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Started By
Message
Anyone with IT experience at a High School
Posted on 2/21/22 at 2:10 pm
Posted on 2/21/22 at 2:10 pm
Today I get a call saying I have to pick my Son up from school and the school is recommending expulsion. We have a hearing later this week.
He is being accused of Unauthorized Use of Technology. They are saying numerous files were moved or had permission changes. They couldn't prove it was actually him but said forensic evidence showed it was his login that made these changes.
My Son swears he didn't do it and I am not even sure he is capable of changing permissions. If he was capable I would think he would know he would leave a trail.
Does anyone know how these systems work? Do they not have screen recorders, wouldn't the files be somewhat protected if they were that valuable, is there anyway to prove that he was the one that actually did it? All they are telling me is it came from his account.
My Son says the was supposed to be in that folder because of an assignment in another class. I am just looking for the truth. Right now I can't prove he didn't do it and they couldn't prove to me he did and I think expulsion is a little harsh for his first infraction.
He is being accused of Unauthorized Use of Technology. They are saying numerous files were moved or had permission changes. They couldn't prove it was actually him but said forensic evidence showed it was his login that made these changes.
My Son swears he didn't do it and I am not even sure he is capable of changing permissions. If he was capable I would think he would know he would leave a trail.
Does anyone know how these systems work? Do they not have screen recorders, wouldn't the files be somewhat protected if they were that valuable, is there anyway to prove that he was the one that actually did it? All they are telling me is it came from his account.
My Son says the was supposed to be in that folder because of an assignment in another class. I am just looking for the truth. Right now I can't prove he didn't do it and they couldn't prove to me he did and I think expulsion is a little harsh for his first infraction.
16
Posted on 2/21/22 at 2:18 pm to cbr900racer22
This is why us neck bearded nerds always get so pissy about leaving passwords on sticky notes and letting others login with your login.
Despite you saying "It's no big deal it's not like I've got nuclear secrets or anything."
When you share passwords or make yours easy to access you can no longer deny what's been done in your name.
So either your son was making his account easy to access for others or he was up to nefarious activity. Either way its trivial to see which account did what in log files.
Regardless if it's his account, then it's his account. Not much else can be done.
Despite you saying "It's no big deal it's not like I've got nuclear secrets or anything."
When you share passwords or make yours easy to access you can no longer deny what's been done in your name.
So either your son was making his account easy to access for others or he was up to nefarious activity. Either way its trivial to see which account did what in log files.
Regardless if it's his account, then it's his account. Not much else can be done.
This post was edited on 2/21/22 at 2:19 pm
Posted on 2/21/22 at 2:22 pm to LSURep864
They specifically asked him if anyone had his log in info which he said no. They didn't get anything else out of him so I got the phone call.
Posted on 2/21/22 at 2:22 pm to cbr900racer22
Depends on how it was stolen, if that is in fact the case. If he left his account unlocked or his password on a sticky note, shame on him.
Are cameras mounted in the classroom/computer lab? Footage could be reviewed to see if someone accessed his machine possibly if so? That aside, logs could potentially be reviewed to see if his login was used from a machine other than the one that he normally logs into. I'd at least demand a little more to warrant an expulsion. Kids can beat the hell out of each other and get 3 days, but changing permissions on a folder is an expulsion?
If he in fact was able to do that, then maybe IT needs the suspension. It would be a really poor configuration to even allow files to be moved or permissions changed on them (other than those that he owns) in the first place.
Are cameras mounted in the classroom/computer lab? Footage could be reviewed to see if someone accessed his machine possibly if so? That aside, logs could potentially be reviewed to see if his login was used from a machine other than the one that he normally logs into. I'd at least demand a little more to warrant an expulsion. Kids can beat the hell out of each other and get 3 days, but changing permissions on a folder is an expulsion?
If he in fact was able to do that, then maybe IT needs the suspension. It would be a really poor configuration to even allow files to be moved or permissions changed on them (other than those that he owns) in the first place.
This post was edited on 2/21/22 at 2:28 pm
Posted on 2/21/22 at 2:25 pm to cbr900racer22
Tell them to produce the audit trail. Was son on the computer where files were accessed to be moved at the time of incident? They should know which computer the files were accessed from along with date/time stamp of file modification. Sounds like an issue has been uncovered to provide better security for critical files, regardless if it was him or someone using his credentials.
Agree that expulsion is excessive.
Agree that expulsion is excessive.
Posted on 2/21/22 at 2:42 pm to BabySam
They showed me a printout of of my Son's login info that accessed a certain folder. In another column there were 2 words- move and permissions. My Son admitted to being in the folder to access pictures for an assignment in another class. When I asked about the ip address they said it came from an access point that was in his class at that time. Couldn't tell me the device.
The Asst Principal didn't know what any of this meant and couldn't explain the data. He said he only know how to turn on a computer.
The Asst Principal didn't know what any of this meant and couldn't explain the data. He said he only know how to turn on a computer.
