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re: What in the world is going down in Waco? (Update: Player found guilty of sexual assault)
Posted on 8/21/15 at 2:35 pm to BeYou
Posted on 8/21/15 at 2:35 pm to BeYou
quote:
WTF where they thinking allowing the accused rapist and victim to be in the same classes and tutoring sessions.
yea, looking past football, whoever made that decision needs to be let go.
I'm sorry, I get the whole innocent until proven guilty thing but it's ridiculous that they couldn't come up with a better solution than what boils down to "Well if you don't want to be in a class with him, you need to change yourself." (at least this is going by the Texas Monthly article)
This post was edited on 8/21/15 at 2:36 pm
1
Posted on 8/21/15 at 2:39 pm to Dr RC
quote:
yea, looking past football, whoever made that decision needs to be let go.
I'm sorry, I get the whole innocent until proven guilty thing but it's ridiculous that they couldn't come up with a better solution than what boils down to "Well if you don't want to be in a class with him, you need to change yourself." (at least this is going by the Texas Monthly article)
It is a difficult position for the school to be put in. They need to support the victim as best as possible (which Baylor failed to do) without showing favorites. If they let the victim do whatever they want (this of course being before a conviction) then you could end up with a situation like mattress girl at Columbia. Now Columbia faces a lawsuit from the accused rapist for taking mattress girls side and favoring her.
This post was edited on 8/21/15 at 2:41 pm
Posted on 8/21/15 at 2:40 pm to BeYou
quote:
I am of the strong belief no college should have an internal system to investigate sexual assault, and Baylor's ultimate deferral to the criminal justice system to handle the case feels exactly like the right move to make
I don't think a University can afford NOT to have one in this day and age of Title IX investigations. Actually Title IX may legally obligate them (or at least make it practically necessary) to have one. But, as a good double edged sword, heaven forbid the internal investigation turns up nothing and then the accused is found guilty. Almost as bad - when the internal investigation leads to removal of the accused and then the criminal justice system finds no wrongdoing.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 2:44 pm to OrangeBlood
I do know that if I played for Baylor, I would not be tweeting out what this player just did.
quote:
Johnny jefferson
@johnnyjeff05
If you not with us , you are against us ...
Posted on 8/21/15 at 2:44 pm to OrangeBlood
quote:
I don't think a University can afford NOT to have one in this day and age of Title IX investigations. Actually Title IX may legally obligate them (or at least make it practically necessary) to have one. But, as a good double edged sword, heaven forbid the internal investigation turns up nothing and then the accused is found guilty. Almost as bad - when the internal investigation leads to removal of the accused and then the criminal justice system finds no wrongdoing.
To my understanding, Title IX does require these investigations. I obviously don't agree with parts of Title IX.
In this situation, you have the Baylor internal investigation and the Waco PD investigation conclude that there was not enough evidence to pursue, but then the judicial system finds them guilty.
So where was the break down, obviously in the Baylor internal investigation. But you are asking a school to conduct an investigation without the power to subpoena. Nor can they compel witnesses to testify under oath (which was absolutely key in this case. His roommate lied to the Baylor investigator and then back tracked on the stand). It's like your asking a school to conduct a thorough investigation with its hand tied behind its back.
I'm not saying you can't have a thorough and effective investigation. But there is a reason you see so many school struggling with "internal investigations" of sexual assault - the most famous obviously being FSU.
This post was edited on 8/21/15 at 2:46 pm
Posted on 8/21/15 at 2:53 pm to BeYou
quote:
In this situation, you have the Baylor internal investigation and the Waco PD investigation conclude that there was not enough evidence to pursue, but then the judicial system finds them guilty.
This is all very simple......
Baylor knowingly brought a violent predator to its campus.
This predator rapes a student athlete and doesn't lose his scholarship.
The Baylor head coach is caught in a lie about not knowing the kid was a violent predator.
Briles, the AD & multiple university leaders will lose their jobs.
This post was edited on 8/21/15 at 2:54 pm
Posted on 8/21/15 at 2:55 pm to BeYou
quote:
In this situation, you have the Baylor internal investigation and the Waco PD investigation conclude that there was not enough evidence to pursue.
