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re: Pelicans, one of the teams, reached out to Portland for Damian Lillard
Posted on 7/5/23 at 3:13 pm to SouthMSReb
Posted on 7/5/23 at 3:13 pm to SouthMSReb
Like all these young good not great players, they're all overpaid and they become poor value once they get paid like an all-star.
0
Posted on 7/5/23 at 3:19 pm to BallHawk
quote:
Pels would have to give a godfather offer to do this straight up...
Part of Portland’s demand to trade Dame is to also dump Nurc. Our price to take on Nurc and swap him with an expiring Jonas in this scenario would be Jovic (equivalent of a 1st round pick value).
We then take Nurc and 2 1sts (one lottery protected) and flip for Gafford, or we could see if Spurs would be interested in swapping for Collins for a single 1st as Nurc would be a good running mate for Wemby.
Posted on 7/5/23 at 3:22 pm to teke184
quote:
He got played off the floor during parts of their playoff run.
what?
he played in the 1st game of the playoffs, broke his hand, and couldn't play again.
A guy that has averaged 20ppg, 39% 3 point shooting, 90% FT shooting, 5 boards and 4 assists for the last 2 years as a 22/23 year old isn't a negative asset b/c he makes $27M/yr
Posted on 7/5/23 at 3:25 pm to Soggymoss
Rather than making it that complicated, why wouldn’t the Pels just trade JV and a protected first to Washington for Gafford? Or just see if the Spurs would straight up swap JV and Collins?
ETA: I’m not even advocating for the Pels to trade a first and JV for Gafford, but that’s essentially what you did in the trade. I’m just saying that if they were interested in that type of deal they wouldn’t need to get into this big convoluted trade.
ETA: I’m not even advocating for the Pels to trade a first and JV for Gafford, but that’s essentially what you did in the trade. I’m just saying that if they were interested in that type of deal they wouldn’t need to get into this big convoluted trade.
This post was edited on 7/5/23 at 3:33 pm
Posted on 7/5/23 at 3:32 pm to TeddyPadillac
quote:He's in the same tier as Jordan Poole IMO, who seemed like a neutral asset at best and not a positive one, so perhaps not too far off.
A guy that has averaged 20ppg, 39% 3 point shooting, 90% FT shooting, 5 boards and 4 assists for the last 2 years as a 22/23 year old isn't a negative asset b/c he makes $27M/yr
I imagine teams are posturing some at this point like saying they'd need a 1st to get Herro, but I don't think he has much positive value.
Posted on 7/5/23 at 3:44 pm to Epic Cajun
quote:
Rather than making it that complicated, why wouldn’t the Pels just trade JV and a protected first to Washington for Gafford? Or just see if the Spurs would straight up swap JV and Collins?
To get Jovic who fits perfectly and seems to be the next up and coming stretch 5 that we’ve seemed to have been looking for, if his summer league performance continues to translate.
We’re not just swapping Jonas for Gafford/Collins in that deal, it’s also to get Jovic, a 20 year old that could be our future at the 5.
This post was edited on 7/5/23 at 3:48 pm
Posted on 7/5/23 at 3:50 pm to shel311
quote:
He's in the same tier as Jordan Poole IMO, who seemed like a neutral asset at best and not a positive one, so perhaps not too far off.
I think Poole and Clarkson are good comps for him. Most people think Clarkson is good value at 18 million average annual value and Poole is overvalued at 32 million AAV. Herro is at 30 mill AAV on his deal.
Posted on 7/5/23 at 3:53 pm to Epic Cajun
quote:Yep
I think Poole and Clarkson are good comps for him. Most people think Clarkson is good value at 18 million average annual value and Poole is overvalued at 32 million AAV. Herro is at 30 mill AAV on his deal.
I mean, I don't honestly think Miami would have to give up a 1st to move Herro, but I also don't think he has much value over being roughly a neutral asset.
Posted on 7/5/23 at 3:55 pm to Soggymoss
What would be Miami’s motivation to move on from Jovic?
Posted on 7/5/23 at 3:58 pm to Epic Cajun
quote:
What would be Miami’s motivation to move on from Jovic?
Uhhhh, Did you not see them getting Dame?
Dame is going to cost them Jovic
The deal for Miami-Portland would essentially be:
Miami: Dame
Portland: Herro, Lowry, Jovic, Jaquez, 2 1sts
Portland then takes Jovic and attaches him to Nurc for Jonas and Kira, who they reroute to Miami. Jovic is the cost for them to dump Nurc’s contract.
They then take Herro and Kira if they want and route him to Brooklyn for more picks and Simmons.
We then take Nurc and flip him.
Seems complicated but it’s really not, and the Nurc trade from us to somewhere else could be done separately, and we could keep him until the trade deadline if we wanted while looking for other deals.
