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re: Satanists seek spot next to Ten Commandments monument on steps of OK's Statehous
Posted on 1/8/14 at 1:42 am to JazzyJeff
Posted on 1/8/14 at 1:42 am to JazzyJeff
quote:
No I'm not. And it is the absurd doctrine that the torture and death of Christ was made in order to appease an angry God that is creating Atheists by the droves.
Absurd doctrine? Apparently the bible is absurd to you? This is why the doctrine is absurd to you and Athiests
1 Corinthians 1:18. For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.
Do you know what took place on that cross on Calvary, a bloody sacrifice.
This post was edited on 1/8/14 at 1:48 am
3
Posted on 1/8/14 at 1:50 am to Revelator
quote:I'm simply telling you what the crucifixion of Christ was NOT.
Absurd doctrine? Apparently the bible is absurd to you?
And because I point out that your fundamentalist personal interpretation of the scripture does not square with Christian theology, does not mean I think scripture is absurd.
What IS absurd though, (and sad) is how fundamentalist Christians have turned God into a monster, and the bible into a joke.
Posted on 1/8/14 at 1:55 am to JazzyJeff
quote:
I'm simply telling you what the crucifixion of Christ was NOT. And because I point out that your fundamentalist personal interpretation of the scripture does not square with Christian theology, does not mean I think scripture is absurd. What IS absurd though, (and sad) is how fundamentalist Christians have turned God into a monster, and the bible into a joke.
I would appreciate it if you enlightened me and other Christians what the crucifixion of Christ was about then, because apparently mainline Christianity has had it wrong for thousands of years.
This post was edited on 1/8/14 at 1:56 am
Posted on 1/8/14 at 2:34 am to Revelator
quote:Jesus voluntarily accepted death in order to destroy it. He wasn't "punished" for us, but died to unite himself to mankind. He died for us and took on the weight and consequence of our sin (which is death), but not in order to appease an angry father, but rather to destroy death and reunite human flesh with the energies of God in his person.
I would appreciate it if you enlightened me and other Christians what the crucifixion of Christ was about then, because apparently mainline Christianity has had it wrong for thousands of years.
The Catholic and Protestant idea that God is angry and needed his son to die on a cross for us is complete non-sense.
Posted on 1/8/14 at 2:44 am to JazzyJeff
quote:
Jesus voluntarily accepted death in order to destroy it. He wasn't "punished" for us, but died to unite himself to mankind. He died for us and took on the weight and consequence of our sin (which is death), but not in order to appease an angry father, but rather to destroy death and reunite human flesh with the energies of God in his person.
I don't disagree with most of this, nor would most Christians, but God does have a side that exhibits wrath as well as love and he is angry towards sin. Those who only choose to focus on God's attributes of love are just as bad as those who neglect his attributes of righteous anger.
Isaiah 53:5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.
6All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
7He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth...
10 Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put [him] to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin
This post was edited on 1/8/14 at 3:00 am
Posted on 1/8/14 at 3:08 am to Revelator
quote:Having righteous anger and requiring a blood sacrifice from your own son are two completely different things.
I don't disagree with most of this, nor would most Christians, but God does have a side that exhibits wrath as well as love and he is angry towards sin. Those who only choose to focus on God's attributes of love are just as bad as those who neglect his attributes of righteous anger.
The angry, wrathful God who will throw the mass of humanity in hell is not Christianity.
Posted on 1/8/14 at 3:48 am to JazzyJeff
quote:
The angry, wrathful God who will throw the mass of humanity in hell is not Christianity.
Apparently Jesus disagrees with you;
Matthew 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide [is] the gate, and broad [is] the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14 Because strait [is] the gate, and narrow [is] the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
I've provided you scripture after scripture to illustrate my position, and so far, you've given me nothing but your opinion and no real reason why you believe what you do.
This post was edited on 1/8/14 at 4:05 am
Posted on 1/8/14 at 5:59 am to Revelator
Wow. This thread's still here.
Good on y'all.
Good on y'all.
Posted on 1/8/14 at 7:10 am to Revelator
quote:Why do you quote out of the old testament to come up with an example of god's wrath? Why would anyone argue about the ten commandments? We as christians don't live by them. I say if the satanists want to put something up, by all means put it up. The hue and cry from so-called christians would make it worth it. The worst part about being christian is the company you have to keep. Ignorant scripture spewing christians are insufferable and they make us all look bad.
Isaiah 53:5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.
Posted on 1/8/14 at 7:45 am to bencoleman
quote:What are the Ten Commandments?
Why would anyone argue about the ten commandments?
Not a trick question.
What are they, in your estimation?
Why do likenesses of the Ten Commandments, as opposed to Jesus on the cross, appear in so many US legal/governmental venues?
Posted on 1/8/14 at 8:18 am to JazzyJeff
quote:
Jesus voluntarily accepted death in order to destroy it. He wasn't "punished" for us, but died to unite himself to mankind. He died for us and took on the weight and consequence of our sin (which is death), but not in order to appease an angry father, but rather to destroy death and reunite human flesh with the energies of God in his person.
