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Expelled Amherst student not allowed to subpoena phone records in civil suit

Posted on 1/31/17 at 1:56 pm
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476663 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 1:56 pm
becuase it would traumatize the alleged victim

quote:

Remember Amherst College student "John Doe," who was expelled for sexual misconduct, even though he had good reason to believe that his accuser had actually assaulted him? A judge recently blocked Doe's attempt to subpoena his female accuser's text messages on grounds that re-litigating the matter "would impose emotional and psychological trauma" on her.

Consider the implications of this decision. According to Seattle District Judge James Robart, a student who believes Amherst violated his due process rights, wrongfully expelled him, and ignored subsequent evidence that his accuser, "Sandra Jones," was the actual violator of the college's sexual misconduct policies, does not deserve the opportunity to make his case because someone else's feelings are more important.


quote:

But Jones was blackout drunk at the time—a detail that Amherst administrators deemed "credible," on subsequent review. Of course, it's questionable whether a blackout drunk student can actually provide the level of consent that Amherst's sexual misconduct policy requires.

Other factors cast doubt on the idea that Jones was the victim and Doe the perpetrator. After leaving Doe's dorm room, Jones texted another male student and asked him to come to her dorm room for sex. She also texted a residential advisor about her "stupid" decision to engage in sexual activity with her roommate's boyfriend. In these text messages, Jones admitted that she was "not an innocent bystander." She also complained about how long it was taking this second male student to do anything sexual with her. She did not file a complaint against Doe until two years later.


#ThisIsWhyWeMarch
Posted by UGATiger26
Jacksonville, FL
Member since Dec 2009
9128 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 1:59 pm to
quote:

Other factors cast doubt on the idea that Jones was the victim and Doe the perpetrator. After leaving Doe's dorm room, Jones texted another male student and asked him to come to her dorm room for sex. She also texted a residential advisor about her "stupid" decision to engage in sexual activity with her roommate's boyfriend. In these text messages, Jones admitted that she was "not an innocent bystander." She also complained about how long it was taking this second male student to do anything sexual with her. She did not file a complaint against Doe until two years later.


Holy shite. How is this even a case?

Are university administrators bound by law to act like dumbasses the moment a female says the word "rape?"
Posted by Fun Bunch
New Orleans
Member since May 2008
130250 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 2:00 pm to
Yes, I am sure the higher courts will see it that way.

What utter bullshite. Scary shite.
Posted by Fun Bunch
New Orleans
Member since May 2008
130250 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 2:00 pm to
Pretty much, yeah.
Posted by Jbird
Shoot the tires out!
Member since Oct 2012
90587 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 2:01 pm to
#Heisawhiteguysoheisguiltyamirite
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476663 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 2:01 pm to
quote:

Are university administrators bound by law to act like dumbasses the moment a female says the word "rape?"

actually, yes

and i don't typically call out Obama, but the Title 9 bullshite his admin pushed on colleges is all on his shoulders

this is one of the legit "Thanks, Obmaa" situations
Posted by Salmon
I helped draft the email
Member since Feb 2008
86180 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 2:01 pm to
quote:

Consider the implications of this decision. According to Seattle District Judge James Robart, a student who believes Amherst violated his due process rights, wrongfully expelled him, and ignored subsequent evidence that his accuser, "Sandra Jones," was the actual violator of the college's sexual misconduct policies, does not deserve the opportunity to make his case because someone else's feelings are more important.


this is the type of shite that would get me to march
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476663 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 2:02 pm to
quote:

Yes, I am sure the higher courts will see it that way.

What utter bullshite. Scary shite.

i mean there may be some state law about this, but the solution to that issue is that he names her directly in the suit. once she's a party, i'm sure this protection will be lost (assuming it's legit in the first place). that's going to do a lot for victim's rights (as the article points out)
Posted by Kino74
Denham springs
Member since Nov 2013
5360 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 2:03 pm to
quote:

A judge recently blocked Doe's attempt to subpoena his female accuser's text messages on grounds that re-litigating the matter "would impose emotional and psychological trauma" on her.


The judge needs a new day job.
This post was edited on 1/31/17 at 2:06 pm
Posted by Oddibe
Close to some, further from others
Member since Sep 2015
6749 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 2:04 pm to
The girl is a whore who doesn't want to embarrassed for being a whore even though she had sex regret with John Doe?
Posted by UGATiger26
Jacksonville, FL
Member since Dec 2009
9128 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 2:04 pm to
quote:

Of course, it's questionable whether a blackout drunk student can actually provide the level of consent that Amherst's sexual misconduct policy requires.


Of course, it's questionable that any policy which stipulates that certain levels of inebriation preclude consent are bullshite.

Who decides if the person is too impaired? The man? The woman? When is the line crossed from impaired to "too impaired?" After all, we wouldn't want to restrain the sexual rights and freedoms of strong, independent women, would we?

What liability does the female have if she verbally and physically consents while impaired? None at all?

Just a bunch of make-it-up-as-you-go bullshite.
This post was edited on 1/31/17 at 2:06 pm
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476663 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 2:04 pm to
the progressive march to erode due process is really scary

this shite is probably the #1 area, but they also want to do it with LEO

with how marginalized groups have perilously limited DP rights as is, i really don't think they get the big picture
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476663 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 2:06 pm to
the problem in this case is that it shows the skewed, misandrist notions of consent

blackout drunk and you get a blowjob from a drunk girl? not rape by the person who gave the blowjob b/c you're a man

...but it's sexual assault by the person who is blacked out and received the blowjob?
Posted by NYNolaguy1
Member since May 2011
21764 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 2:06 pm to
Appeal that shite with a quickness.

The ACLU should take up this case- its not like they dont have the funding now
Posted by DownSouthJukin
1x tRant Poster of the Millennium
Member since Jan 2014
31776 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 2:07 pm to
quote:

but the Title 9 bullshite his admin pushed on colleges is all on his shoulders


This.
Posted by biglego
San Francisco
Member since Nov 2007
84713 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 2:07 pm to
It is terrifying how easy it is for a woman to ruin a man by crying rape. Men need body cameras. I'd also never date a girl who already has kids bc kids can cry rape too. It takes zero actual evidence.
Posted by udtiger
Over your left shoulder
Member since Nov 2006
115422 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 2:07 pm to
quote:

the progressive march to erode due process is really scary


Funny...because they seem all about due process for foreigners and refugees
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
476663 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 2:10 pm to
quote:

It is terrifying how easy it is for a woman to ruin a man by crying rape.

the entire policy behind this shift to campus adjudication is to make it easier on the alleged victim and to give a forum for investigation without constitutionally-protected due process (that the accused would receive in a criminal case)

that is not a conspiracy theory. that's the stated reason for this policy shift and these on campus kangaroo courts
Posted by DownSouthJukin
1x tRant Poster of the Millennium
Member since Jan 2014
31776 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 2:11 pm to
quote:

that is not a conspiracy theory. that's the stated reason for this policy shift and these on campus kangaroo courts


Any man that steps into a Title IX situation without a lawyer is an idiot.
Posted by udtiger
Over your left shoulder
Member since Nov 2006
115422 posts
Posted on 1/31/17 at 2:11 pm to
quote:

the entire policy behind this shift to campus adjudication is to make it easier on the alleged victim and to give a forum for investigation without constitutionally-protected due process (that the accused would receive in a criminal case)

that is not a conspiracy theory. that's the stated reason for this policy shift and these on campus kangaroo courts


I fully expect this shite to be the subject of an EO and DOJ guidance within the next 60 days.
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