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anyone ever do extended fasting? question...
Posted on 2/24/21 at 7:11 pm
Posted on 2/24/21 at 7:11 pm
I've been reading about the benefits of extended fasting and specifically its ability to induce autophagy. From what I'm reading, autophagy doesn't really kick in until 18-24 hours in, and peaks around 72 hours.
I've done IF before and a couple of 24 hour fasts but that's it on previous experience. I made it 42 hours last week before throwing in the towel. Just lost my willpower. I'm currently trying again and I'm trying to at least make 48 hours this time (19 hours in).
Here's my question: is there any benefit to working out while in autophagy or am I better off taking it easy? I ask because I know HGH shoots way up while fasting and I was wondering if it's possible to take advantage of the extra HGH?
I've done IF before and a couple of 24 hour fasts but that's it on previous experience. I made it 42 hours last week before throwing in the towel. Just lost my willpower. I'm currently trying again and I'm trying to at least make 48 hours this time (19 hours in).
Here's my question: is there any benefit to working out while in autophagy or am I better off taking it easy? I ask because I know HGH shoots way up while fasting and I was wondering if it's possible to take advantage of the extra HGH?
5
Posted on 2/24/21 at 7:33 pm to northshorebamaman
the benefits are very minimal. but if you're a glutton for punishment, go ahead and do a one week water fast or something
Posted on 2/24/21 at 7:35 pm to whiskey over ice
quote:'preciate it
go ahead and do a one week water fast or something
quote:LINK
Autophagy is a lysosomal degradation process and protective housekeeping mechanism to eliminate damaged organelles, long-lived misfolded proteins and invading pathogens. Autophagy functions to recycle building blocks and energy for cellular renovation and homeostasis, allowing cells to adapt to stress. Modulation of autophagy is a potential therapeutic target for a diverse range of diseases, including metabolic conditions, neurodegenerative diseases, cancers and infectious diseases. Traditionally, food deprivation and calorie restriction (CR) have been considered to slow aging and increase longevity. Since autophagy inhibition attenuates the anti-aging effects of CR, it has been proposed that autophagy plays a substantive role in CR-mediated longevity. Among several stress stimuli inducers of autophagy, fasting and CR are the most potent non-genetic autophagy stimulators, and lack the undesirable side effects associated with alternative interventions. Despite the importance of autophagy, the evidence connecting fasting or CR with autophagy promotion has not previously been reviewed. Therefore, our objective was to weigh the evidence relating the effect of CR or fasting on autophagy promotion. We conclude that both fasting and CR have a role in the upregulation of autophagy, the evidence overwhelmingly suggesting that autophagy is induced in a wide variety of tissues and organs in response to food deprivation.
This post was edited on 2/24/21 at 7:46 pm
Posted on 2/24/21 at 8:05 pm to northshorebamaman
if autophagy is your goal just skip breakfast and work out regularly. you're not going to gain 5-10 years on your life from doing extended fasts every now and then. also, any increase in hgh while on an extended fast is negated by lack of calories and protein synthesis. you're also not going to be lifting as heavy as usual so less volume. again, the benefits are minimal
Posted on 2/24/21 at 8:10 pm to whiskey over ice
From what I've read (Mostly Dr's Jason Fung, Valter Longo, and Alan Goldhamer) autophagy doesn't increase dramatically until 24 hours in.
This post was edited on 2/24/21 at 8:11 pm
Posted on 2/25/21 at 7:08 am to northshorebamaman
I’d be very cautious about working out in a fasted state. Everyone’s different so you’ll have to listen to your body but I had some major adrenal burnout doing HIIT in the mornings during an Int Fast. Not only that but my cortisol levels got out of wack.
Posted on 2/25/21 at 9:26 am to northshorebamaman
As long as your getting electrolytes in the form of salts (sodium, potassium, etc.) which you should be doing on water fasts anyway (straight water fasts jack up your body electrolyte levels), you're fine working out. I do it all the time and don't feel any differences until day 4 or 5, where weakness and lethargy start creeping in. There's no reason not to. Full disclosure, I do strength based workouts that are low volume and high frequency. A standard bodybuilding diet might deplete glycogen levels faster, especially if you're not fat-adapted.
