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Started By
Message
re: Trump confirmed Documents were already declassified
Posted on 8/12/22 at 5:36 pm to Bard
Posted on 8/12/22 at 5:36 pm to Bard
quote:
quote: Names of spies and nuclear secrets can be declassified? Yes. The President absolutely can. The authority for national security classifications originates entirely from the Office of the President. While the President can (and does) delegate the authority to others to classify/de-classify information, the President always retains the ultimate authority on this. So as a result the President has access to all classified information. That doesn’t mean he sees everything or knows about everything, but nothing can be kept from him because it is classified at a level he doesn’t have access to (because such a level cannot exist). You seem to be confusing the wisdom of declassifying such information with the ability to do so
^^This is not true. ^^ Some secrets are protected by statute and require additional oversight to declassify.
It’s illegal to maintain, alter or destroy ANY presidential documents. It doesn’t matter if they are classified or not. They have to be given to NARA for safekeeping. His only defense is ignorance, which will likely be his defense.
Once he leaves office, he no longer possesses the ability to declassify documents. The current POTUS could change the classification.
This post was edited on 8/12/22 at 5:37 pm
4
Posted on 8/12/22 at 5:36 pm to thebigmuffaletta
quote:
Yes, some democrat just called the Michael Berry show and said Trump stole the codes so he could threaten to launch nukes if they tried to arrest him. Also said Trump is the Antichrist.
Posted on 8/12/22 at 5:42 pm to robbykidd
quote:
^^This is not true. ^^ Some secrets are protected by statute and require additional oversight to declassify.
classified or declassified doesn't matter in this case.
Posted on 8/12/22 at 5:44 pm to AggieHank86
quote:
Except there is a memo from January 19, 2020 stating he was declassifying everything in the Crossfire Hurricane investigation that was not subjected to FISA authority.
Yes, there is a "declassification" memo of that date, addressing Crossfire Hurricane. Everything else you say is patently FALSE. The Memo "declassifies" exactly ONE BINDER of documents. Here is the Memo.
quote:
So if a Federal agency places a classification on something, the POTUS can immediately declassify it with a stroke of the pen. FACT
Absolutely no one is disputing this assertion.
OK- I haven't gotten all the way through the thread and so my comment may have been addressed, but where in constitution does it lay out formalities for declassification?
Would his earlier tweet not constitute a "stroke of a pen?"
Serious. No snarky, snark-snark.
Posted on 8/12/22 at 5:48 pm to robbykidd
quote:
^^This is not true. ^^ Some secrets are protected by statute and require additional oversight to declassify.
I have seen this argument raised per the WSJ article and this point is very debatable whether the statutory limitations would be a constitutional infringement on the (chief) executive's power. Likely, not constitutional under POTUS role as CiC charged with ultimate authority over such matters.
ETA
OK- just saw there is a whole other thread about this right now
This post was edited on 8/12/22 at 5:54 pm
Posted on 8/12/22 at 5:51 pm to robbykidd
quote:Per the affirmation by the Supreme Court in 1987, this is absolutely false. The President is not bound by any statues. The President can freely discuss Top Secret, classified information and by doing so, the information is declassified. There is no process or order involved. Classification begins and ends in the Office of the President.
^^This is not true. ^^ Some secrets are protected by statute and require additional oversight to declassify.
Read the decision yourself.
Posted on 8/12/22 at 5:55 pm to LNCHBOX
quote:
SO what are you willing to bet that anything ever comes from this?
I don’t know about the other posters but will go on record as saying i don’t think anything will come of this. Sure people will whine and such, but the feds have their records back. They will return to Trump whatever they determine is not an original government document covered by the statutes for records retention, they will keep all original government documents and classified documents, and nothing will happen to Trump.
Posted on 8/12/22 at 6:37 pm to robbykidd
quote:
^^This is not true. ^^
Wrong, it is completely true.
quote:
Some secrets are protected by statute and require additional oversight to declassify.
For anything classified under the Executive Branch, this is completely false. The President's authority for classifying/de-classifying comes directly from Article II, § 2 of the US Constitution. There is no statute which overrides Constitutional authority.
Feel free to post a link to any law stating that a statute can overrules the Constitution, I would be fascinated to understand exactly how this can exist.
quote:
It’s illegal to maintain, alter or destroy ANY presidential documents.
That's not a completely true statement.
A sitting President, by definition, has to maintain Presidential documents.
A former President MAY maintain Presidential documents (see: pretty much every President who has created a Presidential Library after leaving office). This is accomplished by an agreement with NARA (see: Obama, for example).
Finally, this quote has absolutely nothing to do with a sitting President classifying/de-classifying information. By de-classifying something they aren't "altering" Presidential documents in any manner which violates NARA (otherwise nothing could ever have its classification changed, whether increased or decreased).
quote:
They have to be given to NARA for safekeeping. His only defense is ignorance, which will likely be his defense.
Once he leaves office, he no longer possesses the ability to declassify documents. The current POTUS could change the classification.
This is a diversion to a different topic. You stated a President cannot declassify things like nuclear codes or agent identities. The implication, of course, is a sitting President. No one would argue (and I'm certainly not arguing) a former President has such authority.
Department of the Navy vs. Egan
quote:
The President, after all, is the "Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States." U.S.Const., Art. II, § 2. His authority to classify and control access to information bearing on national security and to determine whether an individual is sufficiently trustworthy to occupy a position in the Executive Branch that will give that person access to such information flows primarily from this constitutional investment of power in the President, and exists quite apart from any explicit congressional grant.
Constitutionally granted authority which can't be superseded legislatively.
quote:
Presidents, in a series of Executive Orders, have sought to protect sensitive information and to ensure its proper classification throughout the Executive Branch by delegating this responsibility to the heads of agencies.
Delegating authority is not abdicating it, it's the sharing of some extent of it. This is why the President is the ultimate authority in deciding what is/isn't classified.
This post was edited on 8/12/22 at 6:40 pm
Posted on 8/12/22 at 7:01 pm to GRTiger
quote:
The other part of this that makes no sense is do people really think the former president can just waltz out of the white house with nuclear codes? I understand that is an intentional lie put out there, but people are actually believing it?
The “nuclear code” are not even on paper. the codes needed to order a nuclear strike are in a sealed “tamper proof” cartridge. Meaning they can not be looked at without leaving evidence the cartridge was tampered with, also the codes are changed constantly.making something from two years ago useless. There are also biometrics incorporated to assure the person using the code is actually the president.
Posted on 8/12/22 at 8:59 pm to RazorBroncs
Well common sense would suggest I’m replying to the handle on link
Posted on 8/12/22 at 9:04 pm to Tiger_Claw
Ex-husband pulled a Michael Scott on me. "We Are Divorced! (If you don't let me move back into your house this instant!)" Um, no sweetie, here let me file that for you.
Posted on 8/12/22 at 9:05 pm to AggieHank86
Well that eliminates you because you are not wise and dumb as frick
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