re: New Netflix docu-series "Making a Murderer" (Spoilers)

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Suggesting cops a. Found key on site b. Moved key c. Planted key in house all completely undetected is a very detailed and elaborate accusation.

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Not really. Put the key on the floor with other agency guy looking somewhere else. Shake the desk around a bit. "Hey guys this key just fell out of the desk"

Also the key didn't have any of Halbach's DNA on it. How can you explain that?

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There is no reason to be concerned because whatever they find has to be verified by ever other agency there and documented.

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Again. The problems aren't with the WHAT they found, it's how they found it.

We can confirm it was Teresa key, yet question how it went unnoticed for days, in relatively plain sight, until the person who shouldn't have been there miraculously found it.

In other words, your diverting away from the problem (the discovery of the evidence) by conflating it with something that isn't a problem (what the evidence is). It's dishonest.

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Someone clarify this for me, but if I remember correctly, they found her DNA on the key, but not Avery's.

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Other way around I believe. Found Avery's DNA but none of Hallbach's.

So when its convenient to question the legitimacy of dna testing, avery supporters do so in the case of his blood in the car. But then avery supporters ask well wheres her dna on the key? Dont know. Doesn't really mean anything. Im sure avery supporters will conclude it wasnt really her key. Crooked cops were also locksmiths and can generate keys. You are ridiculous. The simplest explanations usually prove right. You got cops stealing decade old blood planting keys firing bullets from guns then putting victims dna on it. It is completely impossible that police did all that undetected. Its actually must more absurd than believing the kids story.

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Playing that same game

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I don't know why you would do this

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the prosecution has to provide conclusive evidence supporting their case for murder

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By "conclusive" you mean, "beyond a reasonable doubt."

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(including how and where she died).

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Nope. Merely that she died and that Avery's actions resulted in that death.

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The prosecution was tasked (or tasked themselves) with not just proving that Avery was 'the most likely' person to be responsibly for Halbach's death.

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You're mixing up things here. They had to prove he willfully caused her death (murder), beyond a reasonable doubt. "Most likely" or "more likely than not" sound like civil burdens of proof, inapplicable here.

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The prosecution's task was to prove, beyond reasonable doubt, that Steve Avery raped and slit the throat of Theresa in the bedroom of his trailer and drug it out to the garage where she was then shot upwards of 11 times, and then from the body was drug out and burned beyond recognition.

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None of this is true.

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Even using the evidence not seen in the documentary (phone calls, etc), there is no way that this is what happened beyond a reasonable doubt.

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I generally agree that reasonable doubt remains, even considering a lot of the evidence adroitly omitted from the documentary. However, that doesn't change your entire flawed premise.

Juries are allowed to reasonably infer whatever they want from the evidence presented. They do NOT, in any jurisdiction I know, have to completely accept the state's theory and completely reject the defense theory in order to return a sustainable conviction - even for murder. The skill of the lawyers should have no ultimate effect on a just verdict, in other words.

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I forgot which episode it was, but the prosecution had to resort to saying that a copy of Auto Trader magazine being present in the trailer "proved" that Halbach was there, which is ridiculous.

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That was argument. As Steven Avery didn't testify that he took the Auto Trader magazine from here and putting it next to his computer (after initially denying he had even seen her that day), it was a reasonable argument. Defense certainly pointed out there was no evidence, either way, of how the magazine came to be there.

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Im sure avery supporters will conclude it wasnt really her key.

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It most likely was her key.

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It is completely impossible that police did all that undetected.

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You really think it is not possible? Christ lol.

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So when its convenient to question the legitimacy of dna testing, avery supporters do so in the case of his blood in the car. But then avery supporters ask well wheres her dna on the key?

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I'm not even sure what you're trying to argue here. The lack of her DNA on the key is problematic. She handles the keys daily for what was probably years and there is ZERO DNA on it? I guess she wore gloves every time she handled the key.

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You really think it is not possible? Christ lol.

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Is it impossible? No.

Is it highly unlikely? Yes

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Why isn't there blood all over the place where he supposedly slit the throat of a woman?

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There is a problem with Brendan's original "confession" and some of the broader strokes of the states' theory of the case in this regard. With as cluttered and dirty environment that Avery lived in, extending to the garage, it is difficult to imagine a scenario in which she could have been killed by having her throat slit and have all that blood get cleaned up afterwards.

The state missed an opportunity, though. A .22lr makes a very small entrance wound. They are favored for executions by the mob for a variety of reasons - one of which is that a close range, fatal shot to the head doesn't make a huge mess of brain tissue and blood. Certainly not much more than a small, contained pool that could be cleaned up with a gallon of bleach and a little elbow grease. Part of what the defense raised was that, "If he did this they way they say, where is the blood?" No one seriously believes she could have been butchered, with blood everywhere, in either the trailer bedroom or the garage and not left some blood evidence.

On the other hand, if she were raped on a tarp, shot in the head in the garage - the evidence could have been cleaned up by Avery alone, in a short period of time, IMHO.

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I'm not even sure what you're trying to argue here. The lack of her DNA on the key is problematic. She handles the keys daily for what was probably years and there is ZERO DNA on it? I guess she wore gloves every time she handled the key.

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Or Avery wiped the key and inadvertently touched it with his sweating finger.



His sweat/skin DNA was also found on the hood latch of the RAV4 .

Are you suggesting that the sheriff's department has a vial of Avery's sweat that they used to plant on the key and RAV4?