re: Star Trek Voyager

I think the real question should be

"Is it time for another Star Trek TV series?"

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They also tried to be to PC with the lesbians and jungle fever, etc.

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I have no idea what this is all about.

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It was a waste of time.

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How old are you?

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DS9 was just a floating general hospital.

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It's obvious you didn't even watch it. Did you miss the numerous voyages of exploration to the Gamma Quadrant? Or the Dominion War?

What DS9 gave that no other series offered (other than Babylon 5, a close parallel) was civilians, politics and a sense of community - something that doesn't exist (or just peripherally) in other Trek series, but is front and center of DS9.

In TOS, TNG and VOY (I can't speak for ENT, but I assume much of the same) - there are only 2 sides - Federation and all others. DS9 (and B5) are intriguing and entertaining because they explore multi-lateral views of the same facts and events.

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I got 7-8 episodes in and put it down. I'm in S5 right now of TNG. As soon as I get done with it, I plan on picking Voyager back up. But, I do feel a B5/DS9 rewatch coming up. Have not watched B5 since my original watch, and I need to rewatch DS9 for all its glory again. Buck Bokai FTW.

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Gotcha. While we're on the subject, isn't it universally agreed that DS9 stole its subject matter from J. Michal Strazinski and Babylon 5.

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While we're on the subject, isn't it universally agreed that DS9 stole its subject matter from J. Michal Strazinski and Babylon 5.

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That is under dispute. He did pitch B5 as a Star Trek series. For many years, JMS and the Trek people had an uneasy peace.

It is possible that the creative people at the top steered DS9 (although it did air first) in a direction to try to co-opt B5. In the end, there was an exchange of ambassadors (Majel Barrett appeared on B5 and Bill Mumy appeared on DS9) - and there are many parallels - DS9 appears, at times, to be TNG meets B5. However, the Dominion War comes much later than the Shadow War.

B5 itself seems to borrow from Trek, as well as other sources (Tolkien, etc.), so who is to say?

I enjoy them separately and consider them nice companion pieces. Each has strengths and weaknesses.

Yes, I remember some of those things, but I stopped watching when it got to be too stupid for me. The basis for the show was a stationary object. Regardless of where they went on vacation, it flies in the face of the Star Trek philosophy.

Voyager is superior because it, like the other two good series, was constantly encountering new life and new civilizations, etc. DS9 was boring, unless you like soap operas, which you obviously do.

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unless you like soap operas, which you obviously do.

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Enjoy the next Transformers film.

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Don't however, watch the final episode. An insult to star trek fans everywhere.

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Now I have to know what happened.

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Ace, you should take a look at Enterprise. It had a few low points to be sure, but I enjoyed the hell out of the first and fourth seasons. It was really hitting it's stride in season 4 when they canceled it. Don't however, watch the final episode. An insult to star trek fans everywhere.

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Mrs. Midnight and I are slowly going through Voyager and will watch Enterprise next.

The thing is - once through, it is clear that only TOS and DS9 (and B5) are worth re-watching, in the final analysis. Although TNG was spot on for several stretches (and Data is one of the best non-TOS characters, again, along with The Doctor, ever), there was way too much deus ex Wesley in the first couple of seasons, and they grappled to find a credible antagonist other than Q or the Borg.

DS9 had Gul Dukat, the Founders AND the Jem'Hadar - great villains make great stories. Even TOS struggled to balance their routine missions with Klingon encounters.

Another great twist with DS9 is making the old foes, the Klingons into noble allies. The softening stance with the Romulans was nice, as well.

To try to get back on point with Voyager - they really struggled with the Anabasis-type story at first - the Kazon were "okay" at first, but they really came into their own, villain-wise, with the Borg and Species 8472.

Voyager was a wonderful concept, but the characters and acting were very uneven. I really liked The Doctor and I liked Kim, Torres and, sometimes, Neelix. However, I found Janeway, Chakotay, Kes and Seven of Nine hard to like, from a personal standpoint. I didn't think much of Beltran or Ryan's acting (although, in her case, she was supposed to be part machine - maybe I missed the point?).

I really enjoyed it as well. I think a few things that stands out about Voyager as opposed to a most of the other series is that is a bit more cerebral and uses more scientific concepts in a dramatic exploration. It also had more of an opportunity to explore the theme of "what it means to be human" in places where humanity has no footprint and I think that served the series well.

ETA: It no doubt came up short in a few episodes, most notably in the episode where Tom Paris broke the "unbreakable" threshold of Warp 10 and devolved into a walking catfish and got Janeway pregnant. Not kidding.