This post was edited on 7/5/23 at 4:05 pm
Posted on 7/5/23 at 4:05 pm to shel311
quote:
He's in the same tier as Jordan Poole IMO, who seemed like a neutral asset at best and not a positive one, so perhaps not too far off.
not even close.
Poole has sucked in the playoffs everytime he's played in them. He plays basketball like he's playing in the G-League. He's a chucker, and an inefficient one at that, but they want him to play like Steph even though he's no where near his ability.
He's a 34% 3 point shooter, a turnover machine, and has zero defense despite being 6'4" 200lbs. He plays defense like he's 5'9" 150.
Herro isn't some great defender, but he's a lot better than Poole is on that end.
Posted on 7/5/23 at 4:10 pm to TeddyPadillac
quote:Have you seen Herro's playoff numbers? They're worse, he was also losing minutes 2 seasons ago just like Poole.
Poole has sucked in the playoffs everytime he's played in them
quote:He's more efficient than Herro, by a good bit. MUCH more in the playoffs with Poole's .582 TS% to Herro's .527
He's a chucker, and an inefficient one at that
I fail to see how it's "not close"
This post was edited on 7/5/23 at 4:11 pm
Posted on 7/5/23 at 4:14 pm to TeddyPadillac
quote:
Poole has sucked in the playoffs everytime he's played in them. He plays basketball like he's playing in the G-League. He's a chucker, and an inefficient one at that, but they want him to play like Steph even though he's no where near his ability.
He's only had 2 seasons of playoffs. Last season and this one.
Last season in the playoffs, he shot 51% FG, 39% 3PT, 92% FT. His EFG% was 61% and averaged 17 points a game. Definitely wouldn't consider that an inefficient chucker.
This season (13 games vs 22 last year) he was abysmal in the playoffs.
Posted on 7/5/23 at 4:35 pm to shel311
quote:
Have you seen Herro's playoff numbers? They're worse, he was also losing minutes 2 seasons ago just like Poole.
yeah, have you really looked at them?
He didn't play this year basically.
Last year, he came off the bench all year, and he wasn't good in the first series against ATL. He was his normal self against Philly and did well.
He got hurt in game 3 of the Boston series, and played well in 2 of the 3 games. Maybe they dont' lose that series if he doesnt' get hurt.
The Heat went 11-7 in those playoffs. Herro didn't play in 4 games, and they were 1-3 in those 4. in the 14 games he played in, he finished with a negative +/- in half of them, and the heat lost 4 of those 7. They won all 7 games he finished with a positive +/-.
He was terrible in 2021, getting swept by the Bucks. Jimmy Butler was equally terrible in that series. Those stats are worthless as the entire team was arse for those 4 games.
His rookie campaign he played great in the playoffs.
Don't let two bad series dictate who he was for the other 6.
I'm not saying he's worth $27M/yr, b/c i don't think he is, but he's a neutral asset at worst, and his teammates don't dislike him like most at GSW felt about Chucker Poole.
Posted on 7/5/23 at 4:45 pm to TeddyPadillac
quote:That's where I have him as well, but so is Jordan Poole, which is why I have them in the same tier
but he's a neutral asset at worst,
Posted on 7/5/23 at 4:46 pm to Mickey Goldmill
quote:
Last season in the playoffs, he shot 51% FG, 39% 3PT, 92% FT. His EFG% was 61% and averaged 17 points a game. Definitely wouldn't consider that an inefficient chucker.
Lets look a little closer at that season.
First 8 games:
56% FG, 46% 3PT, 22.9ppg, 2.6TOV to 5.4AST in 33mpg (Curry played limited minutes in Games 1 and 2 (22 minutes), back to normal after that)
Last 14 games:
46% FG, 34% 3PT, 13.6ppg, 2.3TOV to 2.9AST in 24mpg
Posted on 7/5/23 at 4:47 pm to Soggymoss
quote:I thought Jovic was a 4 (and that some mentioned him as a 3/4). I cannot see him as a 5 unless he puts on a lot of weight/muscle).
We’re not just swapping Jonas for Gafford/Collins in that deal, it’s also to get Jovic, a 20 year old that could be our future at the 5.
Posted on 7/5/23 at 4:51 pm to TeddyPadillac
quote:Same goes for Herro though in the playoffs 2 seasons ago.
First 8 games:
56% FG, 46% 3PT, 22.9ppg, 2.6TOV to 5.4AST in 33mpg (Curry played limited minutes in Games 1 and 2 (22 minutes), back to normal after that)
Last 14 games:
46% FG, 34% 3PT, 13.6ppg, 2.3TOV to 2.9AST in 24mpg
1st 7 games: 15ppg on 44% from the field and 30.8% from 3
Last 8 games: 10ppg on 37.8% from the field and 12.9% from 3
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