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re: ESPN - Shady's Bar employees: "Victims threw first punch"
Posted on 8/26/11 at 8:55 am to Antonio Moss
Posted on 8/26/11 at 8:55 am to Antonio Moss
But, no one would argue that the initial police report is to be taken as fact and trump any other evidence gathered. Also the police report clearly loses merit, because the investigating officer(BRPD) failed to interview a cross section of witnesses to include the employees of the bar.
1
Posted on 8/26/11 at 8:58 am to K2LAW
First off, I understand the evidentary value of police reports and the hearsay rule pretty well considering I deal with both all the time.
I'm not criticizing the police department's work in the initial report. In fact, it does a great job of chronicling what now appear to be grave contradictions in Lowery's account.
I do think the way its been used by in the media is deplorable, but that is to be expected with journalist.
And, I do think the BRPD's overall handling of this case has been incompetent.
quote:
I'm just getting tired of the mischaracterizations of what a police report is and the criticisms of the police department because of information in their report.
I'm not criticizing the police department's work in the initial report. In fact, it does a great job of chronicling what now appear to be grave contradictions in Lowery's account.
I do think the way its been used by in the media is deplorable, but that is to be expected with journalist.
And, I do think the BRPD's overall handling of this case has been incompetent.
Posted on 8/26/11 at 9:02 am to Tigerfan7218
quote:
If it's not resolved by then, JJ plays. Simple as that. Les is waiting until the resolution of the investigation so if it's not over, JJ won't be suspended.
Not sure that will happen without some strong assurances from an authority in the know.
Posted on 8/26/11 at 9:02 am to Antonio Moss
quote:
First off, I understand the evidentary value of police reports and the hearsay rule pretty well considering I deal with both all the time.
I can tell. I deal with them all the time as well.
quote:
And, I do think the BRPD's overall handling of this case has been incompetent.
Now that I can't comment on as all I really know about what they've done is what I've read on this board (I do have a day job, as I'm sure you do too, and it's suffering right now from all of this distraction) and I discount so much of that.
I will say this though -- if, God forbid, my daughter (who is currently at LSU) or my son (who plans to be there soon) should be involved in a bar fight around campus, can I expect devotion of this level of resources to the investigation?
Posted on 8/26/11 at 9:09 am to K2LAW
quote:
my son (who plans to be there soon) should be involved in a bar fight around campus, can I expect devotion of this level of resources to the investigation?
As I said earlier, as this investigation heads into its seventh day, it's been investigated six days and 23 hours longer than a typical bar fight.
This post was edited on 8/26/11 at 9:15 am
Posted on 8/26/11 at 9:10 am to ATLTiger
quote:
just so I got this straight, as I've not seen the report and things tend to change on here pretty rapidly:
the account of events in the police report is based mainly on the victims' accounts and that of a 3rd arty witness who may actually be an acquaintance of 1 (or more) of said victims? (fyi, I'm getting her potential bias from a post or 2 I saw on here)
Here's the thing:
It was Long who made the statement in the police report that the unknown w/m (who was initially attacked) made verbal threats regarding a gun.
If Lowery and Long and the Three were in it together, why would Long volunteer that potentially damaging information on the guy?
Posted on 8/26/11 at 9:11 am to USMCTiger03
I'm not reading this in entirety, can someone answer me where they are saying the first punch was thrown? And it was thrown by the marine or the driver?
Posted on 8/26/11 at 9:12 am to Antonio Moss
quote:
I'm talking about the veracity of the entirety of the initial report.
then why would you conclude there was even a forearm at all?
Posted on 8/26/11 at 9:13 am to Antonio Moss
I don't think it's wholly matter of incompetence. I think the officer wrote up a bar fight, which never goes past the report unless someone on scene is killed or gravely injured. But, because of the persons allegedly involved and the discovered injuries of the accusers it morphed into a huge event when it was really just a bar fight(just speaking in terms of reality. Not trying to downplay any of the events). Once it became this full scale event the BRPD had to play catch up and is still behind the curve in that sense. But, they can't come out and say they were just treating like any other bar fight ans weren't gonna pay too much attention to it. That's not PC. If there had been a serious injury at the scene or murder, there would have been more police officers namely detectives swarming the scene and interviewing people and getting names of everyone that was still there for later questioning and there would be fewer gaps for them to fill in. Am I wrong TD Lawyers?
