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Message
re: 'Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power' Ep 1 Negativity Thread. Enter at your own risk
Posted on 8/26/22 at 6:16 am to Bronc
Posted on 8/26/22 at 6:16 am to Bronc
quote:
"Woke," as used as a pejorative, is basically just the newest catch all term always angry right-wing culture warriors use to describe the social and racial changes being reflected in modern society that annoy them.
This is a very incorrect definition.
Your definition completely leaves out the force involved. In this example, forcing in diversity into a mythology where it doesn't work well. Forcing changes to a mythology that is pretty set for the sole reason of modernizing it.
quote:
But, I think there is just that period in some people's mental life cycle where they progressively don't want to deal with shifting internal tolerances, biases, and just generally shut down mentally or lash out when perceived social changes are presented in their environment or challenge their default ways of thinking.
Again, no. People don't want established properties to be hijacked for irrational political symbolism.
I don't think I said it in this LOTR-ROP thread, but I asked it in another: if the producers were so concerned with creating a representative fantasy world, why didn't they just, you know, create their own? Or use a fantasy property that doesn't have the established history and mythology (like D&D, which has a canon-adjacent at best movie coming out that nobody is upset about in any large number)?
The reasoning is that they are intentionally attacking apolitical institutions and because their politics aren't popular enough on their own to be the center point of a new creation. They have to hijack established properties because they use to use those properties to get normal people to care about their insanity.
Don't be ignorant and pretend this is some noble, organic change. This is an orchestrated attack on Western institutions and works. The entire philosophy is crypto-Marxist bullshite.
As Tolkein said:
quote:
“Evil cannot create anything new, they can only corrupt and ruin good forces have invented or made”
3
Posted on 8/26/22 at 6:52 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
They have to hijack established properties because they use to use those properties to get normal people to care about their insanity.
Parasites and Bedazzlers.
Posted on 8/26/22 at 7:06 am to oogabooga68
For the record from what I have seen with this show, other than the silly race injections for forced diversity, the stuff doesn't really bother me at all and the forced diversity doesn't bother me as much as take me out of the show to process for a second. I just kind of see it as jarring and it reminds me of the wokeness.
It doesn't really make me judge the show any differently, only the producers, writers, and actors. The same thing is true with the new game of thrones show. It's jarring and takes you out of the scene for a split second and then makes you start thinking about the forced politics instead of the show but you can recover from it pretty quickly.
I probably don't rate these shows very highly to where that interruption would affect my viewing, just as I would probably be on my laptop while watching the show because it's of mid quality regardless. If these were super high quality shows that I expected to require engagement, then it would probably annoy me to the highest degree. But they're mid-quality stuff at best.
*ETA: I need to save voice to texting while walking the dogs for other topics.
*ETA ETA: And before someone tries to say that the fact that I'm taken out of the story because of the woke injection is exactly why they need to in order to combat my inherent racial bias, I'll just respond with reality: These high fantasy shows are explicitly based in Medeival European (and sometimes specifically Briton/Anglo-Saxon) mythologies, histories, and setting. I imagine there were many years during the Medeival period where the British isles had no people of sub-Saharan african descent present. So yeah, it's jarring. Like I said earlier, a fantasy property without that sort of realism at its base would not have the same effects (again, see: D&D).
It doesn't really make me judge the show any differently, only the producers, writers, and actors. The same thing is true with the new game of thrones show. It's jarring and takes you out of the scene for a split second and then makes you start thinking about the forced politics instead of the show but you can recover from it pretty quickly.
I probably don't rate these shows very highly to where that interruption would affect my viewing, just as I would probably be on my laptop while watching the show because it's of mid quality regardless. If these were super high quality shows that I expected to require engagement, then it would probably annoy me to the highest degree. But they're mid-quality stuff at best.
*ETA: I need to save voice to texting while walking the dogs for other topics.
*ETA ETA: And before someone tries to say that the fact that I'm taken out of the story because of the woke injection is exactly why they need to in order to combat my inherent racial bias, I'll just respond with reality: These high fantasy shows are explicitly based in Medeival European (and sometimes specifically Briton/Anglo-Saxon) mythologies, histories, and setting. I imagine there were many years during the Medeival period where the British isles had no people of sub-Saharan african descent present. So yeah, it's jarring. Like I said earlier, a fantasy property without that sort of realism at its base would not have the same effects (again, see: D&D).
