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re: Why is Marvel (and Disney) like this? Deadpool co-creator Rob Liefeld snubbed at premier.
Posted on 2/8/25 at 2:07 pm to SouthEasternKaiju
Posted on 2/8/25 at 2:07 pm to SouthEasternKaiju
quote:He’s received more minor shoutouts in the Deadpool movies than any other creator in the Marvel films, other than Stan Lee. But in this case (and in the case of Captain America) it has to sting to see Stan Lee get featured speaking cameos in films about a character that you created with zero input from Stan.
My GUESS is that he's not the only one, but because of the deal he has with royalties, is in a position to speak out where otherwise an artist or writer would be hesitant, least they be 'cancelled' or black balled.
So I get it if small infractions get under his skin.
I met Liefeld once. I didn’t tell him that I knew who he was. He seemed nice enough in a casual conversation.
1
Posted on 2/8/25 at 4:07 pm to SouthEasternKaiju
I’d have more sympathy if Liefield had contributed to the characterization that made Deadpool so popular instead of just making a halfassed Deathstroke The Terminator knockoff, down to the name (Wade Wilson vs Slade Wilson).
Posted on 2/8/25 at 4:07 pm to Fewer Kilometers
quote:
He’s received more minor shoutouts in the Deadpool movies
Must be obvious easter eggs to those who know the comics?
I didn't know Deadpool from Adam's house cat, and even the Wade Wilson from Wolverine Origins movie didn't do the character any favors.
When I heard Ryan Reynolds was going to try and reboot the character, I was like "why?". But the more I heard, the more impressed I became, with both Reynolds and the project.
Then I saw a *Talks at Google interview, and realized Ryan was on a mission, unlike any I'd seen in Hollywood. He had no reason to even bother with this, but he was so sold on the idea, he didn't let go. I admire that, and more so with how the movie(s) came out.
* Ignore the chick with the mohawk.
Posted on 2/8/25 at 4:43 pm to SouthEasternKaiju
quote:His name was on the board for the original dead pool bets at the bar, where he also had a walk-through. And in DP vs Wolverine, there was a “Liefeld’s Just Feet” store sign. Liefeld is infamous for not drawing feet. And DP has said his name a couple of times.
Must be obvious easter eggs to those who know the comics?
Posted on 2/8/25 at 4:45 pm to SouthEasternKaiju
quote:
Not in the business, so I can only speak from the sidelines, but comics being turned into movies , very successful ones at that, is a tricky process. Iron Man was probably no bigger deal than say *Green Lantern, but with the right writing, actor and CG , the studios can turn a B list comic hero character into a global sensation. And then to turn a hit movie into a full blown industry itself, like the MCU, it's no small task. Credit goes to the inventor of the character, sure, but to then carry it further to a multi-billion dollar series of movies, where is the line drawn for each to get their fair share?
I agree with all this. That was kind of my point. Deadpool wouldn't be anything today without Ryan Reynaolds taking an interest and pushing the character. Rob Liefeld is fortunate that happened and he gets royalties, and isn't owed anything beyond that.
This post was edited on 2/8/25 at 5:37 pm
Posted on 2/8/25 at 4:48 pm to SouthEasternKaiju
frick Rob Liefeld
Posted on 2/8/25 at 5:31 pm to SouthEasternKaiju
quote:
Just asking why Disney Marvel is acting like this.
Liefeld gets paid for the use of Deadpool and he got invited to a movie premiere.
While I don't think that's great treatment, it's certainly better treatment than they've given writers like Jonathan Hickman and Ed Brubaker, who created the infinity saga and captain america/winter soldier arcs, respectively, that so much of the the first 3 phases were based on. Hickman also created secret wars.
This sentiment at this moment for this writer is weird. Marvel and DC have always treated their comic book writers like shite. Liefeld is one of the few who built enough power to make industry-wide changes for them. I get being bummed that you didn't get rockstar treatment, but he hasn't been a comic book rockstar since the 90s.
And, again, he's getting paid for the intellectual property where most other writers are not. If we want to treat writers better, we probably shouldn't also worship and wish for the return of executives like Perlmutter, who did everything in their power to treat writers like garbage.
Posted on 2/8/25 at 6:22 pm to SouthEasternKaiju
That was a pretty fair article.
I think this might be a factor in his drama and perceived slights:
He's announced that he plans to retire (even more-so) from drawing, due to his hands dropping off with age. Publicly announced a big personal decision, and may have been thinking of DvW events as some big retirement celebration or something.
But he's definitely gotten far more recognition and money than most comics creators ever did. Kind of laughable to compare himself to Siegel and Shuster.
I think this might be a factor in his drama and perceived slights:
quote:
It also comes one week before his final Marvel work will hit stands, Deadpool Team-Up No. 5.
He's announced that he plans to retire (even more-so) from drawing, due to his hands dropping off with age. Publicly announced a big personal decision, and may have been thinking of DvW events as some big retirement celebration or something.
But he's definitely gotten far more recognition and money than most comics creators ever did. Kind of laughable to compare himself to Siegel and Shuster.
Posted on 2/8/25 at 6:24 pm to Jay Are
quote:
writers like Jonathan Hickman and Ed Brubaker, who created the infinity saga and captain america/winter soldier arcs, respectively, that so much of the the first 3 phases were based on. Hickman also created secret wars.
