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re: Crackpot ASOIAF Theories SPOILERS
Posted on 9/10/12 at 8:44 am to BluegrassBelle
Posted on 9/10/12 at 8:44 am to BluegrassBelle
I know it was a sore point that House Lannister lost their sword and Tywin repeatedly tried to buy a replacement from lesser houses.
I guess I'm seeign a true Great Sword as being "better" or having more prestige than a normal sword (or two of them) even if it is still Valaryian Steel. Thats why it suprised me he didnt have Ice re-made into another Great Sword.
And technically Jeoffrey was a Baratheon so Tywin just gave a Valarian Steel Sword to another house.
I also dont see him giving both away, rather I would suspect he planned to keep one for himself.
I guess I'm seeign a true Great Sword as being "better" or having more prestige than a normal sword (or two of them) even if it is still Valaryian Steel. Thats why it suprised me he didnt have Ice re-made into another Great Sword.
And technically Jeoffrey was a Baratheon so Tywin just gave a Valarian Steel Sword to another house.
I also dont see him giving both away, rather I would suspect he planned to keep one for himself.
1
Posted on 9/10/12 at 9:37 am to Chris4x4gill2
quote:
And technically Jeoffrey was a Baratheon so Tywin just gave a Valarian Steel Sword to another house.
Only in name. Tywin was very intelligent, so I'm sure he knew what Joffrey really was. And it was very clear to him that he would never see a satisfactory Lannister heir from his line. Jamie is a captain of KG and he would never recognize a product of Tyrion. Joffrey and Tommen are as good as he was going to get.
Belle, I'm up for a group re-read. I especially like the idea of going through the next Dunk & Egg.
Posted on 9/10/12 at 9:46 am to Mr. Wayne
quote:
Only in name. Tywin was very intelligent, so I'm sure he knew what Joffrey really was. And it was very clear to him that he would never see a satisfactory Lannister heir from his line. Jamie is a captain of KG and he would never recognize a product of Tyrion. Joffrey and Tommen are as good as he was going to get.
Beat me to it.
quote:
Belle, I'm up for a group re-read. I especially like the idea of going through the next Dunk & Egg.
So that's myself, jrod, Carson, auyushu, and Mr. Wayne. Anyone else down for a group re-read?
Posted on 9/10/12 at 10:33 am to BluegrassBelle
Even if Tywin knows about Jeoffrey - and I'm sure he did - he is still a Baratheon. And the Lannisters have to perpetuate that myth or they have no claim to the throne. Granted, if the other claimants cant take the throne from them I guess it doesnt matter. LOL
It makes more sense to me though when you look at the fact that Cersie is the only one of his children that will continue the Lannister line. (perception still, Jamie cant claim them)
I'm down for a re-read.... looks like I'll have to go buy the books again. I've loaned out two copies of the series and havent gotten them back yet.
It makes more sense to me though when you look at the fact that Cersie is the only one of his children that will continue the Lannister line. (perception still, Jamie cant claim them)
I'm down for a re-read.... looks like I'll have to go buy the books again. I've loaned out two copies of the series and havent gotten them back yet.
Posted on 9/10/12 at 10:38 am to Mr. Wayne
quote:
Only in name. Tywin was very intelligent, so I'm sure he knew what Joffrey really was. And it was very clear to him that he would never see a satisfactory Lannister heir from his line. Jamie is a captain of KG and he would never recognize a product of Tyrion. Joffrey and Tommen are as good as he was going to get.
I think this was a mistake on Tywin's part. They are trying to sell Joffrey as the legitimate heir of Robert and Cersei , but he gives him a sword that has Lannister colors and decorated with a lion's head.
This was a sore spot for him though. Appearance meant almost everything too him and he was upset that other lesser houses and families had Valarian swords and his, one of the most powerful in the kingdom, did not.
I think a reread would be fun.
Posted on 9/10/12 at 10:39 am to Chris4x4gill2
I think something to consider, though I don't think it will be important since they are about to get their asses kicked, the Lannister's have swallowed up the Baratheon name. Robert and Renly are dead with no true heirs, and Stannis is a traitor with only a daughter who Cersei would probably give to the Silent Sisters. Or just kill her, either way. So while Joffrey and Tommen carry the name, they are moreso a product of the Lannister's even without touching on the fact that they are all Lannister.
Posted on 9/10/12 at 10:51 am to Mr. Wayne
quote:
Robert and Renly are dead with no true heirs
Gendry (sp?)
Posted on 9/10/12 at 10:54 am to SaintEB
Technically Gendry isn't a "true" heir, since he's a bastard. Unless he was to be legitimized, because at this point he hasn't been.
Posted on 9/10/12 at 10:56 am to Mr. Wayne
Also looking at the Lannister line you basically have Lancel and his siblings (and lord knows Lancel is a wet blanket who I doubt will ever father a child at this point). Outside of them that's about it when it comes to Lannisters who could at this point produce Lannister heirs in name. You have Baratheons on one side and those miserable arse Freys on the other.
