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re: Updated Draft Express Mock
Posted on 2/21/12 at 4:12 pm to TigerinATL
Posted on 2/21/12 at 4:12 pm to TigerinATL
quote:
I think in 3-5 year's you're likely to get that, but I would say his floor is much lower than that. Right now he's a big with no shooting ability and a very questionable motor.
As disappointing as he is, he is playing much better than those guys did in college so why shouldn't he develop quicker? Besides, rebounding and shot blocking translates quickly to the NBA, Jordan and McGee are putting up the same per 36 numbers now that they were as rookies.
I think there is something to the immaturity issues you mentioned, I'm not exactly sure why he was coddled so much by his handlers and mother. You also have to remember with Drummond that he didn't have the benefit of practicing with UConn over the summer so that may explain some of his struggles adjusting to the college game.
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Posted on 2/21/12 at 4:23 pm to floridatigah
quote:
Besides, rebounding and shot blocking translates quickly to the NBA, Jordan and McGee are putting up the same per 36 numbers now that they were as rookies.
Still both only averaged 15ish minutes per game their 1st 2 years in the league. Assuming we had say the #2 and #11 pick, would you draft Jordan/McGee with #2? I guess some of it depends on what you think Ayon's potential as a starter is, but the standard team model today pretty much requires having an 18/10 PF. Averageish centers may not be cheaper to pay, but they are easier to acquire, we have 2 on the roster now.
This post was edited on 2/21/12 at 4:24 pm
Posted on 2/21/12 at 4:29 pm to TigerinATL
Jordan was playing behind Kaman. McGee was much skinnier than Drummond and was a late grower so he didn't have much experience playing as a big man. To answer your question, no, I wouldn't take either of those as the number two pick. I would take someone who was going to be one of those guys at worst, with the potential to be much better.
I like Ayon, but he isn't a center like Drummond is. It would also be a terrible idea to decide who you want to draft in the top 3 based on having a guy like Ayon on your roster.
I like Ayon, but he isn't a center like Drummond is. It would also be a terrible idea to decide who you want to draft in the top 3 based on having a guy like Ayon on your roster.
Posted on 2/21/12 at 4:58 pm to floridatigah
quote:
It would also be a terrible idea to decide who you want to draft in the top 3 based on having a guy like Ayon on your roster.
That's because you have a lesser opinion of Barnes. But say we have the #3 pick and Demps grades Barnes/Sullinger/Drummond the same. Then position need and what current players Demps sees as a future starter comes into play.
Posted on 2/21/12 at 5:56 pm to tehchampion140
quote:
Drummond looks like he's going to be a huge bust. I don't see anything special about him.
The dude is an amare clone. He has freakish athleticsm and agility for his size. There have been times this year where he has taken over games. To call him inconsistent is one thing, but he is a special talent.
Posted on 2/21/12 at 7:14 pm to LSUSaintsHornets
quote:
He has freakish athleticsm and agility for his size
I've heard the same things. I really need to catch some more UCONN games.
Frankly, and this is absolutely not intended as an insult or a slight, but I'm not sure anyone here knows dick about how these guys will turn out in the pros.
Posted on 2/22/12 at 1:21 pm to VOR
quote:
Frankly, and this is absolutely not intended as an insult or a slight, but I'm not sure anyone here knows dick about how these guys will turn out in the pros.
Very true
I can say this though, no matter who we take, I want it to be somebody with a great motor. I'd take a guy with a want to be out there over a guy that has a ton of ability.
I like drummond and perry jones... but I just don't think the Hornets franchise could take it if we spent a top 5 pick on a guy like that and they pulled a kwame brown.
Anthony Davis, Thomas Robinson, MKG... those are the guys that I would want to have on my team regardless of ability. They have the highest motors and best mind set and thats something that can take anybody to the top.
Posted on 2/22/12 at 1:31 pm to VOR
I've watched 2 UCONN games and didn't see Drummond to a damn thing.
He does have freak athleticism, but he doesn't seem to be dominating as he should.
He does have freak athleticism, but he doesn't seem to be dominating as he should.
Posted on 2/22/12 at 1:41 pm to Fun Bunch
quote:
I've watched 2 UCONN games and didn't see Drummond to a damn thing.
He does have freak athleticism, but he doesn't seem to be dominating as he should.
That's the impression that I have gotten as well. He's good for an "oh my god!" block in most games, but he also disappears for large portions of the game. The fact that people are talking about two lottery picks from a bubble team should be frightening enough to give pause.
Posted on 2/22/12 at 1:44 pm to VOR
quote:
He could be a very good draft choice if he's handled right. It may take a couple of years to develop, but if he pans out that would be great.
May take a couple of years = not top 3 worthy
Posted on 2/22/12 at 1:50 pm to floridatigah
quote:
Drummond's floor and ceiling are both higher than a guy like Barnes
Total nonsense.
Posted on 2/22/12 at 3:21 pm to Jester
I love all the 'You're wrong but I'm not going to give a reason why' types.
