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re: Stolen from OT. St George submits petition.

Posted on 10/21/14 at 7:01 pm to
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
35938 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 7:01 pm to
But the total amt . Of taxes will grow for those leaving the SG fire district into the city.

Property owners being annexed will pay city property taxes of
13.12 mills plus CATS tax of 10 mills
They will no longer pay SG fire district taxes of 14 mills

The net add is 9.12 mills.
Posted by LSURussian
Member since Feb 2005
126962 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 7:03 pm to
quote:

If Baton Rouge benefits, then who suffers?
Nobody has to suffer unless there are two cities competing for the same revenues and resources instead of a consolidated city/parish government.
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
35938 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 7:12 pm to
The BRPD doesn't patrol in my neighborhood nor does BRFD cover my home, and I don't expect them to. I don't pay property taxes to either entity as BR city dwellers do. That's how that should work.

We all pay taxes to support the sheriff who patrols the entire parish (some areas more than others), operates the parish prison, collects taxes, served subpoenas etc.
Non city dwellers should pay more for the patrols, and just for the patrols and district stations.

We pay for our own fire already. BR pays taxes for theirs and we pay taxes for ours.

And people in unincorporated do not get the same services as city people do because of the distances. That is understood.

All I want to know are we subsidizing city services ? No one had said we are not.
Posted by Asgard Device
The Daedalus
Member since Apr 2011
11562 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 7:17 pm to
quote:

Posted by doubleb
The BRPD doesn't patrol in my neighborhood nor does BRFD cover my home, and I don't expect them to. I don't pay property taxes to either entity as BR city dwellers do. That's how that should work.

We all pay taxes to support the sheriff who patrols the entire parish


Again, the whole parish pays for and receives police protection. EBRSO generally does not patrol or respond to calls within the city of BR. The city of BR pays the same dedicated taxes to EBRSO that we do in unincorporated areas.

Again, it's semantics. You could consolidate the police forces and the city will still use more police presence, for obvious reasons.
This post was edited on 10/21/14 at 7:18 pm
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
35938 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 7:17 pm to
[quote]Nobody has to suffer unless there are two cities competing for the same revenues and resources instead of a consolidated city/parish government. [/quote

Nobody is suffering now. That is the wrong term. The question is how taxes are being spent. I do realize you can not have a strong city unless you have a strong police and fire departments, and an urban center has to support more govt. For that reason.

But I do believe the urban center has advantages too, and should pay more for parish services than 10% or so when it makes up 50% of the population.
Posted by LSURussian
Member since Feb 2005
126962 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 7:19 pm to
quote:

All I want to know are we subsidizing city services ? No one had said we are not.
quote:

Metro Councilman Joel Boé, whose district lies inside what would become St. George, says he doesn't think his constituents have been slighted by the city-parish. He says DPW is responsive, and says if anything, his area got more than its fair share of Green Light Plan spending.

Holden says $322 million in Green Light Plan funds collected parishwide were spent on the area's infrastructure.

LINK
Posted by LSURussian
Member since Feb 2005
126962 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 7:19 pm to
quote:

But I do believe the urban center has advantages too, and should pay more for parish services than 10% or so when it makes up 50% of the population.
Faux numbers.
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
35938 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 7:22 pm to
quote:

Again, the whole parish pays for and receives police protection. EBRSO generally does not patrol or respond to calls within the city of BR. The city of BR pays the same dedicated taxes to EBRSO that we do in unincorporated areas.

Again, it's semantics. You could consolidate the police forces and the city will still use more police presence, for obvious reasons.


The whole parish does not receive BRPD protection, but does receive more sheriff's protection. Consequently, we should pay more for this service. But the sheriff does other things besides patrol and everyone in the parish should pay equally for that.
Posted by cssamerican
Member since Mar 2011
7111 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 7:26 pm to
This started because of the desire to start a separate school system. I am surprised to find out the main argument now is about City/Parish allocation of resources. This was a non-issue a year ago!

Politics and a marketing campaign can do more than I thought in a year's time.
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
35938 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 7:27 pm to
I do not think we've been mistreated by DPW or in the Green Light Plan.

The question I have is are we paying for city services that we do not receive.

I receive services from DPW and I pay taxes and fees for those services.

I pay sales taxes to the Green Light plan which has been very fair to unincorporated areas and city areas.
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
35938 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 7:30 pm to
If the numbers are wrong then fine, if the city pays 40-45% and the unincorporated pays 55-60% I'm finevwith that.

