another reason we need data about the exact level of the epidemic activity.

quote:

If we decide to jump off the cliff, we need some data to inform us about the rationale of such an action and the chances of landing somewhere safe.


Iceland is the first country to randomly check the general population

LINK

Iceland total population 364,620
1% of 364,620 = 3,646
When Iceland records its first death the CFR will be at least 1/3646
That is an estimated CFR of 0.027% <-- which is in line with what Dr. Ioannidis posted in his article.

If the WHO is correct, Iceland should already be shitshow. Median incubation time is 5 days, their general population samples were taken 4 days ago. Iceland also only has 9 critical care beds per capita, less than Italy (12), and far less than the US (34)





Posted by SavageOrangeJug
Member since Oct 2005
19758 posts
Posted on 3/19/20 at 10:27 am to
quote:


A fiasco in the making? As the coronavirus pandemic takes hold, we are making decisions without reliable data
Understatement of the century.
Posted by Ronaldo Burgundiaz
NWA
Member since Jan 2012
6795 posts
Posted on 3/19/20 at 10:34 am to
The really unfortunate thing about all this is that once this is all said and done, and we end up having fewer than 10,000 deaths, the general public is going to view this event as a "boy that cried wolf" event. The issue is that there are some legitimate worries out there. We have hunters in the US that don't give a rat's arse about eating deer meat from CWD deer. If CWD jumped to humans that would be devastating.
Posted by Walking the Earth
Member since Feb 2013
17467 posts
Posted on 3/19/20 at 10:40 am to
quote:

the general public is going to view this event as a "boy that cried wolf" event


Nah, if this event has taught one thing it's that people are genetically wired to lose their collective shite at the slightest disruption.

They'll do the exact same thing next time and the government will be even quicker to put the clamps down since they now have the very surprising data that such a move will receive almost universal support
Posted by Ronaldo Burgundiaz
NWA
Member since Jan 2012
6795 posts
Posted on 3/19/20 at 10:41 am to
Curious if any of the chicken little downvoters care to dispute the numbers from Dr. Ionnadis and from Iceland?

Or are you clowns too busy hoarding toilet paper?
Posted by tigerbutt
Deep South
Member since Jun 2006
26449 posts
Posted on 3/19/20 at 11:02 am to
I’m not reading all that shite
Posted by RockAndRollDetective
Baton Rouge
Member since Mar 2014
4506 posts
Posted on 3/19/20 at 11:07 am to
quote:

Curious if any of the chicken little downvoters care to dispute the numbers from Dr. Ionnadis and from Iceland?

Are you not familiar with this forum? Unless you post multiple pics of some chick with bolt-ons and man abs you will automatically receive downvotes. It's called "retard reflex".
Posted by Ronaldo Burgundiaz
NWA
Member since Jan 2012
6795 posts
Posted on 3/19/20 at 4:58 pm to
Goddamned right
Posted by Mr Personality
Bangkok
Member since Mar 2014
27364 posts
Posted on 3/19/20 at 5:38 pm to
Posted by Scruffy
Kansas City
Member since Jul 2011
78046 posts
Posted on 3/19/20 at 5:39 pm to
quote:

This evidence fiasco creates tremendous uncertainty about the risk of dying from Covid-19. Reported case fatality rates, like the official 3.4% rate from the World Health Organization, cause horror — and are meaningless
Posted by kywildcatfanone
Wildcat Country!
Member since Oct 2012
141224 posts
Posted on 3/19/20 at 5:41 pm to
I don't think anyone would argue that this isn't overblown at some level. But I guess the fear of the unknown breeds uncertainty.
Posted by Scruffy
Kansas City
Member since Jul 2011
78046 posts
Posted on 3/19/20 at 5:41 pm to
quote:

But I guess the fear of the unknown breeds uncertainty.
Which breeds stupidity and destruction.
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