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Message
re: The Agents Killing the NBA
Posted on 10/6/11 at 6:06 pm to Jester
Posted on 10/6/11 at 6:06 pm to Jester
quote:
Fair enough, now go to your boss and tell him that he owes you a raise. Fight for your rights. I'm sorry, but they are fighting for money, not rights. That's Sprewellian.
That is a poor analogy.
This is a contract negotiation where the owners are asking their employees to take a drastic paycut after producing record revenues and ratings. How many employees would agree to those conditions?
The owners locked the players out. The players are demanding nothing from the owners- they are even giving money back!
0
Posted on 10/6/11 at 7:11 pm to Jester
quote:
I don't see players shelling out a percentage of their endorsement deals to their teams.
not comparable
do players get to add personal costs in the calculation?
Posted on 10/6/11 at 7:17 pm to Jester
quote:
The new CBA should protect them from those types of contracts
ridiculous statement. that's just such a retarded view (and i don't mean just you, many people hold this view)
quote:
Teams like the Heat and Knicks won't be able to drive up the price for Joe Johnson so carelessly.
did the heat and knicks invent free agency?
the heat and knicks didn't drive up shite
quote:
Are you really going to argue that Kobe and Lebron are underpaid? Really?
yes
if there was no cap, would they make more or less? more
if there was no max salary, would they make more or less? more
quote:
Aside from a couple teams that have the liquidity and market to absorb huge contracts like that, teams are getting to a breaking point.
that's a revenue issue, not a salary issue
that's an owner-owner issue, not a player-owner issue
quote:
Right after they find about $10B in free and flexible capital to invest in a business model with limited returns.
a. it wouldn't cost $10B to start up a new league, esp one with 8-10 teams
b. there would almost assuredly be ownership groups willing to invest in teams if they got lebrons, kobes, etc
Posted on 10/6/11 at 7:19 pm to Jester
quote:
I'm not going to look it up, but I'm pretty sure both of those leagues make considerably more money than the NBA.
the NFL does
the MLB? who knows. books are cooked and the top-level teams generate a shitload of revenue. the bottom-level teams? nope
and the NBA often dominates in merchandise sales and in foreign markets
This post was edited on 10/6/11 at 7:20 pm
Posted on 10/6/11 at 7:21 pm to Jester
quote:
now go to your boss and tell him that he owes you a raise.
the players already conceded a paycut. they're down to 52% last i checked. the owners hadn't moved from 47%
Posted on 10/6/11 at 7:29 pm to SlowFlowPro
Owners offered 49. Either way, people who struggle to pay their bills are losing their jobs. I have no sympathy for the players making slightly less than a shitload.
Posted on 10/6/11 at 8:03 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
this all depends on how many european teams can absorb NBA players. and i don't mean the stars, i mean the mid/low level guys
Won't be enough.
Posted on 10/6/11 at 8:12 pm to corndeaux
quote:
Do you hate the players b/c they're black or b/c they're labor?
Please tell me you're not being serious. Please. You make yourself far less credible with that nonsense.
And, yes, I believe some of the unwise owners need to be saved from themselves. If that rubs someone the wrong way, tough shite. I have no love for the owners, necessarily. Nor do I have a particular love for the players. What I want to see is a league with a competitive balance and not dominated by big market teams with a sham of a salary cap and nonsensical guaranteed contracts. If anyone thinks changing the business model is somehow subjecting the players to economic "slavery", they need to seek therapy.
Posted on 10/6/11 at 8:23 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
a. it wouldn't cost $10B to start up a new league, esp one with 8-10 teams
Again, only concerned for the stars. The seed funding is only part of it. The logistics would be very tricky.
Posted on 10/6/11 at 8:27 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
ridiculous statement. that's just such a retarded view (and i don't mean just you, many people hold this view)
Not sure how you took that, but in case you misunderstood, I used should as in "will probably." I can't see how that's ridiculous.
Posted on 10/6/11 at 8:42 pm to VOR
A joke at 7am. Admittedly a poor one.
I think saving owners from themselves is different from guaranteeing them profits. Shortening max contract length and abolishing the mid level are two good moves for the owners that will help.
Don't think its slavery at all. But I don't understand how people say players are greedy here or during the NFL lockout.
I think saving owners from themselves is different from guaranteeing them profits. Shortening max contract length and abolishing the mid level are two good moves for the owners that will help.
Don't think its slavery at all. But I don't understand how people say players are greedy here or during the NFL lockout.
Posted on 10/6/11 at 8:59 pm to Jester
quote:
people who struggle to pay their bills are losing their jobs
Because the owners have locked them out. But I guess that is the players fault.....
Posted on 10/6/11 at 9:13 pm to TigerinATL
quote:
I don't think they are BS. The interest expense seems to be the main amount in dispute. The players can't point to franchise value as if it's owner profit and then turn around and complain that owners have to finance franchise purchases now that they cost $300 million instead of $30 million. That seems like a legit expense, not many potential owners will show up with $300 - $400 million in cash.
Fair enough. I agree the NBA has probably taken on losses, but not nearly what Stern/Silver have led us to believe. I would imagine if they had more equitable revenue sharing from tv contracts, those losses would be greatly reduced. This was the first year that the escrow payments have ever been returned to the players. It's not all doom and gloom in the board room.
Posted on 10/6/11 at 10:11 pm to corndeaux
One other point that makes a distinction that actually amounts to a difference. Players are not "employees" of the NBA. Not really. They are independent contractors of various franchises and they are subject to rules incorporated by reference in every contract (as are the various franchises). I never have thought of sports figures, movie stars, etc., as being part of a true labor movement. Just my two cents
Posted on 10/6/11 at 11:07 pm to corndeaux
quote:
Because the owners have locked them out. But I guess that is the players fault.....
Oh, yeah. Struggling.
Posted on 10/7/11 at 12:29 am to Jester
lol wut?
The players aren't and will not be struggling. But the locked out arena workers who need the paychecks will be.
The players aren't and will not be struggling. But the locked out arena workers who need the paychecks will be.
Posted on 10/7/11 at 12:31 am to corndeaux
I don't believe they are part of the NBPA. I do feel for those people.
Posted on 10/7/11 at 12:33 am to Jester
Finally we agree on something. Just took 16 hours 
Posted on 10/7/11 at 12:46 am to VOR
Agree that pro athletes are not true labor now.
I assume you are an attorney or have contract experience, so serious question: how much did Curt Flood change things?
I assume you are an attorney or have contract experience, so serious question: how much did Curt Flood change things?
Posted on 10/7/11 at 7:07 am to corndeaux
quote:
so serious question: how much did Curt Flood change things?
In the world of professional sports, he shifted the earth on its axis as far as owners were concerned.
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