re: Rumors about Peyton Manning

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Schaub's a top 10 QB

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Brees, Brady, Rodgers, Manning, Manning, Romo, Rivers, Roethlisberger, Vick, Ryan, Newton, Stafford. All those guys are better than him, which means he isn't top 10. Flacco has a much stronger arm and could be better as well.

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Win what? They didn't win anything until Manning got hurt.

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You really are a Colts homer for this one, if you don't think that the Texans still win the division this year with Manning playing your a damn fool. There was a whole lot more wrong with the colts than just QB.

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I just know that when you compare Schaub to the QBs that have won SBs over the last decade, he doesn't measure up.

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So Schaub isn't any better than Dilfer, Brad Johnson or Rothlisberger?

Best season for Rothlisberger 2009- 66% 4,328 26 Td's 12 INTS

Schaub 2009 - 68% 4,770 29 Td's 15 INTS

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the running game gets stopped and they can't do the playaction to AJ or wideopen TE

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Any team based on the run and play-action off of it is going to have problems, no?

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Brees, Brady, Rodgers, Manning, Manning, Romo, Rivers, Roethlisberger, Vick, Ryan, Newton, Stafford. All those guys are better than him, which means he isn't top 10. Flacco has a much stronger arm and could be better as well.

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One Manning didn't play and may never be the same again.

You say Schaub plays bad in the 4th Q and put Romo ahead of him

Newton is a rookie, love his upside, but he's not top 10 yet and Vick?

Raodgers, Brees, Bardy and the old Peyton are clearly ahead.

Eli, Rivers and Roethlisberger in next group.

Schaub is in with next group of guys like Romo, Stafford, Ryan. Sounds like just bias if you think he's worse than those guys.

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I guess it could be argued that bc Kubiak's system is so good, they don't need a superstar QB. Especially now that Pittsburgh is getting old on defense, and maybe Baltimore as well.

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Right, AFC is wide open, no reason they can't get homefield.

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I just know that when you compare Schaub to the QBs that have won SBs over the last decade, he doesn't measure up.

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Stupid, arbitrary standard and its circular logic. Schaub is much better than at least 2 QB's that won SB in the 2000's and others than have won in the past.

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You really are a Colts homer for this one, if you don't think that the Texans still win the division this year with Manning playing your a damn fool. There was a whole lot more wrong with the colts than just QB.

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There has always been a whole lot wrong with the Colts. Last year they won the division when they actually had a lot more injuries. They had freakin Blair White and Jacob Tamme in the starting lineup.

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So Schaub isn't any better than Dilfer, Brad Johnson or Rothlisberger?

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Brad Johnson would be the only one, though he was underrated and won everywhere he played. Dilfer was last decade. Big Ben is way more of a playmaker than Schaub.

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Any team based on the run and play-action off of it is going to have problems, no?

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Not if they have a top 10 QB.

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You say Schaub plays bad in the 4th Q and put Romo ahead of him

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Eh, Romo is really, really good. He may be the non-elite QB in the league (Rodgers, Brady, Brees, and Peyton - if it is fair to include him).

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Rodgers, Brees, Bardy and the old Peyton are clearly ahead.

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No question, tier 1.

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Eli, Rivers and Roethlisberger in next group.

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I include Romo in this group 2. Rivers used to lead tier 2, but his season hurt his stock a little bit.

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Schaub is in with next group of guys like Romo, Stafford, Ryan

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Definitely. I would throw Cam, Cutler, and maybe Vick in there as well.

Schaub may not be a lock to be top 10, but he is least in the running, and he is anywhere between 9-14 IMO. I would probably stick him ninth or tenth.

The Texans can obviously win with Schaub under center. Best combo of offense and defense in the league.

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They could get and even win the SB with Schaub. Hurt or not Manning will not be playing for Indy and his absence had not impact on the Texans D.

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Of course they could. They'd just have a better chance with a top 10 QB.

But if New England actually starts to wisely use all of their draft picks and cap room, they'll have a hard time beating them just because the difference at QB is so large.

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They won a playoff game with a rookie at QB, Schuab is significantly better than Yates.

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Never said they weren't a good team. Even though their secondary is still shaky, I love watching their front 7 play, as those dudes fly around.

But with that said, the past is the past. If you don't get better as a team each offseason, there is a good chance that you will fall behind.

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I don't think you even know what a system QB is.

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I think I explained it pretty well. A guy who struggles in must-pass situations.

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False. In 2010 he lead 4th Q comebacks agasint the Jets and Ravens, now against the Ravens he threw a pick in OT that lost the game, but they would not have been in OT if not for his play and would have won in regulation if not for shitty special teams. The Jets game was lost by the D. This year he had a good 4Q vs the Saints, but Brees was better.

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Rare occasions. They lost to the Saints because they had to settle for a bunch of field goals, which is another characteristic of a system QB. The windows are tighter on the redzone, as you won't see AJ with 10 yards of separation there like he has a lot on a long field.