You know you're internal investigation is bad when the district judge MIL's it out of even being mentioned in the trial. Waco PD was probably still searching for bikers who now meet at Hooters on I35 instead of Twin Peaks.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 2:59 pm to OrangeBlood
quote:
the district judge MIL's it out of even being mentioned in the trial
This isn't that uncommon. It's quite standard actually. They're allowed to further outside investigations but not allowed as evidence. The statements gathered, methodology, etc. aren't to the same standards and practices so they generally are not allowed anywhere near a court room.
EDIT: School dropped the ball on this one. Hopefully something good comes out of this with respects to how things like this can be approached in the future.
This post was edited on 8/21/15 at 3:03 pm
Posted on 8/21/15 at 2:59 pm to Spindicus Lofrus
quote:
This is all very simple......
If only it was.
quote:
Baylor knowingly brought a violent predator to its campus.
This has been debated. I expect Baylor to clarify the communication it had with Petersen this afternoon. It is still not clear what Petersen told Briles other than the "disciplinary actions" that lead to SU removal of the BSU team.
quote:
This predator rapes a student athlete and doesn't lose his scholarship.
He remained on scholarship but didn't practice or play at all. I think the question should be raised, how much punishment should a accuser face until the conclusion of their trial. Should they be completely removed from campus all together, should they be off scholarship, or should they just not be allowed to interact with the football team.
quote:
The Baylor head coach is caught in a lie about not knowing the kid was a violent predator.
See above.
quote:
Briles, the AD & multiple university leaders will lose their jobs
If it all comes out they way you stated, then yes. Briles and McCraw (the Associate Dean that investigated the incident) should lose their jobs. Not sure who else.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 3:03 pm to BaylorTiger
quote:
This isn't that uncommon. It's quite standard actually
I thought it was uncommon to not even allow mention of the fact that an internal investigation had been performed. Which I believe is what happened here.
(This is not my area of law - but I found that surprising. Maybe this is just how it is).
Posted on 8/21/15 at 3:04 pm to Spindicus Lofrus
quote:
Briles, AD, & leaders will lose their jobs
I think this is wishful thinking on your part; Baylor will conduct some sort of in house investigation, determine there were things they could have done better, adopt the same rule the SEC did regarding transfers and sexual predation, pay the victim a mill, do a mea culpa with a promise to install new and improved policies, and then be done with it.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 3:16 pm to Ldrake53
Horn and Aggie fans would love to see Briles fired and Baylor football collapse. Both would probably then be trying to hire him when they can their current coaches who aren't getting it done.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 3:22 pm to double d
Lol
Posted on 8/21/15 at 3:23 pm to Ldrake53
quote:
pay the victim a mill,
You may need to add a zero before this thing is over.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 3:24 pm to double d
quote:
Horn and Aggie fans would love to see Briles fired and Baylor football collapse. Both would probably then be trying to hire him when they can their current coaches who aren't getting it done.
You'll start to see Baylor fans do the same thing if it comes out that he knew SU was had a violent past towards women.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 3:28 pm to double d
quote:
Horn and Aggie fans would love to see Briles fired and Baylor football collapse. Both would probably then be trying to hire him when they can their current coaches who aren't getting it done.
No, just no. Briles is a dick and always has been. Take off your Green and Gold glasses put down the green kool-aid in the gold cup and really look at what he did. I can't fault the school for keeping SU there, innocent until proven guilty, but if it's true that Briles knew about his past then this is inexcusable, period.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 3:40 pm to BeYou
quote:Seriously doubt it. Winning is like a cool, addictive drug. You guys are getting all you can handle right now and are on the cusp of getting more. There is no way the powers that be let all of that go away. Trust me, it has conquered greater men of high morals.
You'll start to see Baylor fans do the same thing if it comes out that he knew SU was had a violent past towards women.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 3:43 pm to Agforlife
More than likely it'll never be proven that he knew all unless Peterson taped the conversation or sent a letter detailing the issues. It's going to be one's word against the other without it. Briles may well have known but I doubt he'd admit it unless there is documentation. Let's face it, how many people would admit it if they know there's no way to prove them wrong.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 3:47 pm to Agforlife
Yeah those conflicting statement are not good. I'm not going to rush to say Briles lied though. Petersen certainly could be the one lying as well. He has absolutely nothing to lose talking about what he did at a previous job.
Regardless, if Briles is lying then jesus christ. shite is hitting the fan. Do whatever we have and get the people responsible out.
Regardless, if Briles is lying then jesus christ. shite is hitting the fan. Do whatever we have and get the people responsible out.
Posted on 8/21/15 at 3:50 pm to McCaigBro69
Agreed.
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