It can't be 50/50 and work.
Posted by LSURussian
Member since Feb 2005
126962 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 7:35 pm to
quote:

The question I have is are we paying for city services that we do not receive.
When people from the St George area work in downtown are they not covered by the BRPD and the BRFD? Or when they go to LSU events? Or go downtown for the July 4th fireworks?

BRPD protects people not geography.

This entire "nobody likes us, everybody hates us, I'm gonna eat some worms" bull shite is straight out of kindergarten.

We know that the CATS tax is paid exclusively by city property owners yet the CATS bus service covers parts of the unincorporated areas of the parish. If anybody should be pissed it should be us city property owners.

And Poodle's numbers are incorrect. I have no idea how he came up with those numbers. For a CPA he sure can't communicate numbers very well.
Posted by LSURussian
Member since Feb 2005
126962 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 7:36 pm to
quote:

If the numbers are wrong then fine, if the city pays 40-45% and the unincorporated pays 55-60% I'm finevwith that.

It can't be 50/50 and work.

Posted by Asgard Device
The Daedalus
Member since Apr 2011
11562 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 7:50 pm to
quote:

The whole parish does not receive BRPD protection, but does receive more sheriff's protection. Consequently, we should pay more for this service. But the sheriff does other things besides patrol and everyone in the parish should pay equally for that.


Good grief. EBRSO does not patrol the city of Baton Rouge. For it to be fair (according to you), they should abolish the BRPD and make EBRSO patrol the city of Baton Rouge.

You don't think the EBRSO would need to collect more taxes from the entire parish in order to accomplish this? BRPD is basically staff augmentation for the city of baton rouge.

Answer this: Do you support the consolidation of BRPD and EBRSO?
Posted by Poodlebrain
Way Right of Rex
Member since Jan 2004
19860 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 7:56 pm to
quote:

Do more people commute from the city out to the parish for work or is it the other way around?
What revenue do either Baton Rouge or East Baton Rouge Parish derive from labor? Do the employers pay income tax? They do pay for occupational licenses based on their revenues. If the employees commuting into Baton Rouge help produce higher revenues then they are contributing to the city's revenue.

quote:

Should the city set up toll booths for those commuters coming into the city from the parish to work every day?
Absolutely, and those toll booths should collect from non-residents of the parish too. I think the city and parish should impose an income tax while they are at it. And why not a tax on accumulated wealth too. Heaven knows the people on the Metro Council would spend the money more wisely than the people who earned it.
quote:

Do you see how silly and parochial your entire argument is?
About as silly as yours. At least mine has an underlying rationale that makes sense. If you take something away from people they are going to be worse off. And in this case those people are the parish residents who live outside the Baton ?Rouge city limits.
Posted by LSURussian
Member since Feb 2005
126962 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 7:57 pm to
I give up on you and I only read the first sentence of your latest post. You totally miss points and then argue about ridiculous things.
This post was edited on 10/21/14 at 7:59 pm
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
35938 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 7:57 pm to
I accept the fact the city is an asset and we should offset some of the services for thst reason.

I never thought 50/50 was workable but I thought 10/90 to be unfair.
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
35938 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 7:58 pm to
I am big on a unified parish police force, it would be far more efficient. The system we have now isn't good.

You?
Posted by Asgard Device
The Daedalus
Member since Apr 2011
11562 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 8:04 pm to
quote:

I am big on a unified parish police force, it would be far more efficient. The system we have now isn't good.

You?


I'm torn on it. I think it would be more efficient and there obviously would be less confusion and bullshite about who's funding what and paying their "fair share."

I don't know. Sheriffs are political beasts and aren't subject to nepotism and hiring rules that most city police forces are. Their cops are basically political appointees, they can promote whomever they want even if they aren't qualified, and don't have to have any real standards. They get paid by the state to imprison people which isn't really in our best interests.

It's no coincidence that the same people that want break away districts also want to consolidate the police forces. It's all about which move gets them the most power.

It's honestly a tough call because I think the efficiencies and de-duplication of services could be beneficial to the area, but on the other hand, I also value freedom, ethics, and having standards.
This post was edited on 10/21/14 at 8:19 pm
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
35938 posts
Posted on 10/21/14 at 8:16 pm to
The current system fosters two corrupt operations, one is all we need.

Let the mayor police the parish, the sheriff can guard the jail, collect taxes, and deliver subpoenas.
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