This post was edited on 8/26/11 at 9:14 am
Posted on 8/26/11 at 9:19 am to Mudminnow
quote:
Ive been out of the loop for 3 days and seems like a lot more info has come out regarding the case.
Anything else?
Basically, the story has completely changed from Lowery's initial account, and there is now video (verified by the AP) from inside the bar which proves and corroborates the events leading up to the outside fight, and this video apparently portrays Lowery as the instigator of said fight and not the innocent vitim as he told police.
I'm just speculating, as everyone else is, but IMO if any arrests are made at all, it will all end up being pleaded down to misdemeanors.
Posted on 8/26/11 at 9:21 am to K2LAW
quote:
I will say this though -- if, God forbid, my daughter (who is currently at LSU) or my son (who plans to be there soon) should be involved in a bar fight around campus, can I expect devotion of this level of resources to the investigation?
Who knows, this may set the precedent from here on out. Bar fights are a thing of the past in BR, we clearly see what the problem is in this downtrodden city and all resources will be devoted to ending these damn bar fights ONCE AND FOR ALL!!
Posted on 8/26/11 at 9:25 am to Chad504boy
quote:Shady's employees, outside bar, Marine.
I'm not reading this in entirety, can someone answer me where they are saying the first punch was thrown? And it was thrown by the marine or the driver?
Posted on 8/26/11 at 9:28 am to Elleshoe
quote:
quote:
You appear to have a lot of evidence in your possession.
sort of like you with discrediting Lowery's spring break arrest right? That was the exact point of my post.
I would get into what is material to the case and what isn't, but considering you go to Southern law, you probably wouldn't understand anyway.
:notanothersolawgrad:
Posted on 8/26/11 at 9:30 am to JPLSU1981
quote:Wait, I thought the video simply showed him inside the bar and then getting escorted out. The rest was the statement of the manager and/or "employees".
Basically, the story has completely changed from Lowery's initial account, and there is now video (verified by the AP) from inside the bar which proves and corroborates the events leading up to the outside fight, and this video apparently portrays Lowery as the instigator of said fight and not the innocent vitim as he told police.
Posted on 8/26/11 at 9:31 am to A75CADDY
quote:how did bprd manage to mess this up?
ecause the investigating officer(BRPD) failed to interview a cross section of witnesses to include the employees of the bar.
Posted on 8/26/11 at 9:32 am to JakeRyan
quote:
JakeRyan
quote:
I would get into what is material to the case and what isn't, but considering you go to Southern law, you probably wouldn't understand anyway.
notanothersolawgrad
Frick you. Lump you in with Bzoner and his crew. And learn how to type
This post was edited on 8/26/11 at 9:35 am
Posted on 8/26/11 at 9:33 am to CptBengal
quote:
then why would you conclude there was even a forearm at all?
I never did
Posted on 8/26/11 at 9:34 am to heartbreakTiger
I didn't say they messed it up. I explained that they were treating it as just another bar fight and didn't intend to spend a lot of time on this case. When it grew exponentially they were caught off guard and have been trying to catch up ever since.
Posted on 8/26/11 at 9:37 am to Antonio Moss
This sticks out:
“That truck stopped right in the middle of the whole altercation,” he said.
What are the chances that a vehicle would have been able to pass through a small crowded parking lot into the melee?
“That truck stopped right in the middle of the whole altercation,” he said.
What are the chances that a vehicle would have been able to pass through a small crowded parking lot into the melee?
Posted on 8/26/11 at 9:42 am to USMCTiger03
quote:
What are the chances that a vehicle would have been able to pass through a small crowded parking lot into the melee?
I don't that's unbelievable. Truck rolls up, people obviously move out the way.
If this is like every bar fight I've ever seen, you have people fighting with a circle or semi-circle of people watching.
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