- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
re: What is the source of our rights?
Posted on 3/30/26 at 12:50 pm to CleverUserName
Posted on 3/30/26 at 12:50 pm to CleverUserName
quote:
Now show me the actual numbers where the state makes money from mass incarceration. Actual numbers.
Yes sir, I'll have that report ready for you ASAP.
quote:
Because if you think phone calls and candy bars in the commissary is an excess revenue over housing a felon for years... then I'm just at an absolute loss.
You're right. The whole penal system is a drain on society that benefits no one. That's what you want to believe, right? We only perpetuate ballooning incarceration rates because its the right thing to do, right? The only want to keep people safe? That's what the government says so it must be true.
quote:
Oh and still waiting on that explanation of the cratering of the homicide rate in El Salvador.
I'll work on that report as soon as I'm finished with your other research.
3
Posted on 3/30/26 at 12:51 pm to UtahCajun
quote:
Seems you have found the revenue stream we were looking for.
So absolutely not:
quote:
Commissary, prison phone calls, private prison contracts, prison labor...
And coming back to my point. It's not a revenue generator for the state. It's a cost to the taxpayer.
Posted on 3/30/26 at 12:53 pm to CleverUserName
It's a tool for wage suppression.
I'm sure you'll ask me to explain that in detail with citations next.
I'm sure you'll ask me to explain that in detail with citations next.
Posted on 3/30/26 at 12:55 pm to 4cubbies
quote:
The whole penal system is a drain on society that benefits no one
It benefits society to not have the uncivilized creating victims of innocent civilians.
quote:
We only perpetuate ballooning incarceration rates because its the right thing to do, right?
It is. Murderers, thieves, rapists, con artists, etc... should not be allowed in society.
If what you want, is the end of civilization, then yes, what you advocate for is "the right thing to do". But there are rules attached to a civil society. If you can't abide by those rules, there is punishment.
You punish your kids don't you? What happesn if your kids do something wrong and are not punished?
Posted on 3/30/26 at 12:56 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
There are better questions
What is a right?
Who/what defines what a right is?
What is the comprehensive list of rights?
What erodes those concepts we reference as "rights"?
Much more important and salient questions
I'll play along. my modern moral relativist, Statist friend.
What is a right? A right is a moral claim inherent to a person's nature that defines the freedom to act without unjust interference from others, including The State.
Who/what defines what a right is? Rights are defined by human nature itself-discerned through moral reasoning-and not granted by governments or majorities. They may be instituted or crushed by governments or majorities, but they exist by the nature of our birth, and are God-given and in accordance with our nature.
What is the comprehensive list of rights? No finite "list" exists, but all rights are logically derived from the core rights to life, liberty and property. The State or any individual can deprive of of these core rights, but that is not proof of their non-existence.
What erodes those concepts we reference as "rights"? Subjective will. The power of any individual or The State can always be placed above objective moral law grounded in human nature.
Posted on 3/30/26 at 12:56 pm to 4cubbies
quote:
It's a tool for wage suppression.
I'm sure you'll ask me to explain that in detail with citations next.
This isn't Shawshank. I don't know of any prisons undercutting contractors because the prison is using free labor to get contracts. That's illegal now.
Now if you want a legitimate form of wage suppression, then i give you the illegal immigrant problem that the left created.
This post was edited on 3/30/26 at 12:58 pm
Posted on 3/30/26 at 12:58 pm to BugAC
quote:
It is. Murderers, thieves, rapists, con artists, etc... should not be allowed in society.
We only incarcerate the poor ones. (We elect the rich ones to the highest office in the country)
Most murders are not solved.
This post was edited on 3/30/26 at 1:03 pm
Posted on 3/30/26 at 12:59 pm to 4cubbies
quote:
Yes sir, I'll have that report ready for you ASAP.
Oh no everyone!! I asked for something that makes her claim true!! Blasphemy!!!
quote:
You're right. The whole penal system is a drain on society that benefits no one. That's what you want to believe, right? We only perpetuate ballooning incarceration rates because its the right thing to do, right? The only want to keep people safe? That's what the government says so it must be true.
False: it benefits what would be future victims to their perpetrators. A jailed rapist doesn't rape another parent's daughter. A murderer doesn't shoot another parent's son. And an illegal off the street doesn't shoot another college student in Chicago.
And they knew what they did was wrong. And the people who say they didn't are the people that:
quote:
lower our expectations for the strongest and dumbest members of society. They also happen to be the most powerful and most dangerous.
quote:
I'll work on that report as soon as I'm finished with your other research.
I somehow doubt that. And says the woman who is the author of thousand page threads because of the evolving narrative.
This post was edited on 3/30/26 at 1:04 pm
Posted on 3/30/26 at 1:02 pm to CleverUserName
quote:
And coming back to my point. It's not a revenue generator for the state. It's a cost to the taxpayer
If you think that Corrections Corporation of America and The GEO Group can pull in about $3.3 billion/year in profit between the two of them and our own government is not taking a share of that prior to paying them, I have other government funded programs to show you.
My original point still stands.
Historically, laws have been for two things.
Punishment and revenue.
Most times, revenue outweighs punishment.
Posted on 3/30/26 at 1:02 pm to BugAC
Incarcerated people produce over $2BB in goods and $9BB in services annually. These goods and services would otherwise be provided by employees, paid a minimum wage and/or benefits. Employers would carry insurance and other overhead costs to employ them.
Posted on 3/30/26 at 1:04 pm to CleverUserName
quote:
I somehow doubt that. And says the woman who is the author of thousand page threads because of the evolving narrative.
Men just love to be in my orbit. I can't explain it.
Posted on 3/30/26 at 1:08 pm to TulsaSooner78
quote:
There is no god.
