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re: Rate these sports professions based on athleticism; your opinion.

Posted on 6/21/15 at 11:30 pm to
Posted by RandySavage
9 Time Natty Winner
Member since May 2012
34870 posts
Posted on 6/21/15 at 11:30 pm to
quote:

I understand what you are saying. My argument would be, being a decathlete means you are at least above average in EVERYTHING that defines being an athlete. Therefore the skills are there for them to be competent at any sport, with some practice.


quote:

My bet is that Eaton would be far better than Westbrook at baseball and far better than trout at basketball.



Individually it's impossible to say but if you just took the overall best decathletes and the overall most athletic team sports stars I would disagree. For elite athletes it's much easier, imo, to practice and improve in closed sport skills rather than open ones.
This post was edited on 6/21/15 at 11:31 pm
Posted by Open Your Eyes
Member since Nov 2012
10376 posts
Posted on 6/21/15 at 11:30 pm to
quote:

Well to be fair, Eaton doesn't run 10.2 and 45 consistently, those are his PRs.


He's run both of those times on multiple occasions, in multiple years. And without ever training specifically for either event.

quote:

But if Russell dropped pounds, I don't see why not. His explosiveness is amazing, and I would guess that his top end speed isn't bad either.


But I'd bet he's s ability to maintain that top end speed for an extra 70 meters further than he currently does is severely lacking. Like I said to someone else, remember Chris Rainey on a football field? Go look at his track numbers.

quote:

I bet if Russell was a lifelong track/decathlete he would be putting up elite (maybe world class) results. Peaking/tapering and training can make athletes do amazing things in that sport.


I could buy that in possibly 4 or 5 of the events. We have no idea about his ability to pole vault, do any of the throws, or run 1500.
Posted by Plankton
Member since Jun 2015
1455 posts
Posted on 6/21/15 at 11:31 pm to
quote:

a decathlon is outdated in terms of gauging athleticism


Posted by VaBamaMan
North AL
Member since Apr 2013
8062 posts
Posted on 6/21/15 at 11:32 pm to
quote:

NASCAR...not a real sport...try again


Have you ever driven a stock car?

It is absolutely physically exhausting over the length of a 500 mile race. While it may not be a a true sport. It is certainly something that requires physical stamina, hand eye coordination, muscle control....etc.
Posted by Open Your Eyes
Member since Nov 2012
10376 posts
Posted on 6/21/15 at 11:41 pm to
quote:

Hmmm... I'm not so sure of that. I'm not familiar with other decathletes' stats, but Eaton (obviously an outlier) doesn't fall into that category. He's still a world class long jumper while training for the decathlete, and if he were to train for say the 400m or 110 hurdles exclusively he could very well be competitive in those events at the olympics.


Well you did leave out the "with a few exceptions" part.

But he doesn't fall into the world class long jumper category. The IAAF standard for men's long jump is 8.10 meters. Eaton has jumped that far only twice in his career, and not since 2012. Great decathlete long jumper? Yes. Good long jumper compared to the pitiful state of America in the event currently? Sadly yes. But not world class.

Now of course he'll prove badly jump something ridiculous at trials next week.

quote:

and if he were to train for say the 400m or 110 hurdles exclusively he could very well be competitive in those events at the olympics.


We'll probably never know for sure, but he's still so far away from being in that class even in those events that I highly doubt it.
Posted by Lester Earl
3rd Ward
Member since Nov 2003
288562 posts
Posted on 6/21/15 at 11:42 pm to
It mostly measures strength and endurance, but leaves out coordination for the most part, which is integral for any team sport involving a ball.

Other events are repetitive and some even irrelevant
Posted by Plankton
Member since Jun 2015
1455 posts
Posted on 6/21/15 at 11:42 pm to
quote:

He's run both of those times on multiple occasions, in multiple years

In different years, while he's tapering for that season's big meet. He doesn't hit those consistently during a single season though.

quote:

But I'd bet he's s ability to maintain that top end speed for an extra 70 meters further than he currently does is severely lacking. Like I said to someone else, remember Chris Rainey on a football field? Go look at his track numbers.


Given Russell's height advantage, it's safe to assume he could hold top end speed much better than the 5'9 Rainey. But absolutely, Rainey's 6.70 60m time doesn't translate well to the 100m, at 10.60.
Posted by Open Your Eyes
Member since Nov 2012
10376 posts
Posted on 6/21/15 at 11:46 pm to
quote:

There's absolutely no way to even guess who would be better without knowing about their past sport playing history, especially with the skill sets needed for each sport.


Which is why I said to assume for the purposes of that argument that none of them have any experience in anything other than the sport they currently play. So you're assuming Westbrook only possesses the skills that make him good at basketball and trout at baseball.
Posted by Open Your Eyes
Member since Nov 2012
10376 posts
Posted on 6/21/15 at 11:49 pm to
quote:

It mostly measures strength and endurance, but leaves out coordination for the most part, which is integral for any team sport involving a ball.


Proper sprint mechanics in and of themselves require tremendous coordination.

Additionally, hurdles, high jump, pole vault, discus and javelin are all heavily dependent on coordination.
Posted by Plankton
Member since Jun 2015
1455 posts
Posted on 6/21/15 at 11:51 pm to
quote:

But he doesn't fall into the world class long jumper category.

Meh, his 8.03m jump at the olympics would've put him in Long Jump finals and had him finishing 6th overall. That's world class, imo.

quote:

Good long jumper compared to the pitiful state of America in the event currently?