It's not advised to do any strenuous activity when dry fasting - no water or food.
It's not advised to do any strenuous activity when dry fasting - no water or food.
Posted on 2/25/21 at 9:37 am to omarlittle
quote:
dry fasting - no water or food.
Why would anyone do a no water fast? Are there supposed to be health benefits?
Posted on 2/25/21 at 9:48 am to OysterPoBoy
autophagy bruh
Posted on 2/25/21 at 10:08 am to OysterPoBoy
quote:No idea outside of religious reasons.
Why would anyone do a no water fast?
This post was edited on 2/25/21 at 10:37 am
Posted on 2/25/21 at 10:11 am to omarlittle
quote:Thanks. I said frick it and worked out this morning and felt surprisingly good.
As long as your getting electrolytes in the form of salts (sodium, potassium, etc.) which you should be doing on water fasts anyway (straight water fasts jack up your body electrolyte levels), you're fine working out. I do it all the time and don't feel any differences until day 4 or 5, where weakness and lethargy start creeping in. There's no reason not to. Full disclosure, I do strength based workouts that are low volume and high frequency. A standard bodybuilding diet might deplete glycogen levels faster, especially if you're not fat-adapted.
It's not advised to do any strenuous activity when dry fasting - no water or food.
quote:yeah, no dry fasting for me.
It's not advised to do any strenuous activity when dry fasting - no water or food.
Posted on 2/25/21 at 10:13 am to whiskey over ice
quote:I didn't say I was doing a dry fast though I would guess it offers few benefits over water fasting while adding considerable risk.
autophagy bruh
BTW, are you this dismissive of the benefits of all forms of fasting? Because the benefits of IF fasting are widely accepted and increasingly backed by hard science. A 3-5 day fast operates on the same theory. You're just condensing your fasting time (and actually spending less time overall in a fasted state). Instead of 16:8, or alternate day, or any of the shorter duration methods you can do one day a week, three days a month, or seven days a quarter (just examples).
This post was edited on 2/25/21 at 11:03 am
Posted on 2/25/21 at 12:52 pm to northshorebamaman
I've gone 60 hours once.
Make sure you get your salt in. Just mix 1/2 teaspoon into your water every few hours during day two and you'll be fine. Around normal meal times I'd go on long walks out of the house to where I would not be near any food.
Make sure you get your salt in. Just mix 1/2 teaspoon into your water every few hours during day two and you'll be fine. Around normal meal times I'd go on long walks out of the house to where I would not be near any food.
Posted on 2/25/21 at 1:17 pm to northshorebamaman
i have done plenty of 72 hour fast and 2 96 hour fast.
imo unless you are doing it for fatloss its pretty much a waste. the whole autophagy thing is pointless as far as seeing any real health benifits outside of the fatloss.
imo unless you are doing it for fatloss its pretty much a waste. the whole autophagy thing is pointless as far as seeing any real health benifits outside of the fatloss.
Posted on 2/25/21 at 1:43 pm to lsu777
quote:
the whole autophagy thing is pointless as far as seeing any real health benifits outside of the fatloss.
Autophagy is pointless? What??
Posted on 2/25/21 at 2:37 pm to lsu777
quote:What are your sources for your conclusion that autophagy is pointless? I'm not completely dug in this topic but I can post multiple links to studies and articles in medical journals that come to a much different conclusion.
the whole autophagy thing is pointless as far as seeing any real health benifits outside of the fatloss.
I mean...
quote:LINK
. Autophagy enhances the clearance of toxic, cytoplasmic, aggregate-prone proteins and infectious agents. The beneficial roles of autophagy can now be extended to supporting cell survival and regulating inflammation. Autophagic control of inflammation is one area where autophagy may have similar benefits for both infectious and neurodegenerative diseases beyond direct removal of the pathogenic agents. Preclinical data supporting the potential therapeutic utility of autophagy modulation in such conditions is accumulating.
quote:LINK
The recognition of autophagy as an immune phenomenon has opened a new chapter in the narrative of immunity.
quote:
Autophagy functions to recycle building blocks and energy for cellular renovation and homeostasis, allowing cells to adapt to stress. Modulation of autophagy is a potential therapeutic target for a diverse range of diseases, including metabolic conditions, neurodegenerative diseases, cancers and infectious diseases.
