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re: Questions: Who was better, Hakeem or Shaq?

Posted on 12/18/11 at 10:34 am to
Posted by THRILLHO
Metry, LA
Member since Apr 2006
50157 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 10:34 am to
Shaq in his prime may have been the best player I've ever watched play in any sport. Pisses me off that he didn't have more drive to excel to be great. Obviously he got fat, but I would have loved to see him put effort into diversifying his offensive game, working on his FTs, developing a better skyhook, maybe getting a jumpshot going. Still, you literally couldn't stop him. In his prime, he would demolish any other center ever. I know Wilt had better numbers, and it's not fair to compare people in different eras, but Shaq would manhandle him.
Posted by Cdawg
TigerFred's Living Room
Member since Sep 2003
61449 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 10:48 am to
Dream
Posted by DP40
Swamps and creeks
Member since Nov 2008
9907 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 10:52 am to
quote:

I wonder how much of this factored into the creation of this thread


The link didn't, but I did read it and was floored by the two stats that favored Hakeem over Shaq. Those are shocking stats and I would have bet against those being true.

A guy and I at work were just talking about who was better among different players in football, then turned to basketball. Then we asked other people what they thought and it seemed about a 50-50 split, so I brought the topic here.

Edit: The majority who favored Shaq at work said "by alot"...it seems most who say Shaq thinks it's not that close.
This post was edited on 12/18/11 at 10:58 am
Posted by tubucoco
las vegas, nevada
Member since Oct 2007
32994 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 11:09 am to
Hakeem had more natural ability than Shaq ever had, and what I mean by natural abilty is skill to score almost at will, he even was a better shot blocker then Shaq. Hakeem anticipated shots by others rose off his feet extremely fast blocking them easily. His "Dream Shake" was a thing of beauty how he would spin on people so quick for such a big guy and drop shots in with the deftess of touch for a big man.

Shaq was totally different, a straight power guy, nobody matched his power, he went over people, through people, didn't matter because he knew they could not stop him. His shot blocking when he was young was also great, but he did not leave his feet as fast as Olajuwon. and I think we all know about his shooting ability, which is why I give the edge to Hakeem.
Posted by shifty94
San Antonio, TX
Member since Oct 2010
2867 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 11:10 am to
Hakeem "The Dream" Olajuwon
Posted by dukke v
PLUTO
Member since Jul 2006
215992 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 11:13 am to
quote:

I meant to say that Shaq was the best center in NBA history in his prime.



NO. Wilt was.
Posted by prplhze2000
Parts Unknown
Member since Jan 2007
56696 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 11:17 am to
quote:

Shaq was totally different, a straight power guy, nobody matched his power, he went over people, through people, didn't matter because he knew they could not stop him.


Thats why I am intrigued by a Moses Malone matchup. he loved to play a power game and would've enjoyed that matchup. Also intrigued by Lambeer. Totally different game and one I'm not sure Shaq could've defended.
Posted by Pistol...2K4
25 foot assassin
Member since Jun 2004
6918 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 11:52 am to
quote:

The link didn't, but I did read it and was floored by the two stats that favored Hakeem over Shaq. Those are shocking stats and I would have bet against those being true.


It's a good read for certain....also FWIW one of the first times in a while that PJ and I have agreed on something
Posted by dukke v
PLUTO
Member since Jul 2006
215992 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 12:02 pm to
quote:

also FWIW one of the first times in a while that PJ and I have agreed on something




Posted by Pistol...2K4
25 foot assassin
Member since Jun 2004
6918 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 12:55 pm to
quote:

dukke v


Posted by Zamoro10
Member since Jul 2008
14743 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 1:09 pm to
Shaq was strange - so dominant physically...yes...he is the best in that department...

But not dominant overall (as you would expect him to be because of his size.) He didn't put teams on his shoulders in spite of his points.