That brings up an interesting point I hadn't considered. I assumed the reasons they changed up storylines they drew from was to keep comic book readers from pulling the bookreader thing on Game of Thrones, but they may also have had some considerations about how closely they could use that IP without getting into more complicated issues of royalties.
Posted on 2/8/25 at 6:32 pm to Jay Are
I don’t think he’s asking for a gold statue, but if you’re gonna treat him one way for the first two movies, why snub him for the third movie? And with no explanation? Professional courtesy is that if you get treated in a manner befitting as a creator, then what changed?
At the end the day it sounds like Disney Marvel is just being a dick because they can be. And I guess they assume since he has his reputation, what difference does it make anyways?
At the end the day it sounds like Disney Marvel is just being a dick because they can be. And I guess they assume since he has his reputation, what difference does it make anyways?
This post was edited on 2/8/25 at 9:09 pm
Posted on 2/9/25 at 1:02 am to SouthEasternKaiju
quote:
comic book folk in general tend to feel snubbed for their creations.
This is the bigger issue to me. Without these creators there aren't all these billion dollar franchises to milk dry.
Posted on 2/9/25 at 1:06 am to Jay Are
quote:
he hasn't been a comic book rockstar since the 90s.
I'd even argue there's maybe only a handful of comic book rockstars since the 90s. Those image guys changed the game back then.
Posted on 2/9/25 at 1:08 am to Jay Are
quote:
Hickman also created secret wars.
Not the original secret wars or infinity gauntlet storyline but Hickman is definitely one of Marvels more recent prolific writers.
Posted on 2/9/25 at 1:15 am to imjustafatkid
quote:
Deadpool wouldn't be anything today without Ryan Reynaolds taking an interest and pushing the character.
This is kind of absurd. You could say the same thing about a lot of the marvel MCU characters minus Spider-Man.
None of them were billion dollar franchises before the MCU. Deadpool was still very popular in the mediums he existed. So much so that he has his own video game and the was that bastardized version of him in wolverine origins.
Posted on 2/9/25 at 1:19 am to imjustafatkid
quote:
The best bet is to make a name for yourself and then go off on your own but these guys who want to work for a big company and then complain they don't own their stuff that the big company promoted and turned into a huge success are just losers imo. They pretend the only reason their work is famous is because they worked on it.
Meh. A lot of these characters were created decades ago. I think maybe you'd have more of a point for things created in the last 10-15 years but calling people like Jim Starlin or Jack Kirby losers because they worked for marvel or DC and created tons of the characters that are now household name is kind of weird.
Posted on 2/9/25 at 9:46 am to JasonMason
quote:
This is kind of absurd. You could say the same thing about a lot of the marvel MCU characters minus Spider-Man.
No, no I couldn't. Ryan Reynolds persistently pushed the Deadpool movie to Fox (not Disney). The studio heads didn't think it was a marketable character. Rob Liefeld further hit the jackpot because if Disney owned that character at that time we'd have never gotten any Deadpool film no matter what Ryan Reynolds did to push the character.
Posted on 2/9/25 at 9:48 am to JasonMason
quote:
Meh. A lot of these characters were created decades ago. I think maybe you'd have more of a point for things created in the last 10-15 years but calling people like Jim Starlin or Jack Kirby losers because they worked for marvel or DC and created tons of the characters that are now household name is kind of weird.
This thread is about Rob Liefeld. I didn't say anything about Jack Kirby or Jim Starlin. Or Bob Kane or Stan Lee or you know any of those early guys who basically built the companies. Those guys have a different argument. I think it's pretty obvious I'm talking about creators who joined established companies they know have basically a work-for-hire model and then cry that they don't own their work.
Rob Liefeld doesn't belong in the same conversation with the creators you mentioned. He knew what the deal was when he created Deadpool and is owed nothing. At least he was smart enough to get persistent royalties written into his contract.
This post was edited on 2/9/25 at 9:51 am
Posted on 2/9/25 at 10:31 am to JasonMason
quote:
Not the original secret wars or infinity gauntlet storyline but Hickman is definitely one of Marvels more recent prolific writers.
I didn't mean Hickman created the infinity gauntlet, but his late 2000s avengers crossover with the infinity gauntlet and Thanos was the backbone for mcu avengers.
And good point about secret wars. We can call Hickman's a remake. I doubt the mcu will be pulling much from the 84 version.
Posted on 2/9/25 at 11:54 am to imjustafatkid
quote:
Rob Liefeld doesn't belong in the same conversation with the creators you mentioned. He knew what the deal was when he created Deadpool and is owed nothing.
Agreed he doesn't belong in the conversation of Kirby but he created a lot of the early X-Force in addition to Deadpool. He has the most sold number one issue only behind Jim Lee's X-Men number one and ahead of MacFarlane's Spider-Man number one. You can shite on Liefeld as an artist if you wish but he created several characters that are still very popular today. If there's was no Deadpool, there's no Ryan Reynolds fighting for a Deadpool movie. That's just ignorant to downplay his importance in comics history because of his ego or whatever reason you don't like him. The bottom line is that his art sold a ton of books and he created several characters that made marvel a lot of money.
Posted on 2/9/25 at 12:12 pm to JasonMason
quote:
You can shite on Liefeld as an artist if you wish
quote:
That's just ignorant to downplay his importance in comics history
You would have to intentionally misread my comments to conclude this is what I'm doing.
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