This post was edited on 9/10/12 at 10:57 am
Posted on 9/10/12 at 11:05 am to ornagestorm
quote:
think this was a mistake on Tywin's part. They are trying to sell Joffrey as the legitimate heir of Robert and Cersei , but he gives him a sword that has Lannister colors and decorated with a lion's head.
I agree with this. With Stannis already claiming Jeoffrey is not Roberts son, why continue to paint him as a Lannister instead of trying to bolster his Baratheon claim? I guess it goes back to the fact that they have the throne and so far no one can take it from them.
Posted on 9/10/12 at 11:51 am to BluegrassBelle
quote:
Outside of them that's about it when it comes to Lannisters who could at this point produce Lannister heirs in name.
I just looked up to see who was left and other than Tyrion and Lancel, you have his younger brother Martyn, a squire. And Tyrek who is still missing, possibly dead. With Lancel likely not producing an heir, it will likely be up to Martyn, Kevan's youngest son to carry on the name of the most prominent house in Westeros.
Speaking of Tyrek. I know there is belief that Varys had him abducted. My question is why? At the time, there was no shortage of Lannisters and he wasn't even anything special. His father Tygett, has been dead. Crackpot on: Vary's has been arranging for Lannister's to drop like flies (Kevan) and/or no longer be concerned with the house (Lancel). He is doing this in order to possess the final Lannister in Westeros and will gain control of Casterly Rock by having this power. That's my best guess.
Posted on 9/10/12 at 11:54 am to BluegrassBelle
quote:
Anyone else down for a group re-read?
What would this entail? Just us reading the books at the same time and discussing?
Posted on 9/10/12 at 12:12 pm to F machine
quote:
What would this entail? Just us reading the books at the same time and discussing?
Pretty much. Probably do a couple POVs a week. I looked at some of the reread schedules they did over on Westeros.org and it looks like they did 2 POVs a week (roughly 30 pages give or take). I'm just trying to take into consideration people working, going to class, and etc at the same time.
ETA: Or we could do bigger batches of reading. I just realized there is 73 chapters in Game of Thrones alone so unless we want to do a book a year we should probably go more then 2 POVs.
This post was edited on 9/10/12 at 12:18 pm
Posted on 9/10/12 at 12:54 pm to BluegrassBelle
quote:
Pretty much. Probably do a couple POVs a week. I looked at some of the reread schedules they did over on Westeros.org and it looks like they did 2 POVs a week (roughly 30 pages give or take). I'm just trying to take into consideration people working, going to class, and etc at the same time.
ETA: Or we could do bigger batches of reading. I just realized there is 73 chapters in Game of Thrones alone so unless we want to do a book a year we should probably go more then 2 POVs.
Yeah, I might be able to do this. Just depends. I'm also reading Hyperion by Dan Simmons right now, and I'm pretty caught up in that
Posted on 9/10/12 at 12:56 pm to F machine
I might have missed it, did it ever say how the Lannister sword got lost?
Posted on 9/10/12 at 1:02 pm to ornagestorm
quote:
Brightroar - The ancestral sword of House Lannister, carried to Valyria and lost by Tommen II Lannister, King of the Rock.
Before the War of the Conquest. So there have been many Lords of Casterly Rock to have to deal with the shame of not possessing a Valyrian Steel sword.
This post was edited on 9/10/12 at 1:09 pm
Posted on 9/10/12 at 1:47 pm to F machine
quote:
Yeah, I might be able to do this. Just depends. I'm also reading Hyperion by Dan Simmons right now, and I'm pretty caught up in that
Good book series, too bad Simmons went all whack job down the road after that. I'm not a huge sci fi guy, but that's one of my favorite sci fi series.
Posted on 9/10/12 at 3:13 pm to BluegrassBelle
quote:
I just realized there is 73 chapters in Game of Thrones alone so unless we want to do a book a year...
That's probably how long we'll have to wait on TWOW.
Posted on 9/10/12 at 3:26 pm to Mr. Wayne
quote:
I just looked up to see who was left and other than Tyrion and Lancel, you have his younger brother Martyn, a squire.
Interesting post. I guess it will be Lord Martyn by the time we get to TWOW.
A thought: Martin has hinted that we will see The Rock in the next book. Which POV do you think we will see it through?
Crackpipe lit: I'd love to see Tyrion and the Iron Fleet sail the Sunset Sea and storm Casterly Rock. Consider this quote / foreshadowing from Jon I AGOT -
quote:
When he opened the door, the light from within threw his shadow clear across the yard, and for just a moment Tyrion Lannister stood tall as a king.
Posted on 9/10/12 at 3:39 pm to jrodLSUke
quote:
A thought: Martin has hinted that we will see The Rock in the next book. Which POV do you think we will see it through?
I'll take a hit off that crackpipe jrod. Hell I'll even add to it. Tyrion is in Mereen and will likely ally himself with Dany. It has been told in prophecy that for her to go home, west, she must travel east. If she travels to Westeros by heading east, which severely depleted house without a strong lordly presence awaits on the western side of Westeros?
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