Russell, Kareem, Hakeem, Walton, Ewing...so many big men dominated at all levels anchoring or carrying their teams to the NCAA championship game. It's sort of glaring that Shaq couldn't dominate the college game with championships...I mean, Carmelo Anthony carried his team to the title as a freshman...that sort of defines Shaq (as dominant physically as he was)...he could disappear and never took over the game as someone his size would suggest...ala the Wilt syndrome. Shaq wasn't a winner to some degree ala Hakeem carrying those Rockets. Lakers won before and after Shaq.
This post was edited on 12/18/11 at 1:12 pm
Posted by bomber77
Member since Aug 2008
14783 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 7:29 pm to
You keep bringing up the Jabbar name change. He left UCLA in 69 and changed his name in 71.
Posted by RedHawk
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2007
9515 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 8:35 pm to
Who would you want to take the final shot? Give me Hakeem everyday of the week and twice on Sundays. Hakeem had a fadeaway jumper that he could go to whenever he wanted.
Posted by OBUDan
Chicago
Member since Aug 2006
40723 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 8:44 pm to
quote:


Shaq was totally different, a straight power guy, nobody matched his power, he went over people, through people, didn't matter because he knew they could not stop him.


I think this is one of the leading myths on Shaq. Obviously power was an exceptional part of his game, but Shaq was unbelievably quick for a man his size. He was a lot quicker than many guys smaller than him.
Posted by Hubbhogg
Our AD Sucks
Member since Dec 2010
13539 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 8:46 pm to
quote:

Who was better, Hakeem or Shaq?


They are two totally different type centers. Both are top 5 though IMO
Posted by OBUDan
Chicago
Member since Aug 2006
40723 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 8:50 pm to
quote:

Edit: The majority who favored Shaq at work said "by alot"...it seems most who say Shaq thinks it's not that close.



No one should go one way or the other "by a lot" IMO.

Shaq had 3 season with a PER at 29.5 or higher.

The Dream didn't have one.

Obviously that's not a be all, end all. But a decent starting point for arguing Shaq >.
Posted by OBUDan
Chicago
Member since Aug 2006
40723 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 8:53 pm to
quote:


too many people make the incorrect assumption he just used his size. shaq had an INCREDIBLY refined post game. when he was on the lakers under phil, his passing improved greatly, also.


Exactly, people always talk about Shaq as if he was just some grunt that would back down defenders, turn around and dunk.

His game was vastly more refined than that.

Shaq didn't have a jump shot, but his post moves were pretty unbelievable, and his ability to pass out of the double team increased as his career progressed.
Posted by OBUDan
Chicago
Member since Aug 2006
40723 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 8:56 pm to
quote:

Both qualities are assets. Who cares how you do it, its about putting the ball in the hoop. If Shaq can put the ball in the hoop more due to his power, than so be it. Why is it used against him when Hakeem's skills are being praised?


So true, it's like they believe, "Well theoretically someone with enough power could make Shaq one dimensional."

The world is still waiting for that person.
Posted by OBUDan
Chicago
Member since Aug 2006
40723 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 8:59 pm to
quote:

"If I had to pick a center, I would take Olajuwon. That leaves out Shaq, Patrick Ewing. It leaves out Wilt Chamberlain. It leaves out a lot of people. And the reason I would take Olajuwon is very simple: he is so versatile because of what he can give you from that position. It's not just his scoring, not just his rebounding or not just his blocked shots. People don't realize he was in the top seven in steals. He always made great decisions on the court. For all facets of the game, I have to give it to him."
-Michael Jordan


I'd also take into consideration that Hakeem wasn't exactly a guy who "demanded" the ball, whereas Shaq was. I think MJ would prefer to play with someone who would defer to him rather than a guy who would tell him to give him the fricking ball... a lot.
Posted by OBUDan
Chicago
Member since Aug 2006
40723 posts
Posted on 12/18/11 at 9:14 pm to
quote:

One player had over 1000 more blocked shots


Somewhat misleading.

Dream played 2,304 more minutes than Shaq in his career.

He did average 3.1 blocks per 36 minutes (to Shaq's 2.3), though.

So he would have had more blocks, but not 1,000 more.

Also, I'm guessing Dream played against a lot more offensive centers than Shaq, so probably had a lot more shot attempts taken against him. But I'm not sure how you'd look up that info.
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