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Started By
Message
re: Shouldn’t “preemptive’ pardons be unconstitutional?
Posted on 1/20/25 at 2:29 pm to Willie Stroker
Posted on 1/20/25 at 2:29 pm to Willie Stroker
quote:
If my recollection of high school history is accurate, we had a President named Ford who preemptively pardoned a President named Nixon. To my knowledge no legal scholar ever seriously considered it worth filing a legal challenge against it.
the SCOTUS first addressed preemptive pardons in Ex parte Garland (1866) and then in United States v. Klein (1871). Both dealt with pardons that were given to southerners after the Civil War. The SCOTUS made it pretty damn clear so no one has ever really considered bring this issue to the court again. Prior to Biden the past couple of months, the only other times it has happened was when Ford pardoned Nixon and then when HW Bush pardoned 6 people involved in the Iran-Contra affair. I guess Jimmy Carter also had a "ceremonial" blanket pardon to draft dodgers for Vietnam.
No one has challenged it largely because it hasn't happened much since the civil war. I can tell you this much, no one as EVER gone to the lengths of Joe Biden. Basically anyone involved with him or his administration the past 4 years has been pardoned. Pretty wild.
Honestly, if I'm Congress I start subpoenaing these people to testify. They can't plead the 5th anymore
This post was edited on 1/20/25 at 2:57 pm
0
Posted on 1/20/25 at 2:33 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Uh...if the crime was already committed, how is it "preemptive"?
If there is no criminal charge, is there a crime? If so, why are uncharged crimes not included in the statutory language?
If there is no criminal charge, where does it mention in the statutory language any reference to behavior?
Posted on 1/20/25 at 2:37 pm to Geekboy
Oh man! This has been discussed ad nauseum here.
From the many pages of discussion, it appears that this has been done before and SCOTUS has ruled on it, BUT that if presented again there is a good chance SCOTUS could rule favorably.
Without citing pages of past rulings, is this accurate? Paging the PT's self proclaimed legal experts!
From the many pages of discussion, it appears that this has been done before and SCOTUS has ruled on it, BUT that if presented again there is a good chance SCOTUS could rule favorably.
Without citing pages of past rulings, is this accurate? Paging the PT's self proclaimed legal experts!
Posted on 1/20/25 at 2:56 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
the crime was already committed
At least you're catching on now.
Posted on 1/20/25 at 3:01 pm to RoyalWe
Its too great a day to respond to that miserable sack of shite
Posted on 1/20/25 at 3:48 pm to Geekboy
Posted on 1/20/25 at 4:12 pm to lake chuck fan
quote:
Oh man! This has been discussed ad nauseum here.
From the many pages of discussion, it appears that this has been done before and SCOTUS has ruled on it, BUT that if presented again there is a good chance SCOTUS could rule favorably.
Without citing pages of past rulings, is this accurate? Paging the PT's self proclaimed legal experts!
There isn't any indication the current USSC would rule differently, but otherwise correct.
Posted on 1/20/25 at 4:13 pm to JellyRoll
quote:
At least you're catching on now.
I was responding to OP's hypothetical only
Posted on 1/20/25 at 4:14 pm to Geekboy
Have any pardons similar to these ever been challenged in court?
Posted on 1/20/25 at 6:10 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Wouldn't you want an option to incentivize specifically not doing this?
Options on that are good. Let's discuss. What have you got in mind?
Posted on 1/21/25 at 3:44 am to JellyRoll
quote:
At least you're catching on now.
He's not. He's a moron.
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