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re: How would you guys feel about Ryan Shazier?
Posted on 4/22/14 at 10:07 am to Lester Earl
Posted on 4/22/14 at 10:07 am to Lester Earl
quote:
Lester Earl
What's good Lester?
1
Posted on 4/22/14 at 10:12 am to Lester Earl
I think he can be an every down linebacker. I don't want him just for coverage, but I think he would shine the most in nickel defenses.
Posted on 4/22/14 at 10:18 am to iAmThatMan
just scouting prospects, wbu
Posted on 4/22/14 at 10:31 am to Lester Earl
Chillin...Waiting for fricking May 8th to get here.
Who you want at 27?
Who you want at 27?
Posted on 4/22/14 at 11:06 am to iAmThatMan
it changes every day bro
Posted on 4/22/14 at 11:23 am to Lester Earl
Right,right. 
Posted on 4/22/14 at 12:21 pm to FootballNostradamus
quote:I agree with that to a point.
Not trying to ruin the 4-3 vs 3-4 vs 3-3-5 vs 4-2-5 parade, but in today's day and age of modern defenses the fronts tell you next to nothing about what sort of defense a team is playing.
The terms you need to look into (if you are truly curious about what we are doing defensively) are whether a team runs one-gap or two-gap principles. This is what truly defines the responsibilities of a defense.
But how many guys you put on the line determines what gaps you are attacking and/or holding, so they go hand and hand and that's why, despite what Galette is called, he is a DE in my eyes.
The LBs also attack and/or hold gaps, but in a secondary role(unless blitzing). Galette's primary focus was attacking the backside gap so whether you call him a jack or a DE, he played the role of a rush end.
That's all very good stuff though and I agree with what you're saying.
Posted on 4/22/14 at 12:24 pm to Chad504boy
quote:I get that but even if we do run more "base" 3-4 or 4-3 we are still going to be in more sub than anything.
You're logic is based on last year's formations will be next year's formations even if personnel changes. Well last year's formations was based on because of personnel dealt with. It's a fluid situation and you're a rock at the bottom of the river watching the parade go by.
That's just the way of the league and my primary point.
And I'm not sure if it was this thread or the other one, but I did suggest going to more 4-3 looks IF we draft Shazier to help play to his strengths. So I'm not ignoring the fact that we will adapt. I already said we would.
Posted on 4/22/14 at 12:27 pm to Lester Earl
quote:It's not that he can't play the run. It's that if you don't protect him he will get swallowed up.
sorry but you dont take a LB in the 1st round in hopes that can be a "coverage LB". Because if you can't do the other half of the job, you're pretty much worthless.
Ohio state did a poor job of trying to keep him free at times, but when he was kept clean he made a ton of plays in the run game.
The bigger issue with him is the arm tackling. That stuff drives me insane.
Posted on 4/22/14 at 12:33 pm to bonethug0108
quote:
The bigger issue with him is the arm tackling.
You can't teach aggressiveness which is my biggest concern with Shazier. Before last season we witnessed enough pissed poor tackling on defense. Shazier has measurables for days but he isn't physical & he lacks the killer instinct when it comes to being an aggressive tackler.
This post was edited on 4/22/14 at 12:38 pm
Posted on 4/22/14 at 12:44 pm to BigBrod81
You can teach him to be physical and coach the tackling technique, but I agree the aggressive attitude has to come from the player. I can't be taught be you can try to instill it in him.
That's why I said he has to take to the coaching. If not then he won't amount to more than a situational player and occasional blitzer.
I'm not trying to defend the guy. I have seen his faults and there are things I don't like. But there is also a lot that I do like and I wouldn't be upset with the pick. I'm just looking at what can be done if we do take him.
Like I said, I far prefer Mosley, and then several other guys at other positions. This would be a more worst case scenario pick.
That's why I said he has to take to the coaching. If not then he won't amount to more than a situational player and occasional blitzer.
I'm not trying to defend the guy. I have seen his faults and there are things I don't like. But there is also a lot that I do like and I wouldn't be upset with the pick. I'm just looking at what can be done if we do take him.
Like I said, I far prefer Mosley, and then several other guys at other positions. This would be a more worst case scenario pick.
Posted on 4/22/14 at 12:47 pm to bonethug0108
Why haven't we discussed how sudden he is?
Posted on 4/22/14 at 12:55 pm to Hoodoo Man
Extremely sudden. He can drop half way into a buzz zone and still run all the way back to the middle and make a tackle on a run up the gut.
That's one of the things I really liked about him. He'll read the play really well and at least get to a position to try and make a stop.
I think if we kept him more to the inside and dropped him into less zones than he was in at Ohio State then he could do really well. That way he can use he speed to get to the outside if need be instead of running out first and then back in like I kept seeing.
That's one of the things I really liked about him. He'll read the play really well and at least get to a position to try and make a stop.
I think if we kept him more to the inside and dropped him into less zones than he was in at Ohio State then he could do really well. That way he can use he speed to get to the outside if need be instead of running out first and then back in like I kept seeing.
Posted on 4/22/14 at 1:02 pm to bonethug0108
quote:
I'm not trying to defend the guy.
I understand that but I'm just trying to get you to step back & look at the larger picture here. How can you expect Ryan to "hide" Shazier against the run that often?
Look at the division for a second. Carolina is going to be breaking in an entirely new receiving corp. Cam is going to miss valuable time this offseason without much time to get acquainted with those receivers. The Panthers are going to run, run & run some more with Williams & Steward.
You best believe Lovie Smith is going to ground & pound with Doug Martin while playing great defense behind that.
Atlanta is beefing up their offensive line & will look to get back to being a strong running team. Matt Ryan's success solely depends on whether or not he is backed by a solid run game.
Teams, especially in the division, are going to try to run the ball to chew up clock to keep Brees on the sidelines. Then you have to look at other contenders in the NFC that could be possible opponents in the playoffs. Green Bay, Philly, San Francisco & Seattle all have running games they can lean on. It's going to be extremely tough to hide someone like Shazier going up against these teams. NFL teams do an outstanding job of finding weaknesses & exploiting those weaknesses.
Posted on 4/22/14 at 1:03 pm to Hoodoo Man
quote:
Why haven't we discussed how sudden he is?
Posted on 4/22/14 at 1:07 pm to BigBrod81
quote:It's not hiding him against the run. He can play the run just fine. You only need to keep him clean against the run and he'll make the play.
How can you expect Ryan to "hide" Shazier against the run that often?
And if you try to take him out then you leave Lofton with a clean shot at the play, and Vaccaro is never too far out of the box.
It's not like he can't play on run downs, it's just not his strength.
And that's not limited to just him. Almost anyone we get at 27 is going to have something they are not great at(at least not right away). So to single him out for a weakness saying we should pass is like saying we should just pass on about anyone who will be there because they will all have their weaknesses.
Posted on 4/22/14 at 1:19 pm to bonethug0108
quote:
You only need to keep him clean against the run and he'll make the play.
Only in a perfect world would this happen. The truth is he going to have to take on pulling lineman & it's going to happen more then you are willing to admit.
quote:
It's not like he can't play on run downs, it's just not his strength.
Which is why I said offensive coaches will expose his weaknesses against the run.
quote:
So to single him out for a weakness saying we should pass is like saying we should just pass on about anyone who will be there because they will all have their weaknesses.
No, I'm singling out his weaknesses because they are huge red flags for his position. Not being aggressive & being an arm tackler are huge no no's for an inside linebacker no matter how good his measurables are.
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