LINK
quote:LINK
Caloric restriction (CR) is known to extend lifespan in most organisms, indicating that nutrient and energy regulatory mechanisms impact aging. The greatest risk factor for neurodegeneration is age; thus, the antiaging effects of CR might attenuate progressive cell death and avert the aggregation of abnormal proteins associated with neurodegenerative diseases. CR is a potent inducer of autophagy, a tightly regulated intracellular process that facilitates recycling of abnormal protein aggregates and damaged organelles into bioenergetic and biosynthetic materials to maintain homeostasis. Thus, dysregulated autophagy can lead to cellular dysfunction, abnormal protein accumulation, proteotoxicity and subsequently the onset of several neurodegenerative diseases. Therefore, the targeted and precision-controlled activation of autophagy represents a promising therapeutic strategy.
And that's without even getting into insulin control or weight loss.
sounds pretty promising to me.
I've read a lot of your posts here and respect your opinion but tell (show) me what I'm missing here?
This post was edited on 2/25/21 at 2:50 pm
Posted on 2/25/21 at 3:21 pm to northshorebamaman
i dont think autophahy is pointless I just think you get plenty when in a caloric defict anyways.
I personally did not see any significant changes in my blood work when I used to do them. Even with 24 hour dry fast mixed in.
I didnt necessarily feel a ton different, but i do notice i tend to get less sick.
Im not trying to talk anyone out of doing it, it was just my expierence. I personally right now am doing 22/2 fasting to help me stay compliant to my current macros.
I still think fasting and things like the snake diet are the best way for really overweight people to get the weight off quickly. But for 95% of people it doesnt work for them as they do not have the will power to stay strict.
By all means though have at it. wsnt trying to discourage was simply stating my expierence that it wasnt some fountain of youth or some major break through imo.
I personally did not see any significant changes in my blood work when I used to do them. Even with 24 hour dry fast mixed in.
I didnt necessarily feel a ton different, but i do notice i tend to get less sick.
Im not trying to talk anyone out of doing it, it was just my expierence. I personally right now am doing 22/2 fasting to help me stay compliant to my current macros.
I still think fasting and things like the snake diet are the best way for really overweight people to get the weight off quickly. But for 95% of people it doesnt work for them as they do not have the will power to stay strict.
By all means though have at it. wsnt trying to discourage was simply stating my expierence that it wasnt some fountain of youth or some major break through imo.
Posted on 2/25/21 at 3:34 pm to lsu777
quote:
the whole autophagy thing is pointless as far as seeing any real health benifits outside of the fatloss.
quote:
i dont think autophahy is pointless
quote:I think so too and am starting to lean this way. Before this I was doing OMAD (so basically same as you) and it's my understanding that you achieve a more modest boost during shorter periods of fasting but the cumulative effect is the same because you're doing it more often. It really just depends on how well this current fast turns out. If it's unsustainable I'll just revert back to OMAD alternated with 16:8.
I just think you get plenty when in a caloric deficit anyways.
quote:Well, guess I'll find out sooner than later.
But for 95% of people it doesnt work for them as they do not have the will power to stay strict.
quote:I get that. Not looking for a fountain of youth. We all come into this with different health histories, priorities, and concerns. I didn't list mine because the thread wasn't intended to be a debate on the merits of fasting (though obviously some of that will happen). I also don't believe something has to be a major breakthrough to be worth incorporating into my routine.
stating my expierence that it wasnt some fountain of youth or some major break through imo.
This post was edited on 2/25/21 at 3:58 pm
Posted on 2/25/21 at 4:36 pm to northshorebamaman
The idea behind dry fasting - aside from a more aggressive approach to autophagy - is that the body, being deprived of water, will create its own water source to maintain function, via essentially destroying fat cells to gain access to the water within them. Seven days of dry fasting purportedly has a laundry list of benefits primarily pertaining to resetting systems and an overall housecleaning of the unhealthiest cells in the body.
Posted on 2/25/21 at 4:52 pm to omarlittle
quote:
Seven days of dry fasting
How do you not die?
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