The US is actually the best in the world at that event right now. Marquise Goodwin did choke in 2012 though.
Posted by Lester Earl
3rd Ward
Member since Nov 2003
288562 posts
Posted on 6/22/15 at 12:03 am to
Everything involves coordination to some extent. For those events, it's not very technical compared to what is needed in say, basketball , football, or baseball.

Ok, you can throw a javelin. But can you throw it on the run, across your body, 40 yards with accuracy?

Ok, you can run 100m fast, but can you turn your back in a full sprint and track down a ball? Or weave in and out of defenders in an open court and finish at the rim?

You think the long jump & pole vault require timing, but can you perfect the footwork, arm strength, and hand/eye a 2B needs to turn a double play? Or a WR's route in perfect sync with a QB, getting by a great CB and receiving a ball with a MLB bearing down on you?


Those track events require athleticism but just at its basic measure.
Posted by Open Your Eyes
Member since Nov 2012
10376 posts
Posted on 6/22/15 at 12:04 am to
quote:

Meh, his 8.03m jump at the olympics would've put him in Long Jump finals and had him finishing 6th overall. That's world class, imo.


Meh. Different competition, different conditions. Decathlon long jump had mostly tailwinds. Qualifying and final in the open long jump were mostly into headwinds.

The fact that he usually doesn't even get the standard that would be required for him to compete in the open event at the Olympics precludes him from being world class to me.

quote:

The US is actually the best in the world at that event right now. Marquise Goodwin did choke in 2012 though.


I'm curious as to how you came to that conclusion. The last 2 major championships, a triple jumper has been the best American in the event, and he hadn't won either time.
This post was edited on 6/22/15 at 12:08 am
Posted by Open Your Eyes
Member since Nov 2012
10376 posts
Posted on 6/22/15 at 12:16 am to
quote:

Ok, you can throw a javelin. But can you throw it on the run, across your body, 40 yards with accuracy?


Well for starters, javelin throwers are already on the run. Secondly, they have to throw it 80+ meters, while maintains control of their body, within the sector. And if their release is even slightly off, for any number of reasons, the javelin nose dives, or goes to high, or comes out shaking and doesn't fly as far. The ducks Peyton manning throws on a routine basis would spell failure for a javelin thrower.

quote:

Ok, you can run 100m fast, but can you turn your back in a full sprint and track down a ball? Or weave in and out of defenders in an open court and finish at the rim?


How many NFL or nba players can clear 10 42" hurdles in 110 meters, with other people in the same race on either side of them, while maintaining enough sPeed to cover that distance in 13 seconds?

quote:

You think the long jump & pole vault require timing, but can you perfect the footwork, arm strength, and hand/eye a 2B needs to turn a double play? Or a WR's route in perfect sync with a QB, getting by a great CB and receiving a ball with a MLB bearing down on you?


If you can simplify long jump and pole vault down to just timing, I can simplify your above examples to catching and throwing a ball. See how that works?

quote:

Those track events require athleticism but just at its basic measure.


Only because you don't understand them.
This post was edited on 6/22/15 at 12:22 am
Posted by Plankton
Member since Jun 2015
1455 posts
Posted on 6/22/15 at 12:21 am to
quote:

Decathlon long jump had mostly tailwinds. Qualifying and final in the open long jump were mostly into headwinds.


Meh. His jump of 8.03m (+0.8) would've placed him 5th after qualifying rounds, ahead of a Russian 8.02m (+0.9)

quote:

I'm curious as to how you came to that conclusion.

Dendy, Jarrion Lawson, and Goodwin are all top 5 in the world right now, each above 8.30m.
But yes, 2013 Worlds was difficult. 2012 would've had 2 medalists if Goodwin didn't choke in finals.
Posted by c on z
Zamunda
Member since Mar 2009
130449 posts
Posted on 6/22/15 at 12:29 am to
Basketball
Football
Soccer
Baseball
Posted by Open Your Eyes
Member since Nov 2012
10376 posts
Posted on 6/22/15 at 12:29 am to
Dendy and Lawson just came off of peaking for the NCAA championships. The pros won't be doing that until their national trials at least, maybe not even until August for worlds. You don't think collegiate men and women are each 3 of the top 5 200 meter runners in the world do you?

And where are you seeing that on Goodwin? I haven't seen a jump from him since 2012.
This post was edited on 6/22/15 at 12:31 am
Posted by Plankton
Member since Jun 2015
1455 posts
Posted on 6/22/15 at 12:41 am to
quote:

The pros won't be doing that until their national trials at least, maybe not even until August for worlds.

Not many pros will be hitting ~8.35m in August anyway.

quote:

And where are you seeing that on Goodwin?

My bad, wrong person. It's a Henderson, not Goodwin.

quote:

You don't think collegiate men and women are each 3 of the top 5 200 meter runners in the world do you?


For men they currently are. Do I think they'll finish top 5 at Worlds? Not a chance. It wouldn't suprise me to see at least one out of Dukes, Bromell, and even the juiced up (I'm convinced) De Grasse in the finals though. But sprints are a whole different animal compared to jumps when it comes to collegiates going from NCAAs, to US Champs, to Worlds in the same year.
Posted by molsusports
Member since Jul 2004
37140 posts
Posted on 6/22/15 at 1:30 am to
1) basketball
2) football
3) hockey
4) tennis
5) baseball
6) golf
7) nascar
Posted by ManBearTiger
BRLA
Member since Jun 2007
22316 posts
Posted on 6/22/15 at 7:20 am to
The fact that baseball is in your top five discredits the whole OP.
This post was edited on 6/22/15 at 7:21 am
Posted by 21JumpStreet
Member since Jul 2012
14855 posts
Posted on 6/22/15 at 7:22 am to
1 football
2 basketball
3 tennis
4baseball
5 golf
6 nascar
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