Posted on 2/22/12 at 4:31 pm to floridatigah
quote:
I love all the 'You're wrong but I'm not going to give a reason why' types.
My opinion has just as much factual evidence supporting it as yours does. I think Drummond is a HUGE flop risk. His production is all the evidence I need.
Drummond is supposedly a supreme shot blocker, but only ranks 18 in the country.
Drummond is supposedly a monster down low with sick jumps, but doesn't even sniff the top 100 rebounders.
Drummond is supposedly on a team with another freak lottery pick, yet they are on the tournament bubble.
Now, where are your "facts," mr man?
Posted on 2/22/12 at 4:43 pm to Jester
quote:
Drummond is supposedly a supreme shot blocker, but only ranks 18 in the country.
That's a pretty bad argument. 2.5 blocks a game in 28 mins is good.
quote:
Drummond is supposedly on a team with another freak lottery pick, yet they are on the tournament bubble.
They've been without their hall of fame coach for much of the season. Kind of stupid to put their record on him especially since he joined them extremely late.
Posted on 2/22/12 at 5:14 pm to Jester
It's like you didn't even read the thread besides the one snippet that you quoted.
It's a lot easier to project a defense/rebounding big man than a scorer. What Drummond does well almost always translates to the NBA. Nobody knows how a scorer will. Drummond's shot blocking and rebounding numbers are good for the minutes he plays, not sure why you would bring those up as a slight on him. I have no idea what his team's success has to do with his NBA potential.
It's a lot easier to project a defense/rebounding big man than a scorer. What Drummond does well almost always translates to the NBA. Nobody knows how a scorer will. Drummond's shot blocking and rebounding numbers are good for the minutes he plays, not sure why you would bring those up as a slight on him. I have no idea what his team's success has to do with his NBA potential.
Posted on 2/23/12 at 8:00 am to saintsfan22
quote:
That's a pretty bad argument. 2.5 blocks a game in 28 mins is good.
Of the 16 "less talented" and one more talented player ahead of him, he only has more blocks per 40 minutes than two of them, Cameron Moore of UAB and Kyle O'Quinn of Norfolk State. Now, if you look down below him, there are lots of players with more blocks per 40 minutes. See for yourself.
quote:
They've been without their hall of fame coach for much of the season. Kind of stupid to put their record on him especially since he joined them extremely late.
This excuse only goes so far when you're arguing for 2 lottery picks on the team.
Posted on 2/23/12 at 8:08 am to floridatigah
quote:
It's like you didn't even read the thread besides the one snippet that you quoted.
No, I read the whole thread. The part that I quoted was just the most arrogant and deserved scorn. Deal with it.
quote:
Drummond's shot blocking
See above. His shot blocking per 40 minutes is not "elite."
quote:
rebounding numbers are good for the minutes he plays
I can't find anywhere that lets you sort players by Rebounds per 40 minutes, but
Drummond has 204 rebounds in 757 minutes (204/757 * 40 = 10.78)
Look at THIS LINK and notice the Rebounds per 40 on the right side. Again, his numbers are not elite.
I'm really sorry to break this information to you, but maybe you should actually back up your arguments like you insist from everyone with whom you disagree.
Posted on 2/23/12 at 12:26 pm to Jester
Arrogant? What is arrogant about saying I think a player has a higher ceiling and floor? Don't follow you there, maybe you meant to use another word.
It's a draft discussion, I've never paraded my opinion as fact, not sure why you think I'm doing that, this was a good thread until you showed up.
I said he was a good rebounder/shotblocker, not elite, but you obviously felt the need to twist my argument to fit your agenda. No need to be a douche, I know you're having a tough season, I'm just here to talk some draft.
It's a draft discussion, I've never paraded my opinion as fact, not sure why you think I'm doing that, this was a good thread until you showed up.
I said he was a good rebounder/shotblocker, not elite, but you obviously felt the need to twist my argument to fit your agenda. No need to be a douche, I know you're having a tough season, I'm just here to talk some draft.
Posted on 2/23/12 at 12:43 pm to floridatigah
quote:
Arrogant? What is arrogant about saying I think a player has a higher ceiling and floor?
To answer your question:
quote:
I love all the 'You're wrong but I'm not going to give a reason why' types.
That is the part that I called arrogant. You are clearly implying that your opinion holds more weight than any other swinging dick on this board.
Posted on 2/23/12 at 12:45 pm to floridatigah
quote:
It's a draft discussion, I've never paraded my opinion as fact, not sure why you think I'm doing that, this was a good thread until you showed up.
You're crawfishing like a politician now. All I did was show up and provide fact-based analysis of the player in question. If you can't handle that, talk to your shrink.
quote:
I said he was a good rebounder/shotblocker, not elite, but you obviously felt the need to twist my argument to fit your agenda. No need to be a douche, I know you're having a tough season, I'm just here to talk some draft.
Haha, nice little arrogant innuendo there at the end.
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