Posted on 2/21/22 at 2:52 pm to cbr900racer22
Not gonna lie. I dont see how its your sons problem even if he did do it.
If the school doesnt want certain files touched then they need to be knowledgeable enough to hide/lock/prevent un authorized movements/actions to certain folders.
I would not let them blame my son for shite in that situation.
If the school doesnt want certain files touched then they need to be knowledgeable enough to hide/lock/prevent un authorized movements/actions to certain folders.
I would not let them blame my son for shite in that situation.
Posted on 2/21/22 at 2:59 pm to cbr900racer22
quote:
The Asst Principal didn't know what any of this meant and couldn't explain the data. He said he only know how to turn on a computer.
I'd go up the chain to the school board if they refuse to even discuss the matter.
Posted on 2/21/22 at 3:01 pm to cbr900racer22
A) sounds like bad IT security.
B) they should have a backup if it was that important.
You could do a public records request regarding the incident to get the "full story"
B) they should have a backup if it was that important.
You could do a public records request regarding the incident to get the "full story"
Posted on 2/21/22 at 3:02 pm to jdd48
I was told to set up another meeting with the faculty. If I don't like how it goes to get an attorney to be present at the hearing. Not sure if I am buying the attorney deal though.
Posted on 2/21/22 at 3:04 pm to philabuck
quote:
ou could do a public records request regarding the incident to get the "full story"
How do I go about this?
Posted on 2/21/22 at 3:12 pm to cbr900racer22
And i forgot to add in my initial response:
Ive had to deal with issues like this with adults in a work environment. Someone accidentally dragged/dropped a folder into another folder. shite happens. But as multiple people have said in here, a security flaw has been identified so it’s on the school to correct that.
Ive had to deal with issues like this with adults in a work environment. Someone accidentally dragged/dropped a folder into another folder. shite happens. But as multiple people have said in here, a security flaw has been identified so it’s on the school to correct that.
Posted on 2/21/22 at 3:12 pm to cbr900racer22
There should be a board policy stating the steps needed. Typically the treasurer's office or business office should be able to point you in the right direction.
Posted on 2/21/22 at 3:32 pm to philabuck
Thank you all for the responses so far.
Posted on 2/21/22 at 3:41 pm to cbr900racer22
quote:
I was told to set up another meeting with the faculty. If I don't like how it goes to get an attorney to be present at the hearing. Not sure if I am buying the attorney deal though.
If they're threatening expulsion, I'd absolutely consider lawyering up and potentially look at defamation and consequential damages. F* them and their crappy security. The typical school board IT guy lives in his mom's basement and built computers for his gaming buddies without much more expertise. Having that sort of guy claiming my child did something expulsion worthy would have me all kinds of riled up.
Posted on 2/21/22 at 3:54 pm to cbr900racer22
quote:
He is being accused of Unauthorized Use of Technology. They are saying numerous files were moved or had permission changes.
Entirely possible he could have accidentally dragged a file somewhere, which would result in moving the file and the permissions changing because they are inherited from the new location. This is the most likely scenario IMO, and it means that someone is grossly over-reacting and/or has no idea how shite works.
If he actually had security rights to be able to right-click, go to Properties, and frick with the security of the files, then someone at the school should be fired for not doing their job.
This post was edited on 2/21/22 at 3:58 pm
Posted on 2/21/22 at 4:16 pm to cbr900racer22
quote:
They are saying numerous files were moved or had permission changes. They couldn't prove it was actually him but said forensic evidence showed it was his login that made these changes.
The school has an incompetent IT department. A student account is allowed to move files around and change permissions? LOL
This is the school's failure as they should have proper security precautions, like not allow students to move, delete, or change permissions on files. The expulsion is completely unnecessary.
Posted on 2/21/22 at 4:37 pm to Chimlim
quote:
The school has an incompetent IT department. A student account is allowed to move files around and change permissions? LOL
This is what doesn't make any sense at all to me. If they say it was his account that did it, why does his account have the ability to do it in the first place?
I would be too embarrassed at that oversight to ever call out a student/user for it. It sounds like they're so incompetent they don't understand how stupid this makes them look.
There are a million innocent reasons why your son may have been doing regular tasks with files in that folder and something got changed. And now they're going to expel him like he was some kind of hacker? What exactly are the files in question that changed and what are they even saying your son's motivation would be in changing these files?
Posted on 2/21/22 at 6:10 pm to efrad
Now that I am home to do some investigating it is a Google drive page. I don't see where he has any options to move or set permissions on any files. I would think only the page owner can do so. Pulse as a page owner you should be able to see who modified what. This was a big mystery to them and said it took days for IT to pin it down to my Son. I am really confused.
These are yearbook photo files by the way.
These are yearbook photo files by the way.
This post was edited on 2/21/22 at 6:11 pm
Posted on 2/21/22 at 6:15 pm to cbr900racer22
quote:
don't see where he has any options to move or set permissions on any files.
Most likely because he accidentally exposed a hole in their security.
The person who effed it up has now fixed the hole and is blaming your son for "hacking" to save their own arse.
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