This is how I have always viewed it. Related to this somewhat is a recent "scandal" involving the Presbyterian church (that I'm not a part of). Whoever is in authority over such things with that church wanted to include the song "In Christ Alone" in their updated hymnals, but requested a change in the lyric "till on the cross, as Jesus died, the wrath of God was satisfied" since this particular denomination holds closer to the view you expressed. The request was ultimately denied by the author of the song, but your assertion that
quote:
The Catholic and Protestant idea that God is angry and needed his son to die on a cross for us is complete non-sense
is misguided. Not all protestants feel that way.
Posted on 1/8/14 at 8:28 am to NC_Tigah
They are nothing unless you place some sort of historical value on them.
Posted on 1/8/14 at 8:30 am to bencoleman
quote:You don't?
They are nothing unless you place some sort of historical value on them.
Posted on 1/8/14 at 8:32 am to bencoleman
quote:
They are nothing unless you place some sort of historical value on them.
Even if you don't believe that Moses was personally given the ten commandments by God on Mount Sinai, you cannot deny the historical value of them.
Posted on 1/8/14 at 8:45 am to Revelator
quote:
I don't think an all powerful God would be intimidated by anyone having questions or wanting to know why things happen. I just don't think anyone will receive all the answers in this lifetime. I also don't appreciate the tone from this board that implies that all Christians are basically illiterate hillbillies that just sit in a pew and accept everything their pastors say. Christians are like any other group represented in society. Some are smarter than others and some have better reasoning and logic skills. I have lots of Christian friends that are very well read individuals and ponder many deep things about the universe, life and death. We all have questions.
Well said.
Posted on 1/8/14 at 9:00 am to bencoleman
quote:
Why do you quote out of the old testament to come up with an example of god's wrath? Why would anyone argue about the ten commandments? We as christians don't live by them. I say if the satanists want to put something up, by all means put it up. The hue and cry from so-called christians would make it worth it. The worst part about being christian is the company you have to keep. Ignorant scripture spewing christians are insufferable and they make us all look bad.
Tell me about your Christian faith. What do you believe as a Christian?
Posted on 1/8/14 at 9:55 am to JazzyJeff
quote:
The angry, wrathful God who will throw the mass of humanity in hell is not Christianity.
Correct but I'd disagree that God exhibits righteous anger. God is a perfect being. Anger, be it righteous or otherwise, like jealousy, is a human frailty of which God does not have.
People like Rev are like natives in the jungle or Pat Robertson who believe hurricanes and other natural disasters are God's wrath for human sin. Their minds are not developed enough to comprehend science or for that matter the truly perfect God. They project their own shortcomings on God and irrationally deduce that anything bad that happens must be because God is angry. We must sacrifice like the Jews did at the temple at the time of Christ or the natives did in Fiji.
Posted on 1/8/14 at 10:01 am to Revelator
quote:
1 Corinthians 1:18. For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.
1 Corinthians 14:34 35
quote:
Women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the law says. If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church.
Do you allow your wife to speak at church?
Posted on 1/8/14 at 10:06 am to Vegas Bengal
quote:
God is a perfect being. Anger, be it righteous or otherwise, like jealousy, is a human frailty of which God does not have.
What...
You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth. 5"You shall not worship them or serve them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children, on the third and the fourth generations of those who hate Me, 6but showing lovingkindness to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.
so basically you were wrong and not only is God jealous but he is vindictive.
perfect being....too funny
apparently God also lacks foresight and has regrets and is also Genocidal and then later watches some incestual lovin and then directs the Israelites to slaughter, rape and take slaves
hen the LORD saw that the wickedness of man was great on the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. 6The LORD was sorry that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved in His heart. 7The LORD said, "I will blot out man whom I have created from the face of the land, from man to animals to creeping things and to birds of the sky; for I am sorry that I have made them."
nope that cant be this is a perfect being
Posted on 1/8/14 at 10:55 am to Cruiserhog
quote:Yet another antitheist losing on points related to an OP, then changing the dialogue to attack Christians in an unwinnable but unlosable argument.
What...
You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth. 5"You shall not worship them or serve them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children, on the third and the fourth generations of those who hate Me, 6but showing lovingkindness to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.
so basically you were wrong and not only is God jealous but he is vindictive.
perfect being....too funny
apparently God also lacks foresight and has regrets and is also Genocidal and then later watches some incestual lovin and then directs the Israelites to slaughter, rape and take slaves
hen the LORD saw that the wickedness of man was great on the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. 6The LORD was sorry that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved in His heart. 7The LORD said, "I will blot out man whom I have created from the face of the land, from man to animals to creeping things and to birds of the sky; for I am sorry that I have made them."
nope that cant be this is a perfect being
Well done.
It's like switching from Chess to Tic-Tac-Toe. You might get your arse kicked in chess, but in tic-tac-toe you can always manage a tie.
Nice switch.
This post was edited on 1/8/14 at 10:57 am
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