This post was edited on 8/26/22 at 7:34 am
Posted on 8/26/22 at 7:25 am to Bronc
quote:God, you're a miserable count.
Bronc
Posted on 8/26/22 at 7:30 am to blueboy
quote:
God, you're a miserable count.
He’s a literal communist, so of course he’s miserable. The only happy communist is one who has achieved absolute power, so roughly .00001% of them in history.
Posted on 8/26/22 at 7:36 am to OMLandshark
I have a lot of meetings this morning and I went to get this picture in anticipation of a response, so I'll post it now:
There may be no better single act/image that displays the stupidity of wokeness than the above.
There may be no better single act/image that displays the stupidity of wokeness than the above.
Posted on 8/26/22 at 7:49 am to SlowFlowPro
Posted on 8/26/22 at 8:32 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Don't be ignorant and pretend this is some noble, organic change.
I am not pretending that. I am saying that it's a defensive action, not an offensive action, in the Culture War.
I have written earlier in this thread of Tolkien's use of High, Middle, and Low in describing the races of men of Middle Earth. Of the fact that whiter skin in Gondor is a sign of high blood. That the swarthy, slant-eyed southerner in Bree turns out to be half orc
Tolkien, in a letters, wrote that orcs we're:
"squat, broad, flat-nosed, sallow-skinned, with wide mouths and slant eyes: in fact degraded and repulsive versions of the (to Europeans) least lovely Mongol-types."
So, orcs are ugly because they are Asian. Like I said, we should be grateful that Tolkien isn't cancelled
If Amazon had actually tried to make this show with an all-white cast, the racial stuff in LOTR would be all that critics talked about. There would have been a systematic woke attack on the show.
As I have said, I am grateful that using a multi-racial cast allows Tolkien to be presented to a new generation, and millions of young people will read his books and benefit from them.
Posted on 8/26/22 at 8:40 am to GOP_Tiger
To clarify: I do not believe that Tolkien was racist. At the least, he was not consciously racist. If you want a balanced reading, go to the Wikipedia article: Tolkien and Race.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tolkien_and_race?wprov=sfla1
But a balanced view is not what critics would do with this show if it were filmed with an all-white cast.
It would be savaged as a racist show from a racist author.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tolkien_and_race?wprov=sfla1
But a balanced view is not what critics would do with this show if it were filmed with an all-white cast.
It would be savaged as a racist show from a racist author.
Posted on 8/26/22 at 8:43 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Your definition completely leaves out the force involved. In this example, forcing in diversity into a mythology where it doesn't work well.
The definition is fine, because as I said, there is no coherent structure to the anti-woke culture panic on the right. No more than there was when you all were clutching pearls about gays in the military, the satanic panic, mosques being built in NYC, more brown people in the country, or women calling men out on harassment in the 90's or today. Hell you can go back further and tie the lineage back to the reactionaries protesting interracial marriage laws and telling black people to quit disrupting good businesses by protesting inside them. And at every stop those reactionaries convinced themselves they were the victims, and their perpetrators subject to some grand conspiracy of secret villainy that needed to be snuffed out.
It's all coming from the same place of hyper reactive responses from ignorance to social change and the tribalistic "othering" of out groups.
This post was edited on 8/26/22 at 8:45 am
Posted on 8/26/22 at 8:54 am to Bronc
quote:
The definition is fine, because as I said, there is no coherent structure to the anti-woke culture panic on the right.
Here’s our structure: leave our properties alone and stop infusing it with your Woke agenda, you fricking hack.
quote:
No more than there was when you all were clutching pearls about gays in the military, the satanic panic, mosques being built in NYC, more brown people in the country, or women calling men out on harassment in the 90's or today.
Oh for frick’s sake.
quote:
Hell you can go back further and tie the lineage back to the reactionaries protesting interracial marriage laws and telling black people to quit disrupting good businesses by protesting inside them.
Yeah, because wanting someone to be appropriately cast is the exact same as Jim Crow and the Klan.
quote:
And at every stop those reactionaries convinced themselves they were the victims, and their perpetrators subject to some grand conspiracy of secret villainy that needed to be snuffed out.
It's all coming from the same place of hyper reactive responses from ignorance to social change and the tribalistic "othering" of out groups.
Go frick yourself, you filthy communist. We should treat communists the way we treat Nazis. You’re evil.