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More because outside of Johnson the WR are not good. If he's healthy and they upgrade, will be harder to stop them. The offense has been to5 in the league for a couple of years.

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Top QBs make their WRs better. He doesn't bc he does not make the great stick throws bc he lacks the arm strength.

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They could upgrade there too, but the D was top 5, so I don't see where that is a problem.

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It was a problem against the Ravens and Saints. They need to upgrade there.

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Is Schaub an elite QB? No, but that doesn't mean he can't win. Most of what you say about him was said about Elie before he won.

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Exactly what I'm saying. Not saying he sucks, just that he isn't a top 10 QB, and a healthy Peyton would be a huge upgrade.

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they'll have a hard time beating them just because the difference at QB is so large.

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This is so stupid, games and playoff games are not won by matching up QBs and tallying points. Brady would play against the Texans D and Schaub against the Pats D. Watch the AFC CG, Brady did not play that well against the Ravens D. Flacco made the throw and Lee Evens dropped it.

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But with that said, the past is the past. If you don't get better as a team each offseason, there is a good chance that you will fall behind.

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What does this have to do with anything in this thread? Last year the Texans made great improvements, this offseasons hasn't even started yet.

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A guy who struggles in must-pass situations.

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That's not a system QB and I got news for ya, all QB's struggle at times, especially in must pass situations.

No one is saying Schaub is an elite top level QB, just that he's good enough to win with. He's good enough that you don't take the risk on Manning given the questions about his health.

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Rare occasions. They lost to the Saints because they had to settle for a bunch of field goals, which is another characteristic of a system QB. The windows are tighter on the redzone, as you won't see AJ with 10 yards of separation there like he has a lot on a long field.

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I see, things that refute your claim are "rare occassions" but things that confirm your view are not. There's a term for that, its called Confirmation Bias.

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Schaub may not be a lock to be top 10, but he is least in the running, and he is anywhere between 9-14 IMO. I would probably stick him ninth or tenth.

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That's fair. The difference between most of these guys outside the top group (Rodgers, Brees, Brady) is marginal. Outside of those 3, the only ones I think would be upgrades over Schaub would be Rivers, Roth and Eli and maybe Stafford.

Romo, Ryan, Cutler are a wash imo. I would not take Vick over Schaub. Newton looks really good, but too early imo and he turned it over a lot. May wind up better, but right now, I'd rather have a vet.

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Few and far between

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right, I forgot, only things that go along with what you are saying is rare, my bad.

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The dude had trouble beating David Garrard when he was with the Jags, as well as the Titans before this year. Struggling in the division is another example of a non-clutch QB.

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Or its an example of a QB on a team that's not that great, but yeah, it was Matt Schaub's fault that Jaxville hit a hailmary. It was also his fault against Tenn in 2009 that Brown missed a FG at the end that would have tied the game, as well as the other 2 or 3 kicks miised that would have won or sent games into OT that year. And it was rare when the beat the crap out of Indy week 1 last year.

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You don't notice the fact that Stafford, Newton, Vick, etc have way stronger arms than Schaub and Ryan???

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Yes, do you notice that we are not having a QB's skills contest? Booby Hebert had a strong arm than Joe Montana. A QB doesn't have to have the strongest arm, as long as his arm is strong enough an Schaub's arm is srong enough to make the throws he needs to make.

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The fact that you are missing my point there tells me that you are the one clouded in your judgement.

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Your definition of system QB is one you made up. Your point that he doesn't have as strong an arm as other is not relevant as long as his arm is strong enough, which it is.

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your bias as a Texans fan is showing.

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My biggest bias is against stupidity an illogic and giving the QB all the creidit/blame for team accomplishments fits both.

Of course I would take Aaron Rodgers, Drew Brees, Tom Bardy etc over Schaub, but that's not how the real world works. The only reason P Manning is available is because there are serious questions about his ability to even play, if there weren't questions about his healthy, he would want more money than the Texans could afford under the cap. Its just not worth the risk for a team this close.

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Your definition of system QB is one you made up. Your point that he doesn't have as strong an arm as other is not relevant as long as his arm is strong enough, which it is.

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Nope, I'm just listing multiple characteristics that make up system QBs. The same reason Matt Ryan struggles against the Saints, he settles for field goals while Brees scores touchdown. He struggles completing passes downfield.

It's strong enough when the system is giving him open receivers. It's not strong enough on 3rd and long, when Schaub (or Ryan) often dumps it short of the first down because he can't make the elite throws like QBs with stronger arms can. Another characteristic of a system QB.

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The only reason P Manning is available is because there are serious questions about his ability to even play, if there weren't questions about his healthy, he would want more money than the Texans could afford under the cap. Its just not worth the risk for a team this close.

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I would agree that they shouldn't sign Manning unless he is throwing with arm strength close to where he was before. I'm just saying that it isn't like QB isn't a position that couldn't be upgraded.