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re: Is Jim Harden overrated?

Posted on 3/15/22 at 1:08 pm to
Posted by shel311
McKinney, Texas
Member since Aug 2004
112624 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 1:08 pm to
quote:

TS is down leaguewide, harden is one of the least affected players.

Harden has his lowest TS% since his rookie year this season
Posted by Boomshockalocka
Member since Feb 2004
59874 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 1:08 pm to
Big man is hard to officiate it is hard to say.
Posted by Boomshockalocka
Member since Feb 2004
59874 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 1:10 pm to
Still better than Luka CP morant booker etc etc. even in a down season he is more efficient than perennial all stars.
Posted by ReauxlTide222
St. Petersburg
Member since Nov 2010
88761 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 1:28 pm to
So what do you think about their TS% if its hard to judge whether or not to even let them attempt shots that help with their %?
Posted by Boomshockalocka
Member since Feb 2004
59874 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 1:30 pm to
All evens out for the most part /
Part of the game

calls go for and against every team every night. Refs ain’t perfect, neither are players.
Posted by ReauxlTide222
St. Petersburg
Member since Nov 2010
88761 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 1:35 pm to
quote:

All evens out for the most part
For guys like Shaq and Lebron I do not think it evens out
quote:

calls go for and against every team every night. Refs ain’t perfect
Which is a fantastic reason to take TS% with a big grain of salt
This post was edited on 3/15/22 at 1:36 pm
Posted by Boomshockalocka
Member since Feb 2004
59874 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 1:37 pm to
Lebrons TEAM OFFENSE, the one he dominates the ball on, has not been a higher ranked offense than hardens team Offense since bronco was in Miami.
Posted by ReauxlTide222
St. Petersburg
Member since Nov 2010
88761 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 1:40 pm to
Irrelevant
Posted by Boomshockalocka
Member since Feb 2004
59874 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 1:44 pm to
Oh it means everything. true shooting is a predictor of offensive Effiiciency and winning.
Posted by damn_baw69
Member since Mar 2021
103 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 2:00 pm to
Underrated on the Rockets, overrated since.
Posted by justice
Member since Feb 2006
55383 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 2:20 pm to
quote:

Has probably never lost a series when he had the better team. Did you ever look at Cp and Russ HOU playoff stats?
lol
Posted by Boomshockalocka
Member since Feb 2004
59874 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 2:28 pm to
Recurring theme to his playoff losses have been. Harden best player on the court, opponent has next two best players, hardens running mate nowhere to be found.

Bball ref game score:

V lakers

Harden 23.4
lebron 22.9
Davis 21.9
Russ 12.3

Two series v GSW:

Harden 21.4
KD 21.3
Steph 17.1
Paul 14.2

As you can see his help didn’t provide much help. When cle beat the warriors Kyrie posted a 19 game score as help to lebron. If harden gets anything close to a 19 in any of those series his team wins, but his teammates shite the bed. Numbers back the eye test in all of these series.
Posted by Madking
Member since Apr 2016
66290 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 2:52 pm to
He’s 36th all time in playoff ppg, just ahead of Carmelo Anthony. He’s 46th in playoff assist per game, 3 spots below Draymond Green, 17 spots below Derrick Rose.
This post was edited on 3/15/22 at 3:00 pm
Posted by Boomshockalocka
Member since Feb 2004
59874 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 2:59 pm to
Playoff bpm 13
Playoff PER 21
Playoff ws48 24

All Ahead of guys like Kobe, Wade and countless other hall of famers.
This post was edited on 3/15/22 at 3:02 pm
Posted by RebelTheBear
Saban's spare bedroom
Member since Aug 2016
5963 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 2:59 pm to
TS% is skewed towards good free throw shooters, especially high volume free throw shooters. Fact is James’ FG% is 41.6% and his 3P% is 34.1%, neither of which are very good marks.
Posted by Boomshockalocka
Member since Feb 2004
59874 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 3:05 pm to
TS Is better metric to use than fg%. Fg% is archaic. Like using batting average in baseball. We have much better commonly Used and accepted metrics to more accurately rate impact.
Posted by Madking
Member since Apr 2016
66290 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 3:05 pm to
6 spots below Tracy McGrady in BPM

8 spots below McGrady in PER, 13 below Giannis, 10 below Charles Barkley

WS per 48, which is a skewed stat he’s 24th, 8 spots below Chris Paul, he’s below Chauncey Billups, 19 spots below The Joker.
Posted by whatiknowsofar
hm?
Member since Nov 2010
25868 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 3:09 pm to
Zach Lowe has already proved my point.

quote:

Media is sometimes guilty of fixating on bad moments and forgetting the good ones. I did a deep dive, I watched all of Hardens fg attempts in the 4th quarter of his postseason. His numbers, in crunchtime, in big games, in elimination games, in 2-2 games, are bad. The criticism isn't unfair, it isn't cherrypicking"

"Most of his best playoff games are when his team is up 3-0, down 3-0, up 3-1, down 3-1. A lot of his crunchtime baskets are like, 'oh GS is up 8, they'll concede a layup so it isn't a 3' and Harden inflates his fg% from 0 to something better than zero with a conceded layup."

"His postseason is justifiably defined by meltdowns, 3 2/11 games! The criticism of his postseason performance is not cherry picking, it has been below his standard moreso than it has for almost any other superstar in recent NBA history"
Posted by Boomshockalocka
Member since Feb 2004
59874 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 3:09 pm to
Ok??

He is in the top 25 at all 3
Of the big 3 metrics. When all 3 agree you have your answer. One stat on its own doesn’t make a great argument, but when you get all of them saying the same thing, you have your answer.
Posted by RebelTheBear
Saban's spare bedroom
Member since Aug 2016
5963 posts
Posted on 3/15/22 at 3:11 pm to
TS is a great stat, but FG% isn’t archaic by any means. Every stat has flaws, and the flaw with TS% is that players who shoot 10 free throws per game are going to have a high TS% regardless of their FG% and 3P%. The good thing about FG% and 3P% is that they both give raw snapshots of a player’s efficiency.
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