This post was edited on 8/26/22 at 8:55 am
Posted on 8/26/22 at 9:02 am to OMLandshark
quote:
He’s a literal communist, so of course he’s miserable. The only happy communist is one who has achieved absolute power, so roughly .00001% of them in history.
Posted on 8/26/22 at 9:03 am to Bronc
quote:
The definition is fine, because as I said, there is no coherent structure to the anti-woke culture panic on the right.
This is not true.
Take this thread. They just want the preservation of cultural works. That's why every time some producers/directors force wokeness into shows for no rational reason outside of being woke, this same response occurs.
quote:
No more than there was when you all were clutching pearls about gays in the military, the satanic panic, mosques being built in NYC, more brown people in the country, or women calling men out on harassment in the 90's or today.
What in the frick.
Holy straw man.
quote:
ignorance to social change
Social change is fine. You're assigning sweeping commentary with the most fart-smelling reverence but it's all based in a dishonest argument.
Nobody would care if these producers made a new fantasy epic with black dwarves and elves. This alone disproves your entire thesis and evaporates your soapbox you're screaming it from.
This post was edited on 8/26/22 at 9:04 am
Posted on 8/26/22 at 9:11 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
They just want the preservation of cultural works.
Here’s the thing about communists like Bronc: they think they’re entitled to everything and that they have the right to steal from you. They’re scumbags of the highest order.
Posted on 8/26/22 at 9:15 am to OMLandshark
quote:
Go frick yourself, you filthy communist. We should treat communists the way we treat Nazis. You’re evil.
FYI, you dont own LOTR you hyperventilating manchild. Bezos holds the rights to the adaption he has, and he chose to adapt it the way he did. You could, afterall, spend less time whining and circle jerking about the red scare on the internet and go out and make your own all-white adaption.
Short of that, cry some more bitch. You are getting black hobbits and Galadriel with a sword and there is not a single thing you can do about it but cry all over the internet.
This post was edited on 8/26/22 at 9:26 am
Posted on 8/26/22 at 9:32 am to GOP_Tiger
quote:It's based on Norse mythology, and as all the races were white, it's just different kinds of white people.
Tolkien's use of High, Middle, and Low in describing the races of men of Middle Earth.
quote:Whiter skin was a sign of high blood in Europe for centuries. It meant that the person didn't work in the fields all day and thus, their skin didn't tan. It's not a Tolkien invention.
Of the fact that whiter skin in Gondor is a sign of high blood
quote:ONOZ!! In a book written in the midst of western civ's wars against Asian countries, like Japan, and later Korea, all while watching China be taken over by communists.
So, orcs are ugly because they are Asian. Like I said, we should be grateful that Tolkien isn't cancelled
quote:
we should be grateful that Tolkien isn't cancelled
frick you. You little punks don't have the power to cancel Tolkien. We don't need your little movie studios or electronic media to enjoy his work. They can make all the shitty adaptations they like. It won't change a thing.Posted on 8/26/22 at 9:35 am to GOP_Tiger
As I have said, if you simply must view everything through the prism of the Culture War, then getting any new Tolkien TV series is a victory for conservatives, because Tolkien is a conservative writer and this will create a new generation of Tolkien fans.
But that's just pathetic and sad.
Art is art, and you should be able to appreciate and enjoy it for it's own sake, without looking at everything in life to judge whether it's conservative or woke. I feel so sorry for those poor souls who can't buy anything without looking up the company's political donations.
It's a sickness that afflicts both the woke and the anti-woke: turning culture and politics into an all-consuming religion.
But that's just pathetic and sad.
Art is art, and you should be able to appreciate and enjoy it for it's own sake, without looking at everything in life to judge whether it's conservative or woke. I feel so sorry for those poor souls who can't buy anything without looking up the company's political donations.
It's a sickness that afflicts both the woke and the anti-woke: turning culture and politics into an all-consuming religion.
Posted on 8/26/22 at 9:38 am to blueboy
Thanks for basically proving all of my points.
Posted on 8/26/22 at 9:40 am to GOP_Tiger
quote:You should write Amazon and tell them, then. Maybe they'll stop doing it.
I feel so sorry for those poor souls who can't buy anything without looking up the company's political donations.
quote:See above.
if you simply must view everything through the prism of the Culture War
Posted on 8/26/22 at 9:45 am to Bronc
quote:
FYI, you dont own LOTR you hyperventilating manchild.
You act like you do, commie. Have you told your parents you’re a communist? I’m sure they’d be proud.
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