Of all of the stupid positions a person can take, this is the stupidest.
I apologize for the divergence here, but seriously, I wonder if atheists ever really even think about what they're saying.
I think Pete Holmes says it best actually (funny how often times comedians have a way of putting things into words better than others):
The atheist position is the most ridiculous position. They will tell you that God didn't create the universe and instead nothing did. Ok, that may be true. Maybe God doesn't exist. But do you know what definitely doesn't exist? Nothing. That is literally it's defining characteristic and if your nothing one day exploded into everything, that's pretty fricking magical.
The atheist will also tell you that when you die, nothing happens. That you return to nothingness. Which means that you are re-merging with your creator. Which is heaven.
The atheist doesn't realize he is saying the same thing as the believer, just in different terms. And if you return to nothingness, by your own admission, it's just a pit stop to a new beginning.
As to the question of "rights." Everyone and every living thing is born with the desire and drive to protect its own existence. To the founders, this is why it is considered self evident that we are born with the right to life. Governments must acknowledge this if civilization is to function, for obvious reasons. From there things become a matter of obeying the commandment that you are to love your neighbor as yourself. This is again critical to the function of civilized society. Liberty and the pursuit of happiness. If these "rights" are not recognized by government or ill-intentioned men, it is only a matter of time before civilization tears itself apart and your most basic right that is given by God - the right to life - is taken away, for us all.
I think the only actual God given right we have is the right to life. The others come as a logical consequence of trying to protect that for everyone.
This post was edited on 3/30/26 at 1:30 pm
Posted on 3/30/26 at 1:10 pm to 4cubbies
quote:
We only incarcerate the poor ones.
So every person to ever get convicted and sent to prison was due to monetary status???
quote:
We elect the rich ones to the highest office in the country
Tell me which crimes Trump committed, and what the sentence is typically for against a person for someone guilty of a crime that the supposed victim asks the prosecutor not to press charges, who just so happened to run her entire re-election campaign on jailing Trump? Don't let your TDS invade this thread, it wont' work out well.
quote:
Most murders are not solved.
That really has nothing to do with one's economic status.
Posted on 3/30/26 at 1:14 pm to 4cubbies
As I read your comments in this thread Cubbies-BFF-I see you are confusing Natural Rights with the modern concept of Human Rights. Both are valid-to different degrees-but they are separate concepts.
Your arguments are needs-based, entitlement based, and dependency based. Natural Rights just are. If Natural Rights are not respected, there really is no basis for human rights. Needs-based ideas "you owe me a home" are not the same as a natural right "you cannot steal my home".
"Certain unalienable rights" are not the same thing as "I am unable to successfully compete so someone else must be compelled to provide for me".One is an expansion of Natural Rights into a category of "human rights" that is only constrained by appetite and imagination.
Your arguments are needs-based, entitlement based, and dependency based. Natural Rights just are. If Natural Rights are not respected, there really is no basis for human rights. Needs-based ideas "you owe me a home" are not the same as a natural right "you cannot steal my home".
"Certain unalienable rights" are not the same thing as "I am unable to successfully compete so someone else must be compelled to provide for me".One is an expansion of Natural Rights into a category of "human rights" that is only constrained by appetite and imagination.
Posted on 3/30/26 at 1:21 pm to UtahCajun
quote:
If you think that Corrections Corporation of America and The GEO Group can pull in about $3.3 billion/year in profit between the two of them and our own government is not taking a share of that prior to paying them, I have other government funded programs to show you. My original point still stands.
Ok, let's play a-b-c logic.
Soo the state arrests a criminal.. possibly has to pay for a public defender.. pays for the trial... then pays for incarceration of the criminal.
I'm still failing to see the revenue generation for the state.
Are these private prison corporations arresting people and holding them? Forcing them to pay to stay?
Posted on 3/30/26 at 1:23 pm to BugAC
quote:
So every person to ever get convicted and sent to prison was due to monetary status???
Are you disputing that rich people get away with their crimes?
quote:
Tell me which crimes Trump committed, and what the sentence is typically for against a person for someone guilty of a crime that the supposed victim asks the prosecutor not to press charges, who just so happened to run her entire re-election campaign on jailing Trump?
I have a growing list of research tasks that have been assigned to me in this thread so far.
Posted on 3/30/26 at 1:30 pm to Lsupimp
quote:
Your arguments are needs-based, entitlement based, and dependency based. Natural Rights just are.
quote:
.One is an expansion of Natural Rights into a category of "human rights" that is only constrained by appetite and imagination.
quote:
but they exist by the nature of our birth, and are God-given and in accordance with our nature.
quote:
What is the comprehensive list of rights? No finite "list" exists, but all rights are logically derived
Your definition and derivation are shifting as you see fit. You're all over the place...
quote:
Statist friend.
...but I'm not shocked, after that comment.
Which one of us voted for Trump and which opposed him, in large part, for his propensity for growing the state?
And don't try to debase yourself with whataboutism or emotional-based arguments built around fear.
Posted on 3/30/26 at 1:30 pm to Lsupimp
quote:
Natural Rights just are.
But in practice, these rights depend heavily on the people defining and enforcing them. People in Papua New Guinea don’t have the same rights we do, so calling them “universal” feels more theoretical than accurate.
If we're only talking about Westerners, or Americans, then those rights are Natural or Universal.
Posted on 3/30/26 at 1:32 pm to CleverUserName
Posted on 3/30/26 at 1:32 pm to 4cubbies
quote:
It's a tool for wage suppression.
Annnnnd here comes the evolving narrative. Right on cue.
And no. It's not. Not on a scale of any real relevance.
Page 10 of 21
Popular
Back to top
Follow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News